Life today in the car biz, and why GOOD mechanics hate it now: the real truth

[sfhess]

Last year I had to replace, among other things, a radiator hose fitting on the side of the engine block in a 2015 VW Jetta TDI wagon that belongs to a friend of mine.  Besides being very difficult to access the part, a replacement from a national auto parts chain would not go into the hole in the block.  After spending several hours trying to get it to go in, my friend and I decided that the fitting was too big by a tiny amount to fit into the hole.  We purchased another fitting from a different chain store and it went right in.

First-generation Ford Focus replacement rear brake drums come with the roller bearings already installed.  The rear spindles are tapered.  If the bearings are not installed in the drums properly, they will go part way on the spindle, then jam into place.  Removing the drum in this case will destroy the bearing.  One time, I took a rear spindle I got from a wrecking yard to take to the store to check.  I think I found a properly-installed bearing on the third drum I tested.

When purchasing a starter or alternator, I will not leave the store without having it tested. ( I had to R&R the alternator in my old 94 Astro twice.  Not fun)

[Dragline]

When I was a daily mechanic I had an Audi 4000S in the shop. Typical Bosch alternator in place. It was low and not energizing every time so it was on the way out. I call Foreign Auto Parts for a replacement. First one won't energize. Second one would, but the bearing was so noisy I was afraid it was going to blow up in my face. 2rd time is a charm right? Wrong.... It took 4 until I got a good one. So 3 or 4 hours to replace an alternator. I had rolled it outside after the 2nd one. I am Bosch certified up to 98. That means electrical and fuel mostly. I e had a few bad fuel pumps over the years also. K Jetronic fuel systems require robust pumps to make them function properly. Measuring pressure at the rail is at times 120 lbs for certain motors. Benz always uses Bosch pumps. At one time the pumps were 100% good and I would install them without hesitation. In the latter years of my wrenching I would have them tested before they were even sent. FAP would test if you asked.

[Ace-Garageguy]

I really appreciate you guys who were or are in the business, and have had to deal with this in real life, chiming in.

Years ago when I first began mentioning the problem of deteriorating parts quality, particularly stuff not made in the USA, I was routinely shouted down by "experts" who said it must be due to my incompetence, or that I was making things up for attention, and was even repeatedly called the dreaded "r-word" if I specifically mentioned the country of origin of said garbage parts.

While I acknowledge that there are indeed good quality replacement parts available, even some manufactured in China, it's become a roll-of-the-dice whenever I or anyone in the two shops I subcontract to buys any kind of part for anything...even from previously trustworthy sources who have apparently not been doing any ongoing QC with the stuff that comes out of a container.

"Made in USA" is no longer the semi-guarantee of quality it once was, and poor availability of many crash and mechanical parts from the OEMs through their dealers kinda makes the point moot anyway.

Problems don't go away if nobody mentions them, or pretends they don't exist.

So maybe, hopefully, the prevalence of this topic now on YT and other platforms will wake some people up.

[ksnow]

Long story here, bear with me. By far the most messed up corporate buy back I ever had to deal with.

Buick LaCrosse, 2008ish, I don't recall exactly. Dealer I worked at bought it at auction with 3k miles. GM buyback, for a tick noise with the engine (3.6VVT) running. Vehicle history had a fly wheel replace at 1,500 miles, and a flywheel and torque convertor at 3k.

We sold it to a local, it cam in for the 6k oil change, and yep, a tick noise. Popped off the little plastic cover between the oil pan and trans. There was marker writing on the flywheel, "will crack here" with an arrow. The arrow pointed to the web between the large holes in the flywheel. Call in to GM, advised to replace flywheel ONLY, great. Replace the flywheel and ship it.

Car comes back with 7k, and a tick. Call GM again. Flywheel and torque converter. Seriously? Okay, more fun. Flywheel was cracked in the exact same spots.

Lady who bought the car trades it in, and we put it in our loaner fleet. 10k miles, we sell it again, and its ticking, again. Call GM. Flywheel and transmission. Well, at least we are trying something new here. Make those replacements and ship it.

13k, yep, you guessed it, ticking again. GM: we'll send an engineer to look at it, Have the cradle down, and engine pulled separate from trans. Tie up a stall for 4 days, waiting for the "engineer".

Engineer gets there, looks at the engine for a minute and says yep, we'll put a new engine in. Apparently, some of the blocks were machined with the crank bore at an angle to the centerline. This caused the flywheel to flex and crack. Here's the best part. GM had NO way to tell me if the complete engine I was dropping in had a good block or a bad block. The engineer said its about a 60-40 chance its good.

Well, it was good, thankfully.

Threads like this make me really happy I chose a career change.

[Dragline]

These stories would be frightening if they were fiction. I am looking to retire and the local Chevrolet dealership has a counter spot available. I threw my paper at em and got a call. I go in a couple of days and see what they offer. I know it'll be a slight slap and not a punch to the gut, and I also know the place will be reasonably quiet and non pressure. Up my alley if the dough is right. 

I'll even get a nice discount for parts for my Impala. It's been without incident for a longer time than I expected. So I expect incident relatively soon.

Between all who.post here I'll wager we could keep telling these stories ad nauseum.  I know that as I respond or think on things old stuff just pops up in the old memory box. Some real corkers too. Makes me sad though. After all that time doing something I enjoyed, that even with all the bad/dumb stuff that happened I still find myself with rather fond memories. Seems like the good times outweighed the bad for the most part. I'm not such a cynic these days. Perhaps it's rose colored glasses...

[Ace-Garageguy]

20 minutes ago, Dragline said:

...Between all who.post here I'll wager we could keep telling these stories ad nauseum.  I know that as I respond or think on things old stuff just pops up in the old memory box. Some real corkers too. Makes me sad though. After all that time doing something I enjoyed, that even with all the bad/dumb stuff that happened I still find myself with rather fond memories. Seems like the good times outweighed the bad for the most part. I'm not such a cynic these days. Perhaps it's rose colored glasses...

Agreed 100%. 

All in all it's been a good life, with tremendous opportunities for growth, developing a problem-solving, self-reliant mindset, and it's given me access to unobtainable cars and up-close-and-personal involvement in several types of motorsport.

But we're seeing the end of an era, and we as a technological culture will be poorer for its loss.

[stavanzer]

12 hours ago, ksnow said:

Threads like this make me really happy I chose a career change.

You and me both, Kyle. I quit in 1999.

[Dragline]

The end of an era. That seems to be a running theme in my life these days. Not just career path, and work related, but far too many other things. Music is one that really stands out. AI generated BS and the seeming death throws of Rock/Metal. During all this time I also played music. Not just a hobby either. During the early part of my life I wanted to be a Rock Star. I wanted the brass ring and all that came with it. I put 100% effort into it. With my parents blessing I leaned into it pretty hard. Got to some pretty good places and became an accomplished musician. But it's such a fickle business. I saw contemporaries ( Extreme, Godsmack, James Montgomery) get to live it while my various bands came close but no cigar. No matter how good you may think you are, timing is everything. And sometimes it's simply not in the cards. Great memories are what the majority of us have as we watched others get to the place we are shot for. No regrets and while I am not currently in a band, that is always a possibility. But the entire business has changed with the advent of the Internet. And not for the better in many cases. It's a good thing I have a large music collection to listen to. Most of what comes out is not listenable.

Rant over...

[mikemodeler]

I can understand the frustration of buying parts from reputable sources only to have them fail or not perform to spec. It's happened to me and usually when it does, it is not at the most convenient time. 

I have worked in the automotive field for close to 45 years. Started out in the shop at a dealer and then went into the parts side of the business. After a few years of that, went to work for various parts manufacturers and distributors since the late 80's. I have seen a lot of changes and some have been good, some have been bad. Technology has played a large part in the improvements but as we all know, it's only as good as the person using it. 

What I can tell you is that the biggest problem in our business is the unwillingness to pay for parts. By that I mean in my current job, whenever there is a price increase I get hit upside the head by customers' refusing price increases because "it hurts our competitiveness in the market". These are the same people who want to have a 60% Gross Profit Margin on our parts, extended payment terms, additional discounts just because and expect us to fund their promotions and trade shows, all with us holding the line on price increases! Apparently in their minds, the only ones who have had operating cost increases are them, not us manufacturers. 

The reason why Rock Auto and places like them have become popular is the perceived bargain they represent. Quality parts from an online source cheaper than the parts store or dealer down the street. It's the race to the bottom that is dooming the parts industry because if we can't raise prices, we have to do something to remain profitable. Just like the mechanic who has to buy tools and equipment, manufacturers have to as well and we like to eat and sleep indoors just like the rest of the world. So when you complain about the quality or the cost of replacement parts, remember it's the place you buy them from that is driving the business. And the body parts business? Yeah, you can thank the insurance companies for the issues there. Insisting on using cheap off shore parts to keep their costs down and profits up, not caring how much extra work a body man has to do to make a part fit and look presentable to please a customer.

Retirement is getting closer, can't wait to be able to wake up in the morning and start my day at the model bench instead of at the computer dreading opening my inbox to see what fire is burning and needs to be extinguished because someone at one of the parts distributors insists I sacrifice my margin so they look good to shareholders. 

[Dragline]

What really drives me bonkers are the mechanics who charge up to 50% to the customer on parts. And I know of higher margins. They are making more than we do. And the customer gets hosed. More than once in my time on the counter has a customer walked in demanding to know what a garage paid for parts. He knows we cannot tell him, but they will insist. A shop making all that off parts AND giving me agita every day is/was something I don't miss. Making 15% on parts was what I was told to charge by my mentor. He insisted no more or less. We sometimes had to go get the parts. Other times they were delivered. At times I had to go wrench a part off a donor. In that case it was 25% if I had to go wrench a part off. A lot of times it was simple, others not so much. Truck laden with tools and the ride has to be paid for, I get that. Parts delivery is still free as far as I can tell. Sure, there are always hidden costs, but I was always led to believe delivery was part of business and it's in the price. Keeping a small fleet of delivery trucks and the retirees who drive em isn't free.

With quality consistently declining, and online retailers cutting our throats it's a wonder there are as many parts stores as there are. Margins being what they are it's simply so tight out there. But with some stores lacking almost the basic knowledge of how cars operate, it's a wonder some stay in business. They know who they are.

[Ace-Garageguy]

6 minutes ago, Dragline said:

What really drives me bonkers are the mechanics who charge up to 50% to the customer on parts...

...But with some stores lacking almost the basic knowledge of how cars operate, it's a wonder some stay in business. They know who they are.

Yes and yes.

First, I supply all my own parts, though I bill through the shops I contract with.

The reason I do this is to avoid constant wasted time with wrong stuff getting delivered. 

The managers in both shops are good people, but simply do not know enough about what I do, and things like AN fittings, aircraft hardware, metal or other material stock, etc. for me to trust them to get me what I need.

If I research and purchase my own stuff, if there's a problem with anything, it's 100% on me, with no buck passing.

I mark up my parts exactly zero percent, and the shops don't mark up what I pay either, as when I write the bills, I stipulate the parts are at cost, period.

Yeah, I give away a little in profit, but I don't need to nickel and dime really high-end clients, though I DO usually bill for my time if I have to research something unusual prior to ordering it. Knowing what to buy is part of the job.

Both shops DO mark up my labor, of course, and everyone seems happy with the arrangement.

Second, yes, it's appalling the lack of knowledge most parts-store countermen have these days.

When I got in this business, there were still countermen who seemed to know every part number for every part ever made, and knew terms like "head set". Not any more.

 

[mikemodeler]

Second, yes, it's appalling the lack of knowledge most parts-store countermen have these days.

When I got in this business, there were still countermen who seemed to know every part number for every part ever made, and knew terms like "head set". Not any more.

 

While I do agree that the knowledge of many of the counter staff has suffered, the parts proliferation forced by the new car manufacturers and complexity of vehicles plays a part in that. While the typical tune up today only has spark plugs in common with one from 30-40 years ago, the multiple of sensors and switches and other electrical components can make your head spin. Cap, rotor, plugs and wires is great for an old V-8 with a carb and easier to remember because it was the same for years, but today's vehicles can change from year or VIN breaks. Blame it on the engineers and federal regulations.

 

[Ace-Garageguy]

6 hours ago, mikemodeler said:

 

While I do agree that the knowledge of many of the counter staff has suffered... Blame it on the engineers and federal regulations.

 

That has nothing to do with a majority of the counter staff I encounter not knowing the names or functions of basic parts that are common to all IC vehicles.

Maybe it's just in my market, huh? The suburbs of a major metropolitan area?  Somehow I knida doubt it.

I often wonder to myself "how did these people even get hired in the first place?"

Of course I understand there are thousands upon thousands more parts than there were decades ago, but you chose to focus on that part of my remark rather than on widespread ignorance and incompetence of IC-vehicle operation in general.

Do MY job and then tell me how it really is.

When I go to a parts store, I almost always have to do THEIR JOBS TOO.

It should NOT be a pleasant surprise when I encounter a counter guy (or girl, but I guess "girl" isn't PC enough either) who even has a clue.

Edited 2 hours ago by Ace-Garageguy

[stavanzer]

Bill, I have the knowledge. I just can't seem to get O'Reilly or Autozone to hire me......

Believe me, after 6 months unemployed, I have applied. They don't want me.