Best Citroen 2cv 1:24 kit?

[jakijem]

Which do you think is the best kit to build a 1:24 Citroen 2cv (not the furgonette)?

Tamiya? Revell? Heller? (all are the same mold?)

[GeeBee]

First off, no, there not all the same mold, I've built the Tamiya version, although it's a nice kit to put together, there are a few parts fit problems, the bonnet really doesn't fit well at all, and from memory, the driveshafts didn't line up that well, but apart from that, it's still a nice kit.

From my recent experience with the later Revell kits, I've so far built both of their Trabant and VW Beetle kits, all of them went together without fault, I've got both Revell 2cv kits to build, and can't wait to build them.

I haven't had any experience of the Heller version but looking atthe instructions, they look a little simplified.

Hope this helps ...

[unclescott58]

First off, no, there not all the same mold, I've built the Tamiya version, although it's a nice kit to put together, there are a few parts fit problems, the bonnet really doesn't fit well at all, and from memory, the driveshafts didn't line up that well, but apart from that, it's still a nice kit.

From my recent experience with the later Revell kits, I've so far built both of their Trabant and VW Beetle kits, all of them went together without fault, I've got both Revell 2cv kits to build, and can't wait to build them.

I haven't had any experience of the Heller version but looking atthe instructions, they look a little simplified.

Hope this helps ...

Even if the Heller kit is simplified compared to the other two. I wonder how it looks when it's finished? I'd love to see a review of all three kits. Together, or separately. Yet I will always prefer together. I do not have a 2CV in my collection. It's not a kit that is high on my lists of must haves. But, a simple 2CV kit, if it looked right when it was done, might be fun as quick put together. It's always been been a cute car. 

Scott

 

[niteowl7710]

It also depends on what you want out of the kit in terms of your 2CV model. The Tamiya and RevellAG kits build different cars. The Tamiya is a 1960s standard 2CV, the RevellAG is a 1982 2CV Charleston which was the top of the line model (as it were).

This goes for the RevellAG Mini Cooper and VW Beetle, both build slightly different variations of the cars than the Tamiya kits of the same subject matter.

Edited March 3, 2017 by niteowl7710

[keyser]

Gunze did one that's OK. But the ONLY early 2CV was a Gunze in an anime issue with resin corrugated hood and rear window filler panels in plastic. Also had early lights and bumpers. VERY hard to find, Lupin series IIRC, I'm not up on anime. The later cars are nice, but I had to have the corrugated hood car, it's a classic. Surprised Tamiya or anyone hasn't converted their later cars. The blind quarter cars are pulling a premium in the 1:1 market. 

Just found this, Ebbro pickup with early hood, not seen one in sedan or the Fourgonette. Quarter fillers not hard, but will need rear bumpers too.

 

Edited March 3, 2017 by keyser
more pics built Gunze

[niteowl7710]

Gunze did one that's OK. But the ONLY early 2CV was a Gunze in an anime issue with resin corrugated hood and rear window filler panels in plastic. Also had early lights and bumpers. VERY hard to find, Lupin series IIRC, I'm not up on anime. The later cars are nice, but I had to have the corrugated hood car, it's a classic. Surprised Tamiya or anyone hasn't converted their later cars. The blind quarter cars are pulling a premium in the 1:1 market. 

Just found this, Ebbro pickup with early hood, not seen one in sedan or the Fourgonette. Quarter fillers not hard, but will need rear bumpers too.

 

I almost have to wonder what would be cheaper at this point. Finding that vintage G-S kit or kit bashing the pickup. That kit is almost $50 direct from Japan, and that's kinda steep for a hood

[GeeBee]

It also depends on what you want out of the kit in terms of your 2CV model. The Tamiya and RevellAG kits build different cars. The Tamiya is a 1960s standard 2CV,

It's not, it's a 1970 2CV6, first time the single spoke steering wheel had been fitted to the 2CV

[Don Sikora II]

The Gunze kits use the basic car parts from the Heller/Airfix kit. There's another Gunze boxing without the added bits that is marked Made by Airfix on the box.

[GeeBee]

 the RevellAG is a 1982 2CV Charleston which was the top of the line model (as it were).

The Charleston was first released in 1980, their latest kit of the 2CV is the Sauss-Ente, a 1987 special edition for the German and Swiss market, and has the cylinder heads modified so it could run on unleaded petrol which at the time was being introduced across Europe

[Tom Geiger]

Why choose?  I bought them all.  One of them even has the top open.

[GeeBee]

The Gunze kits use the basic car parts from the Heller/Airfix kit. There's another Gunze boxing without the added bits that is marked Made by Airfix on the box.

That's because at one time Gunze Sangyo were the distributor in Japan for Airfix models.

Why choose?  I bought them all.  One of them even has the top open.

Both the Revell & Tamiya versions have the option of displaying the model with the roof open or closed

Edited March 3, 2017 by GeeBee

[Erik Smith]

The Gunze kits use the basic car parts from the Heller/Airfix kit. There's another Gunze boxing without the added bits that is marked Made by Airfix on the box.

Does the other Gunze Sangyo/Airfix kit have the earlier model resin parts like the Lupin III version?

I have actually seen the The Castle of Cagliostro movie a number of times - the model is from that specific movie, I don't know if Clarisse was running from the Count in the 2CV in the series. The car is destroyed very quickly as it goes off a cliff. 

[GeeBee]

Does the other Gunze Sangyo/Airfix kit have the earlier model resin parts like the Lupin III version?

Only this one has the resin older bonnet, 

http://modelingmadness.com/scott/cars/2cvpreview.htm

[Junkman]

I never bought the Tamiya because of the wrong headlights.
They must be modelled after lights fitted to 2CVs in Japan, because I've seen real 2CVs in Japan with them.

Weirdly, all three models depict 2CVs from the same era, namely the final years, but not one of them
includes the rectangular headlights that were also available during that period. I'd actually prefer them
on a late one.

Fitting the Gunze/Heller one with the resin parts will not yield an accurate early type, although I believe
the Heller is the easiest one to modify accordingly. I seem to remember, that I explained the main
difference before, but am happy to do so again, if you are interested.

[Erik Smith]

Only this one has the resin older bonnet, 

http://modelingmadness.com/scott/cars/2cvpreview.htm

That's what I thought. 

Here is the actual hood, if anybody is interested:

%5BURL=http://s966.photobucket.com/user/erikmsmith/media/C0D07D8E-408F-4551-BA28-7F3B067F72E0_zpsth9wfqoy.jpg.html]

The other resin parts are Clarisse's body. The rear window block outs are actually styrene. 

[GeeBee]

I never bought the Tamiya because of the wrong headlights.
They must be modelled after lights fitted to 2CVs in Japan, because I've seen real 2CVs in Japan with them.

Weirdly, all three models depict 2CVs from the same era, namely the final years, but not one of them
includes the rectangular headlights that were also available during that period. I'd actually prefer them
on a late one.

Fitting the Gunze/Heller one with the resin parts will not yield an accurate early type, although I believe
the Heller is the easiest one to modify accordingly. I seem to remember, that I explained the main
difference before, but am happy to do so again, if you are interested.

it's not incorrect, it's a 1970-74 2CV6, the rectangular headlamps were fitted 1974 onwards, and the Revell versions are correct, non of those models had rectangular headlamps

Edited March 3, 2017 by GeeBee

[GeeBee]

Have a read here, 

http://www.citroenet.org.uk/passenger-cars/michelin/2cv/history/1970.html

Looks like Tamiya got it correct .....

[Junkman]

I didn't say with one word that not having rectangular headlights is incorrect.
The rectangular headlights were at no time the sole option, round ones were always available,
although the UK might be as usual an exception, I don't know.
I said I prefer the later types with the rectangular ones.

However, the round ones in the Tamiya kit aren't typical 2CV headlights, they depict the ones fitted to 2CVs in Japan.

Original 2CV headlights:

Tamiya:

Notice how the Tamiya ones are mounted on stems, so they are higher up, they are shallower, larger in diameter,
lacking the typical lever to undo the lens, which itself is less convex, i.e. it's a completely different headlight
arrangement.
And as I said, this is not a mistake by Tamiya, I have seen 2CVs in Japan with exactly these headlights mounted
in this way. I presume this was necessary to meet Japanese lighting legislation when the cars were new.
Many surviving 2CVs in Japan have meanwhile been converted to the original headlights.
 

 

Edited March 3, 2017 by Junkman

[GeeBee]

Well if you prefer the rectangular headlamps, there available in resin 

http://www.hiroboy.com/124_Citroen_2CV_007_1981_Decals_and_Resin--product--4523.html

Edited March 3, 2017 by GeeBee

[Junkman]

I have a nice diecast with them. That's good enough for me.

Anyway, after the switch from the corrugated to the creased bonnet in 1960 and changing the front doors from suicide to normal fitting in 1965,
the next big change occurred at the back, I believe in 1970, or 1971.

Until then, the panel below the bootlid was at the same angle as the lid:

It was changed to this almost vertical arrangement:

Also note how the bumper is now mounted lower than it was before, almost at the same height as the front one.

So this would need to be backdated on the Gunze/Heller, should one opt to build the Clarise version and also if one wants to replicate the one Curt had in AmGraf.

During this "taillift", the rear tips of the rear wings/fenders were also slightly changed, they are thus not compatible on the real cars,
but I guess that change is small enough that it can be ignored in 1/24. It does properly annoy real car restorers though, since only the later ones are available new.

The reason for this was that many European countries did no longer allow the rear numberplate to be mounted at the angle the earlier versions had.
I think it went from max 30 to max 15 degrees, IIRC.

 

Edited March 3, 2017 by Junkman

[Junkman]

BTW, the earlier taillights can be kitbashed from the Heller 4CV kit. They are the exact same Soubitez units.

[unclescott58]

That's what I thought. 

Here is the actual hood, if anybody is interested:

%5BURL=http://s966.photobucket.com/user/erikmsmith/media/C0D07D8E-408F-4551-BA28-7F3B067F72E0_zpsth9wfqoy.jpg.html]

The other resin parts are Clarisse's body. The rear window block outs are actually styrene. 

The hand there to keep the hood closed? ?

Scott

 

[landman]

I have this one. Is there anything you would like me to check in it?

[Junkman]

So which is the 'best' kit?

Well, IMO it depends on which version you want to build.

- If you want to build a late car, deffo Revell.

- For the middle aged ones, go for the Tamiya.

- If backdating to an early one is what you want to do, I think the Heller one is best suited, but don't forget,
that you are dealing with 1980s kit technology here. And with that I mean 1980s Heller kit technology.
Having said that, IMO this kit yields the most charming and least sterile results.

- And if you want to do an early early one, fit the Ebbro pick up front clip and chassis with a backdated Heller saloon body.

Or just wait, Ebbro might release one anyway.

 

 

Also, I take the liberty to expand on the third side window.

French built cars with the corrugated bonnet never had it. But cars built in Belgium were available with it at extra cost from the onset,
so a corrugately hooded 2CV with the third side window isn't necessarily incorrect:

So we have to thank the Belgians, that the third side window became available at all.

However, the Belgian built cars also had numerous other quirks the French cars never had.
First and foremost different taillights, a different rear window and a different bootlid:

The Belgian bootlid concealed a second boot floor, i.e. a shallow compartment, that contained the spare wheel,
which was merely thrown into the boot in French built cars, so in those, you had to put your nice Samsonites onto a dirty wet wheel
after a puncture in a rainstorm.
.
In 1958 they changed it to this arrangement:

Note: This arrangement was only legal in countries that allowed taillights and rear numberplates being mounted on folding panels.
It was hence deffo illegal in Denmark and Scandinavia.

Also note: The above picture is of a 1958 Belgian built car that has the third side window, which was at that time still gleefully absent from
French built ones.

The Belgians also always got chromed bumpers, aluminium trim on the wings and down the centre of the bonnet, and many colours to choose from.
Belgian wheels were always painted body colour and always had chromed embellishers, held in place with a central chromed hexagon bolt.
French wheels were usually the same colour of dirty white regardless of the body colour and did only come in body colour and with embellishers
on the posh models.

 

Back to the third side window.

Once the switch to the creased bonnet was done in 1960, 2CVs were available with, or without the third side window,
regardless whether they were built in Belgium, France, or elsewhere. French versions with the third window were called 'Luxe'.

The Luxe versions proved so popular, that from c. 1965 onwards, the number of cars built without the third side
window is practically negligible and they were dropped altogether in the late Sixties, the exact year is unknown, but it is estimated
to be 1968.

From 1973 onwards, cars without the third side window were again produced in limited batches until production halted
in France in 1989. From then on 2CVs were only built in Portugal for another year or so and all of those had the 3rd side window.
 

 

Edited March 4, 2017 by Junkman

[martinfan5]

Well if you prefer the rectangular headlamps, there available in resin 

http://www.hiroboy.com/124_Citroen_2CV_007_1981_Decals_and_Resin--product--4523.html

I take it that is the only option for square headlights ?.