sjordan2 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Skip, if you're looking for specific how-tos on specific topics, I guess you should look through the Tips and Techniques section (which is where specific how-tos are supposed to go), and just assume that stuff posted in the "General" section is just that... a general mix of all sorts of odds and ends. I see where Cranky is going with this thread now. Exactly. That's why I suggested that a different title would have kept things on track. That's my only crusade here: titles that are specific and make sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 ok, maybe the title I came up with is a better one? What do you guys think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Ooohh. New title. Much better. Yayy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I think I might post a thread called "Hey, Look At This"... just to bug Skip! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 4, 2012 Author Share Posted February 4, 2012 Skip & Harry, I also went back an put in a note on my first post to alert people NOT to post extensive how-tos or SBS here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ramfins59 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 For what it's worth, I don't necessarily think that chopping a top or sectioning a body is scratchbuilding... To me that is customizing. Scratchbuilding IMHO is making a part yourself that didn't exist previously, using either plastic, wood, metal or whatever... For instance, I built a Lawn Truck and Trailer with a lot of equipment (leaf blower, weed whacker, hedge trimmer, wheelbarrow, spreader, lawn mower, rake, etc.) which I scratchbuilt from bits and pieces of different shapes of plastic, aluminum tubing, wire, etc... I built a Catering Truck using a pickup truck and scratchbuilt the rear part of the truck holding the food items, etc., using different pieces of sheet plastic. Even some of the food items were scratchbuilt from plastic and wood, painted to look like food. Yes you need a large assortment of tools, some expensive and some not, and the right materials for your particular project. But most of all, as stated differently above, you need your imagination, your hands, and the skills and patience to get it all done. Again, that's MY 3 cents worth... Opinions & Butt-holes... Everyone's got them... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
comp1839 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 virgil, maybe you would define scratchbuilding vs. kitbashing vs. whatever. i know there are a few people who don't quite get the difference and there is a difference. i know the word "scratchbuilder" carries a lot of intrigue or mystique for some and therefore gets attached to a lot of things it shouldn't. to claim the title of a "scratchbuilder" it's important that you actually "scratchbuild" something and not just perform modifications to a part. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 4, 2012 Author Share Posted February 4, 2012 Richard, thanks for extending the definition. That's part of those blurring lines between "customizing" and "scratch-building." Example, you first come upon customizing when opening doors or a trunk lid and then you realize that scratch-building of the hinges (which, you are right, don't exist) will have to be performed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 4, 2012 Author Share Posted February 4, 2012 Dave, EXACTLY the kind of thing I am hoping happens, that folks start chiming in and start clarifying terminology and such, that's I think the spirit behind this thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Anderson Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Scratchbuilding for me began with serious modification of existing kits. My first serious conversion was about this time in 1962, 50yrs ago, when I decided to replicate a Great Aunt's 1924 Model T Coupe, using the AMT Double T, actually 2 of them. I pestered Dad to go with me out to Boswell IN, where Aunt Minnie lived, to take a look at her T coupe--never bothered to take a measuring tape, no camera, no nothing. Dad and I eyeballed the car in her garage (it was still her daily driver, around that little town, to the grocery, to her garden club, to church that was it --what the hey, she was 88yrs old, but still spry, and I was one of her favorites.) I had but a couple of pics in a book on Model T's, and between those, and my visual recollections of studying her car, I started in, and with just two tools, a penknife (back then, EVERY self-respecting teenaged boy had a pocketknife, I was no exception, and every Saturday afternoon was knife sharpening time with my dad--no restrictions back then as to carrying a pocketknife to school--it was expected, a rite of passage) and an early Zona razor saw. So, cut two chopped T coupes apart, glue them back together, with the roof raised to "stock height" (hey it looked right, so go ahead!) and glue the parts back together. That is where the replica stopped, and the street rod began! It took but a moment or two, and the next thing, I'd cut both doors open, and figured out how to hinge them. Full fendered, SB Chevy up front, home made headers running forward to look like nerf bars ala Joe Cruces, wire wheels from a 61 or 62 AMT Tbird, Pactra Candy Strawberry paint, white pinwale corduroy for the rolled and pleated interior, I was on my way. The car won Best of Show in the largest model car contest ever held here in Lafayette, some 2500 models entered at Bell Auto Supply downtown, and then, come summer and me off in college at Parsons College in Fairfield IA, the car went to the Iowa State Fair, for the Iowa State Model Car Championships, where it won its class. OK, so what does this have to do with scratchbuilding? The skills I picked up in this exercise started coming into play a few years later, when I started building models of race cars that had actually faced the Starter's Flag at Indianapolis Motor Speedway. That lead me to create all manner of race cars, from a 1911 Case, 1911 Stutz (the Car that Made Good In a Day), and eventually a rendition of the Marmon Wasp. Along the way came a scratchbuilt 1927 Duesenberg Indy Car (driven to victory by Lafayette's own George Souders, whom my mother got to know back then), several scratchbuilt Miller 91's, and a bunch of Indy cars out of the 1930's. Today, I have far more tools, much more sophisticated equipment (including a Sherline lathe, and their mill with ALL the toys), airbrushes, the whole nine yards. But, it all started with that AMT Double T Kit, a trip to Aunt Minnie's, a pocketknife and an early razor saw. Art Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 My definition of scratchbuilding: creating a part, or a component, that didn't exist before, using any of a number of raw materials, including (but not limited to): sheet stock (brass, aluminum, styrene, etc.), rod, tubing or channel (again, brass, aluminum, styrene, whatever), or anything else that you may find applicable and appropriate to use. Customizing, to me, means altering existing kit parts... either by cutting away, adding to, reshaping, etc... but starting with an existing part. But the lines can blur. Chopping a top, to me, is not scratchbuilding, but customizing. Opening up doors is not scratchbuilding, but customizing. But hinging the doors? Well, obviously you'll need hinges, and they would most likely be scratchbuilt. So it can get a little fuzzy sometimes where the exact dividing line between customizing and scratchbuilding lies. And just to muddy the waters more, there's kitbashing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
comp1839 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) Scratch building is the process of building a scale model "from scratch", ie. from raw materials, rather than building it from a commercial kit, kitbashing or buying it pre-assembled. Scratch building is easiest if original plans of the subject exist; however, many models have been built from photographs by measuring a known object in the photograph and extrapolating the rest of the dimensions. The necessary parts are then fashioned out of a suitable material, such as wood, plastic, plaster, clay, metal, polymer clay, or even paper, and then assembled. Some purists consider a model not to be truly scratchbuilt unless all of the parts were made from raw materials. However most modellers would consider a model including commercial detail parts as scratchbuilt. i downloaded this definition from wikipedia. i guess the first thing to clear up would be if you (the reader) are a "purist" or one of the "most modelers" catagory. i guarentee the "philosophy" of these two catagories will differ significntly. Edited February 4, 2012 by comp1839 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 I don't agree with that definition. A model can be built from a kit... but can include a completely scratchbuilt interior, for example. Scratchbuilding is a technique... not a term to define a model by. Of course, a model that's 100% built from raw materials is scratchbuilt... the model that is built from a kit and has a scratchbuilt interior can't be called "scratchbuilt," but it does have scratchbuilt components. It's all a little messy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
comp1839 Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 (edited) harry, the definition provided was for SCRATCHBUILDING, not model building. of course you can build a model from a kit but, scratch building is scratchbuilding. you can build some scratchbuilt parts but, you DON'T have a scratchbuilt model. by the way, you don't have to agree with the definition. it's from wikipedia. take it for what it's worth. again, purist vs. "most modelers". Edited February 5, 2012 by comp1839 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 you can build some scratchbuilt parts but, you DON'T have a scratchbuilt model. Did you actually read my post? That's exactly what I said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
comp1839 Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 virgil, good luck with your philosophy question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 My definition of scratchbuilding: creating a part, or a component, that didn't exist before, using any of a number of raw materials, including (but not limited to): sheet stock (brass, aluminum, styrene, etc.), rod, tubing or channel (again, brass, aluminum, styrene, whatever), or anything else that you may find applicable and appropriate to use. Customizing, to me, means altering existing kit parts... either by cutting away, adding to, reshaping, etc... but starting with an existing part. But the lines can blur. Chopping a top, to me, is not scratchbuilding, but customizing. Opening up doors is not scratchbuilding, but customizing. But hinging the doors? Well, obviously you'll need hinges, and they would most likely be scratchbuilt. So it can get a little fuzzy sometimes where the exact dividing line between customizing and scratchbuilding lies. And just to muddy the waters more, there's kitbashing... Harry, I like the sound of this so much, I'm quoting it on the first page! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 Phil, I beg to disagree, I think you could build them. If you PM me your address, I will send you a few bits of raw materials, and your homework assignment will be to build a set for your own garage! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 Thanks for the kind words, buddy. I appreciate your support. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 As the youngsters say these days: WORD! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxer Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 (edited) Some can spend hours or pages just defining scratchbuilding but won't take an hour to build a few jacks from spare plastic. No matter what you want to call it, when you need it just look at the shapes and just put em together. Then grin at the result. Edited February 5, 2012 by Foxer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottnkat Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 My philosophy for scratchbuilding is simple - it simply amounts to "Oh, God, please let these fit together and look okay!!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 My philosophy for scratchbuilding is simple - it simply amounts to "Oh, God, please let these fit together and look okay!!" Scott, personally I think "eyeballing" adds a bit of fun to the process, and since I am math impaired I still try to keep a few handy tools to help out, like dividers and calipers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mistermodel Posted February 5, 2012 Share Posted February 5, 2012 To me there is scratch,semi scratch ,or kit bashed I'lll show my current KW project to explane what I mean I made the parts showen because it better than trying to fill,or grind kit mounting areas,add small bolt detail,and the thicknes is a little better scaled Kit bash- double bunk,from 2 cabs Semi scratch- frame rails made from flat stock with kit suspention and crossmembers Scratch-new stack brackets from channel,rod,flat stock and alum tube Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Cranky Posted February 5, 2012 Author Share Posted February 5, 2012 Thanks for including kit-bashing into the mix . . . Kevin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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