What Irked You Today?

[High octane]

I don't think the board has a font big enough for me to agree with you (re: the post above about making kids take Economics and passing it)!  Schools are so focused on their core classes and 'no student left behind' that we aren't preparing them for life.  Recently my teenage son was at work when one of the delivery vans wouldn't start.  He was the ONLY person that knew how to jump start it!  Wait.....this was a catering company and there were a dozen people with no clue what to do.   This is why athletes burn through their big contract money when they go pro as the schools don't teach them about budgeting, preparing for the future and spending wisely.  

I am fifty years old and yet to use (from high school):  British Authors (unless I end up on Jeopardy), Calculus (never had to find the area under the parabola), two years of German (unless I buy a Volkswagen).  

Bring back wood shop (teach them how to use tools properly and SAFELY), auto mechanics (how to safely change a flat or jump start a car), How to balance a checkbook and set a personal budget, take home economic to learn to cook for yourself instead of making a daily run to the artery clogging fast food, how to complete a job application and properly interview.

 

I have to agree with you on the last paragraph as many young people today seem "lost" when it comes to the things you've mentioned. I've also heard of older people in the same boat with no clue how to start a dish washer, clothes washer, dryer, writing a check, etc. NO  CLUE that they can get run over by a car while crossing the street, walking through a parking lot, because they're staring at their smart phone(I?). Really??? I'm a dinosaur and I reluctantly know that we're in the 21 century, but I'm having thoughts about people that can't do the basic things in life these days. Women who want to get married and don't know how to cook? Maybe they want to marry chefs. The basic of life are not rocket science by no means, and I'm wondering what the kids are learning in school these days?

[Kit Basher]

I have to agree with you on the last paragraph as many young people today seem "lost" when it comes to the things you've mentioned. I've also heard of older people in the same boat with no clue how to start a dish washer, clothes washer, dryer, writing a check, etc. NO  CLUE that they can get run over by a car while crossing the street, walking through a parking lot, because they're staring at their smart phone(I?). Really??? I'm a dinosaur and I reluctantly know that we're in the 21 century, but I'm having thoughts about people that can't do the basic things in life these days. Women who want to get married and don't know how to cook? Maybe they want to marry chefs. The basic of life are not rocket science by no means, and I'm wondering what the kids are learning in school these days?

In all fairness, did any of us learn those things in school? I sure didn't. Whatever "life skills" I have I learned from my family. My Mom taught me to cook, do laundry, and clean my room. My Dad taught me how to manage money and plan for the future. I learned basic mechanics by maintaining lawn mowers, vehicles, and farm equipment. I learned my trade of woodworking thru OJT and trial and error.

My point is: maybe we shouldn't expect understaffed and underpaid teachers to do what families should do.

[Ace-Garageguy]

My point is: maybe we shouldn't expect understaffed and underpaid teachers to do what families should do.

I'm kinda curious about just what the "understaffed and underpaid teachers" ARE doing, when 19% of American high-school graduates can't read (and don't know what 19% means anyway), most of them can't write a coherent sentence, can't make change from a dollar without a computer, have no idea who America's allies (or enemies) were in the second World War, where England is on a map, and have no clue as to what makes a car run or why the lights come on when you throw the switch.

I WAS taught all those things in school.

Elementary school.

80% OF NEW YORK HIGH SCHOOL GRADS CAN'T READ DESPITE BEING NO. 1 IN SCHOOL SPENDING

2013 article here:      http://www.frontpagemag.com/point/180507/80-new-york-high-school-grads-cant-read-despite-daniel-greenfield

Edited April 15, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

[Foxer]

I'm bothered that it is still too early to leave for NNL East ... another couple of hours yet if we want a room waiting we can enter. At least it's only 3 hours ... many are traveling much farther today.

Edited April 15, 2016 by Foxer

[Kit Basher]

I'm kinda curious about just what the "understaffed and underpaid teachers" ARE doing, when 19% of American high-school graduates can't read (and don't know what 19% means anyway), most of them can't write a coherent sentence, can't make change from a dollar without a computer, have no idea who America's allies (or enemies) were in the second World War, where England is on a map, and have no clue as to what makes a car run or why the lights come on when you throw the switch.

I WAS taught all those things in school.

Elementary school.

80% OF NEW YORK HIGH SCHOOL GRADS CAN'T READ DESPITE BEING NO. 1 IN SCHOOL SPENDING

2013 article here:      http://www.frontpagemag.com/point/180507/80-new-york-high-school-grads-cant-read-despite-daniel-greenfield

I agree, Bill. That is what teachers should be doing. The numbers you cite are disgraceful. But if our schools are failing to teach even the basics of English, math, science, and history, maybe parents should at least take care of teaching domestic chores, basic finance, and manners.

[Ace-Garageguy]

... maybe parents should at least take care of teaching domestic chores, basic finance, and manners.

I agree entirely...that's an important part of what it should mean to be a "parent"...but it's not happening for a variety of societal reasons, the biggest one being that not enough people give enough of a damm about it to address the issue publicly and loudly.

I think a lot of people believe I'm just a nasty, grumpy, spiteful old SOB who likes to complain and be mean about younger generations, but the truth is that I love this country...and what I'm seeing is everything that made this country a wonderful place to live (not perfect, but about the best for a long time) is being eroded and forgotten and marginalized, while stuff that is of no lasting importance whatsoever is worshiped and revered.

 

[High octane]

In all fairness, did any of us learn those things in school? I sure didn't. Whatever "life skills" I have I learned from my family. My Mom taught me to cook, do laundry, and clean my room. My Dad taught me how to manage money and plan for the future. I learned basic mechanics by maintaining lawn mowers, vehicles, and farm equipment. I learned my trade of woodworking thru OJT and trial and error.

My point is: maybe we shouldn't expect understaffed and underpaid teachers to do what families should do.

I learned a few of those things in school as we had a home economics class, woodworking, they taught me about money and how to make change, I learned about cooking and the outdoors in Boy Scouts, and I learned mechanical things from my dad and also on my own as my dad wasn't into cars at all, except for transportation. I thought that the teachers I had in the Chicago Public School System back in the 50's were pretty good.

[Agent G]

G

 

[Harry P.]

However, I also think that you shouldn't be allowed to vote if you rely on public assistance (because too many people just vote to keep themselves dependant) and that you should be required to do some form of community service to receive welfare...

How "politically incorrect" of you.

 

I couldn't agree with you more.

[MrBuick]

I'm kinda curious about just what the "understaffed and underpaid teachers" ARE doing,

As someone who works in the education industry, it seems much of what they do is sit around and complain about how underpaid they are. MOST people think they're underpaid...we'd all like to make more money! I work in higher education. I'm in charge of the entire network infrastructure across 4 campuses, more than 8k computers\devices, support 700-ish employees and 10k+ students, and manage a department of 10 people, plus myself...I'm paid well to do it, but I'd LOVE to make more. Part of my job responsibilities are managing the LMS (Online Courses via Blackboard) and our INET system, which tracks the digital door locks (our employees carry badges that unlock the doors when they approach it...every time you enter a door, it's logged). Part of my duties are to monitor those systems and issue monthly reports to administration. Guess what I see on those reports all the time? Professors showing up to class 10 minutes late, ending class 40 minutes early, spending less than an hour a day in their Blackboard courses grading assignments and answering students' questions. Our professors are pretty well paid (higher than industry average for the Midwest), and many of them work maybe a 5-6 hour day. They'll all talk about how much "work from home" they do, but my system logs beg to differ. Now, this certainly does not go for everyone...as always, I'm generalizing, but it's prevalent enough to be a major problem. The saddest part; administration asks for these reports because they want to "do something about it," but then they give the professors tenure and they can't...so frustrating! 

Edited April 15, 2016 by MrBuick

[Harry P.]

Don't know how it works in the rest of the country, but around here, a union teacher puts a couple hundred grand max towards their pensions over the course of their career. Then they retire in their 50s, live another 20-30-40 years, and make millions in pension payments.

No wonder Illinois is broke.

[Danno]

AMEN, G!

 

And, Bill and Mike and Harry.  Pathetic, but true.  But at least those tenured NEA teachers are secure in their jobs and their retirements!   

 

 

[Greg Myers]

Yeah ! Let's take away their pensions. Let's take away every ones pension. 

[MrBuick]

Yeah ! Let's take away their pensions. Let's take away every ones pension. 

Lol! I don't think that's quite what was meant...I think the general point is, we're tired of hearing teachers complain about how bad they have it and how underpaid they are. Most of them make decent money after they've been doing it for a few years...not a lot of money, but decent. Most of them get 2.5-4 months a year off, work a pretty steady and flexible schedule, these days much of the lesson plans already exists so they don't have to spend hours developing it themselves...they may change it a bit, but the bulk is there...more and more of them don't have to spend hours grading assignments, because as more and more schools digitalize the classroom, Blackboard, Angel, Canvas, or whatever flavor of LMS they use does it for them. Most of them have good benefits, most of them have tenure (don't have to worry about unexpectedly being let go), and many of them have unions to back them up even when they deserve to get fired. Sure, there are exceptions, sure there are teachers who have tons of debt in student loans and barely make 30k a year (as many of us have at some point in our lives), but most of them in that situation haven't been teaching very long...it's idiotic to expect to step into a job with zero experience and immediately make tons of money. When I started out in my career, I had 40k in student loans and got bumped from $9 to $12/hr at the job I was already working...8 years later with my education and some more years' experience behind me, I make very good money and am well on my way to being debt free, but I had to work for it, as all of us do. As always, these are all generalizations and I know there are exceptions, but I've worked in the education system for my entire adult life (both K-12 and now Higher Ed), and I've see all of this first hand for the last 10 years. 

[Ace-Garageguy]

Yeah ! Let's take away their pensions. Let's take away every ones pension. 

Seems like that damm near happened a few years back...   

[Greg Myers]

Just what is it you do Colby, that allows you to see this degradation in the teaching profession ? 

[SfanGoch]

It pisses me off to no end when POS skels use their kids as props in order to play on people's sympathies and shame them into coughing up money out of some misguided guilt. I was riding the subway earlier today. Two stops into the trip, a guy and a little girl get on. The guy starts his prepared spiel about their being homeless, hungry, etc. Then, he walks through the car shaking a ski cap under passengers' noses for "donations". The suckers tossing in bills didn't seem to notice that the guy was wearing brand spanking new Air Jordan 4 Pinnacle sneakers, which cost around $650, holding an iPhone worth at least another couple hundred and the little girl was also dressed in expensive clothes. 

Years ago, there was a guy who used to pull a similar scam on the F train to Queens. He would walk through the car wearing a cardboard sign reading, "Please help my family" with a "photo" of two smiling little girls and Mom taped in the middle. I thought there was something very familiar about that picture. I knew I've seen it someplace before. It was one of those generic inserts you find when you buy a picture frame. I got a hold of one of those inserts and carried it with me, hoping I'd see the guy again. I got my chance a few weeks later. He got on the subway and went into his routine. When he reached my seat, I said, "Man, it's hard to believe that your girls are in such a bad situation." "What do you mean?" "Well, you must be doing pretty well with your daughters being famous models." "Huh?" "C'mon dude, don't be so modest. I see their faces all the time." "I don't know what you're talking about." So, I pulled out the insert and asked him if I could have his autograph. Everybody in the car started yelling at him and proceeded to pelt him with coffee cups, soda cans, food and newspapers. I never saw him on the F train again.

[Harry P.]

Yeah ! Let's take away their pensions. Let's take away every ones pension. 

When a teacher puts maybe 200 grand into their pension fund over the course of their career, then gets to retire in their 50s and live another 20-30-40 years, ultimately collecting millions of dollars of pension benefits, yeah, there's something wrong with that system! (the average retired teacher in Illinois will collect $2,000,000 in pensions).

200 grand in... millions out! The numbers just don't add up. No wonder Illinois is so messed up financially.

And who is paying for those cushy pensions? Why, I am... and all the other working stiffs who don't have a pension. I'm self-employed. I will never have a pension. Yet the money the state confiscates from me via state income tax goes into the pot to pay the pensions of the lucky few. I have to work my tail off to make a living, then the state takes away part of the money I earned to pay the pensions of others.

How is that fair to me?

[drummerdad]

^ That is what broke the auto industry, and it will break the education system as well. 

[SfanGoch]

How is that fair to me?

After you pay your taxes, you have pocket change left over, right? Sounds fair to them what robs you in the name of the law. Don't forget the Dept. of Taxation & Finance's official motto:

"What's mine is mine, what's yours is mine."

The lion's share of municipal budgets go toward pension funds.The actual operating budgets are just a small percentage. Heck, NYC's FY2016 Executive Budget is $78.3 BILLION! That's more than the annual budgets of 90% of the nations on this planet. A giant chunk is for pension funds. I have no problem with cops and firefighters getting paid well or receiving nice pensions. They put their lives on the line every single day and deserve to be compensated for what are, short of combat duty, the most hazardous occupations to work in. Every other civil servant.......keep walking.  

[Ace-Garageguy]

I'm self-employed. I will never have a pension...I have to work my tail off to make a living, then the state takes away part of the money I earned to pay...others...(who don't feel the need to work at all)..

How is that fair to me?

I can use most of your words to sum up how I feel in line at the Publix, watching folks in clothes much nicer that what I wear, with multiple kids in tow, buying groceries with food stamps, then going out to the parking lot and driving away in much nicer vehicles than what I own, all while talking on the latest smart-phone.

Where do I sign up for the free ride?

[Harry P.]

Every other civil servant.......keep walking.  

Damn straight.

[Ace-Garageguy]

 I have no problem with cops and firefighters getting paid well or receiving nice pensions. They put their lives on the line every single day and deserve to be compensated for what are, short of combat duty, the most hazardous occupations to work in. Every other civil servant.......keep walking.  

Yup.

[SfanGoch]

BLAH_BLAH_BLAH_BLAH straight.

Are you allowed to use "straight" here?

[Ace-Garageguy]

Are you allowed to use "straight" here?

It might be considered offensive to some who are differently whatevered.