Wondering....

[Luc Janssens]

Would there be CAD data on these, now that they're being reproduced?

http://www.restorationperformance.com/servlet/the-126656/1969-Mustang-Fastback-Replacement/Detail

[Foxer]

Try this link

[Greg Myers]

Luc, you going into business ? Got a new 3-D printer you've run out of things to make ? Great idea, now you're thinking.

[Greg Myers]

Brookville makes these,among others. We could always use another, and from Sherman http://www.shermanparts.com/1957.html

Edited February 23, 2013 by Greg Myers

[Mark]

The makers of the reproduction bodies should theoretically be willing to sell the data they have gathered, providing it would not be used to create products that compete directly with what they are selling. A model car or diecast would certainly fall into that category.

On the other hand, once that data leaves their posession, it could then be provided to others, who could then use it to make cheaper "knockoff" products (like patch panels) that would cut into the sales of their reproduction parts.

I would bet that they would not risk that happening, and safeguard their business by not allowing anyone else access to that information.

[Art Anderson]

The makers of the reproduction bodies should theoretically be willing to sell the data they have gathered, providing it would not be used to create products that compete directly with what they are selling. A model car or diecast would certainly fall into that category.

On the other hand, once that data leaves their posession, it could then be provided to others, who could then use it to make cheaper "knockoff" products (like patch panels) that would cut into the sales of their reproduction parts.

I would bet that they would not risk that happening, and safeguard their business by not allowing anyone else access to that information.

I believe, at least at their outset, Brookville actually disassembled a straight, rust-free original '32 Ford roadster body, and created new stamping dies from those using Kirksite alloy dies. Kirksite has been around for a couple of decades or more, and is used for short-run sheet metal stampings. Being an alloy primariy of zinc, it can be poured against existing sheet steel shapes without seriously damaging them--perhaps the ultimate in "reverse engineering"?).

The deuce, particularly the roadster, was made up of fairly simple steel stampings, which would make such a reproduction possible. It seems very likely that most of the reproduction sheet metal, such as the Mustang fastback Luc mentioned above, is done in much the same manner. As such, it's probably not too likely that the companies doing this sort of work do much in the way of CAD--as that would mean actually cutting new steel dies, probably a lot more expensive to do.

Art

[Ace-Garageguy]

I believe, at least at their outset, Brookville actually disassembled a straight, rust-free original '32 Ford roadster body, and created new stamping dies from those using Kirksite alloy dies. Kirksite has been around for a couple of decades or more, and is used for short-run sheet metal stampings. Being an alloy primariy of zinc, it can be poured against existing sheet steel shapes without seriously damaging them--perhaps the ultimate in "reverse engineering"?).

The deuce, particularly the roadster, was made up of fairly simple steel stampings, which would make such a reproduction possible. It seems very likely that most of the reproduction sheet metal, such as the Mustang fastback Luc mentioned above, is done in much the same manner. As such, it's probably not too likely that the companies doing this sort of work do much in the way of CAD--as that would mean actually cutting new steel dies, probably a lot more expensive to do.

Art

Just to elaborate on what Art has said, there has for many years also been a group of very high-density, metal-filled composite materials now widely used for stamping sheet-metal parts. As the material is poured at room temperature, it works quite nicely for splashing tooling from existing parts. I was involved in testing this material early on, and we made several sets of aluminum Beechcraft landing-gear-door skins in this manner. Sheet steel up to 1/8 inch thick was also sucessfully stamped for a set of experimental self-propelled-gun wheels.

HOWEVER, and this is IMPORTANT, anyone who's ever been involved with the design of tooling for stamping will know there is a tendancy for metal to 'spring-back' after it's stamped. CORRECTLY DESIGNED stamping dies will actually stamp the metal BEYOND the desired final shape to allow for spring-back to the correct shape when the part is removed from the dies. For this reason, tooling that is taken directly from existing parts will ALWAYS produce parts of inferior fit, as the necessary 'overdraw' is absent in the dies, and when the parts spring back, they will NOT fit correctly. This is the reason so much of the Chinese aftermarket sheetmetal for collision repair is garbage. An entire Mustang body produced this way would be a nightmare.

I've recently been involved with the completion of one of the FIRST Broookville '29 bodies that has been languishing in a client's garage for many years. The fit is poor, and was probably produced on tooling as described by Art, or in composite tooling as I mentioned.

The CURRENT Brookville parts fit very very well (again, I have very recent experience with them)...too well for older tools to have been modified. If I had to guess, I'd say the tools that made the current Brookville parts ARE INDEED properly designed in CAD, and new dies cut. I would also tend to think the repop steel Mustang, Camaro and Chevy bodies are made in new tooling, properly designed in CAD to incorporate correct spring-back. Though designing correctly to allow for spring-back was at one time something of a black art, and required much experience to get right every time, there is software now available that makes this highly specialized design work relatively painless.

Edited February 24, 2013 by Ace-Garageguy

[Luc Janssens]

Aha!

So here's where my post went....

A belated thank you all for your input!

[Greg Myers]

gotta love it, don't cha ?