Wires for hoses and lines and stuff...

[Lionel]

Hi everyone. Is there a basic size/wire gauge you folks use for things like:

Upper and lower rad hoses, Water pump hoses, Batter cables, Brake hoses and lines, Fuel lines. I'm really looking for a total diameter or thickness, because some 28 AWG wire may be thicker than another brand of 28 AWG due to the thickness of the sheathing (if that makes sense). Thanks in advance.

 

[sidcharles]

.020 for spark plugs

.080 for radiator hoses

eyeball the rest for proportion and contrast.

if you think of a technical illustration [blueprint for house of machine tool], there are different thickness line weights to emphasize certain components. make the same decisions for 3D creations. for a voltage regulator, even .020" might be way too heavy if there are 4 or 5 wires leading into it, so bump them down to .010" maybe.  strip some insulation to get smaller wires for lesser important "busy-ness" components. some older cars had flat strap battery grounds. it's all about creating visual interest. listen to your own pain-factor.

spoiler - next 10 responses will contradict all of the above!

 

 

 

 

 

[sidcharles]

 

[sidcharles]

the internet is abound with charts & conversion machines:

 

https://www.rapidtables.com/calc/wire/wire-gauge-chart.html

https://www.panduit.com/content/dam/panduit/en/products/media/4/54/254/3254/13254.pdf

there's probably a standard of insulation thickness manufacturers must adhere, so once you measure one brand, others will follow suit within reason.

it's a journey but you'll find the comfort zone for your style soon enough.

Edited Sunday at 11:00 AM by sidcharles

[johnyrotten]

9 minutes ago, sidcharles said:

there's probably a standard of insulation thickness manufacturers must adhere, so once you measure one brand, others will follow suit within reason

There is, depending on what the material is and the application of the wire, txl vs gxl. Pvc vs silicone ect. Part of the reason why scrounged wire is always hit or miss.

[bobss396]

I go smaller for radiator hoses, like .060" or .050" insulated wire.

I use .093" aluminum tubing at the engine and radiator and these sizes slip right in.

[sidcharles]

and we're off ...

[StevenGuthmiller]

30 AWG is a good place to start.

Generally a little too large for plug wires and too small for heater hoses, but it will work well for vacuum lines, battery cables, power steering hoses, etc.

If you get the type with a single strand silver wire inside, that will work great for fuel lines, brake lines, etc.

 

Go a couple of gauges smaller for plug wires, (32-34 should do the trick) and a couple of sizes larger for heater hoses. (28 AWG) should be about right.

 

Steve

Edited Sunday at 02:44 PM by StevenGuthmiller

[peteski]

15 hours ago, Lionel said:

I'm really looking for a total diameter or thickness, because some 28 AWG wire may be thicker than another brand of 28 AWG due to the thickness of the sheathing (if that makes sense). Thanks in advance.

 

You hit the nail on the head here.  The problem with electrical wire (which is what we use for simulating wiring and hoses in scale models) usually only describe the wire gauge, not the outside diameter of the insulation. Those, as you noted, will wary depending on the wire's purpose (like its maximum voltage and type of insulation material).  I have not find any reliable source which would give the outside diameter of insulated electrical wires. That is why I keep on collecting various wires I find from various sources so I can measure them myself. Also, even the same vendors can change the source of their wire, and the new version of the same gauge wire will have different insulation and of course the outside-diameter.

There are hobby vendors like Detail Master or Pro-Tech who sell electrical wires for detailing models and they do state the wire's outside diameter. Some large industrial sources of wire also provide complete details specs for their wire (including the outside diameter of the insulation), but those sources usually require that you purchase a large quantity of wire.

Some wire, like the 30AWG Kynar-insulated wire wrapping wire have kept its (~0.016") OD over the years, however I find that wire a bit heavy for simulating ignition wire in most 1:24/25 scale models. It does have other uses though (as ti is equivalent to 0.4" wire or hose in 1:1 scale vehicle). Or whatever the equivalent is in other scales you model.

Over the years I have collected a decent range of diameters and colors of wire, so I have a good selection available for my models.

[Bugatti Fan]

I tend to store wires in many diameters sourced from various things.   Electronics, old style multi core phone cables etc.

I don't really get technical about working out actual scale diameters as I can pretty well see what will look right and to scale on a model.

[StevenGuthmiller]

4 hours ago, Bugatti Fan said:

I tend to store wires in many diameters sourced from various things.   Electronics, old style multi core phone cables etc.

I don't really get technical about working out actual scale diameters as I can pretty well see what will look right and to scale on a model.

Correct.

If you're ordering wire on line you're not going to be able to tell what "looks right" until you get it.

The best rule of thumb is to get several different sizes, and once you receive them, you'll be able to tell which applications they'll work best for.

If something doesn't look like it's going to work for anything, send it back.

Or worst case scenario, you'll know what not to get next time.

Fortunately, wire isn't all that expensive.

 

Shoot for stuff in the 26 to 36 AWG range.

You should be able to find uses for pretty much all of it.

 

 

 

Steve

[Big John]

Scrounge anything for 30A 220 cable and romex to old telephone, dead computer and craft wiring. I've got a whole shelf dedicated to the stock.

[peteski]

Of course if you want to use wire for things like heater or radiator hoses, you will need heaver gauge wires. Detail Master sells small quantities of repackaged wires for those applications.

[Bugatti Fan]

My supply of wires and tubing is made up from.scrounging odd bits and pieces over the years like John does.

There are a number of companies that sell 'scale wires'. From what I can see all they do is cut off bits of wire from larger coils repack it in quite short lengths and sell it on.  A very expensive way of buying wires for model making I think.

[peteski]

4 hours ago, Bugatti Fan said:

My supply of wires and tubing is made up from.scrounging odd bits and pieces over the years like John does.

There are a number of companies that sell 'scale wires'. From what I can see all they do is cut off bits of wire from larger coils repack it in quite short lengths and sell it on.  A very expensive way of buying wires for model making I think.

True, but try to find the very thin insulated wire (like 0.007" OD) Detail Master sells. Even if you locate an industrial source I bet they only sell it in large quantity (like a 1000 feet).  Yeah I know, make a group-buy for others on the forum then divide it into smaller pieces, ask for payment, package and mail it to the individuals involved in the group purchase. That sounds like what Detail Master is doing.

[mcs1056]

A supply of tiny wire can be found inside those super-reliable iPhone charger cables. When it stops working about a week after purchase, just cut the ends off and strip the rubber outer sheath. The attached pic shows what's inside:

A- The first thing you'll see after removing the rubber; Put shrink wrap on it for a radiator hose? Put ends on it for a hot rod hose?

B- A bit of fiberglass(?) for cable strength or something.

C, D, and E- Some braided stainless.

F and G- Itsy-bitsy wires. One green and one white.  

H- One larger red wire.

I- The braided stainless shielding seen in A-, but with all of the guts removed. I scrunched (sorry about using technical terms) it together to show how big one could make it. 

J- A thin aluminum (NOT aluminium...USA! USA! USA!) wrap that is dull on one side and shinier on the other. 

 

Now, I don't have access to my Vernier clamp. Thus, the best I could do is the ruler for size comparison. I will not pay Detail Master, or anyone else, for their little bits of wire. 

[johnyrotten]

26 minutes ago, mcs1056 said:

A supply of tiny wire can be found inside those super-reliable iPhone charger cables. When it stops working about a week after purchase, just cut the ends off and strip the rubber outer sheath. The attached pic shows what's inside:

A- The first thing you'll see after removing the rubber; Put shrink wrap on it for a radiator hose? Put ends on it for a hot rod hose?

B- A bit of fiberglass(?) for cable strength or something.

C, D, and E- Some braided stainless.

F and G- Itsy-bitsy wires. One green and one white.  

H- One larger red wire.

I- The braided stainless shielding seen in A-, but with all of the guts removed. I scrunched (sorry about using technical terms) it together to show how big one could make it. 

J- A thin aluminum (NOT aluminium...USA! USA! USA!) wrap that is dull on one side and shinier on the other. 

 

Now, I don't have access to my Vernier clamp. Thus, the best I could do is the ruler for size comparison. I will not pay Detail Master, or anyone else, for their little bits of wire. 

Same way I've gathered MOST of my inventory. Old corded headphones as well. All but the smallest diameter is common in those and charger cables. I even found small rubber sheathing that's a dead ringer for radiator hoses from the ones that have the  gray braided cloth covering.

[sidcharles]

a couple of different size drill gauges in the toolbox are handy for a variety of sizing: