So...what's up with ATC? Several almost near-misses in several days...

[Ace-Garageguy]

Kinda makes me not want to fly until they get the problem sorted out. Any ONE of these incidents could have resulted in a fireball on the runway with hundreds of fatalities.

 

 

[NYLIBUD]

Pretty frighting stuff to say the least.Hmm,?I knew there was a reason I hate to fly,I mean you have no control of this piece of tin traveling a few hundred miles per hour.And why I haven’t been on a plane since 2008,when i flew to Miami with my EX girlfriend,and I know how that trip ended up.?Some people are going to lose their jobs over these incidents..Hey,I’m sure being both an airline pilot,and an air traffic control are very stressful jobs…. But come on.

Edited April 25, 2024 by NYLIBUD

[OldTrucker]

Have an acquaintance that quit in January, Said it was just took taxing and stressful. More since the 2020, 2021-22 problems.

Working extra hours because of no-shows, called in on days off and working short handed a lot! Things we don't hear about.

Said they have people who do this chronically even just announcing they don't feel good and leaving without a replacement so you wind up doubling up what you are responsible for!

The real kicker, these ones doing this don't get fired!

[peteski]

They don't get fired because that industry is short-staffed to start, and can't find anybody to take the job. I also heard that the ATC equipment they use is really ancient. I wonder how long it will take for AI to replace human ATCs, and how well that will work?  Scary!

[Ace-Garageguy]

  On 4/24/2024 at 10:39 PM, peteski said:

...I also heard that the ATC equipment they use is really ancient...

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I haven't been directly involved with aviation for some years now, but when I was, the ATC software was built on top of "legacy" programs, patches on top of patches on top of patches, and none of the then-current crop of IT guys had any working knowledge of the underlying system, and the geezers who did were either dead or gone fishing.

Probably getting AI to design a completely new system would be the hot setup now, as AI could also build insanely complex simulations to debug it before launching it into real time.

HOWEVER...I may be giving AI at its current level of development too much credit, but it seems awfully capable to me. The problem remains though...GIGO...and that's where biased or just second-rate humans in the loop can ruin what AI is capable of on its own.

Air Traffic Control needs to be the absolute BEST system people and machines can devise, and there's simply no place for ANY focus other then robust excellence across the board.

 

Edited April 24, 2024 by Ace-Garageguy

[89AKurt]

Just another sign that humanity is close to a breaking point of implosion.  We are living in a very tenuous existence.  Read an article about the ships that are specialized in fixing undersea cables, there are very few people who want to be on a ship while fixing something 2-3 miles under the surface.  They are concerned about finding new people to replace them.  Same with the construction industry, I'm retiring because of the building departments, and can see there aren't many youngsters willing to jump in.  We are going to get to a point that the only jobs are fixing everything that is way beyond useable operational life, we cannot grow (like a virus, 'The Matrix') so much before this catches up and consumes humanity.  Sorry for the very pessimistic world view, that's the curse of getting old.  The day after my last flight on a Southwest 737, an engine cowling came off over Denver, next time I visit my grandson I'm taking the risk of driving among more idiots.

[peteski]

  On 4/25/2024 at 3:41 PM, 89AKurt said:

The day after my last flight on a Southwest 737, an engine cowling came off over Denver, next time I visit my grandson I'm taking the risk of driving among more idiots.

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While not the greatest option nowadays, of possible take the train.

[89AKurt]

  On 4/25/2024 at 11:08 PM, peteski said:

While not the greatest option nowadays, of possible take the train.

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I took Amtrak from Chicago to north of me, a stop that has been dropped since, Williams Junction, several years ago.  At first it was fun, but I hated it towards the end.  The best moment was eating breakfast with an elderly couple, second best was getting off the train.  Been there done that, never again unless it's a tourist day trip like the Silverton Durango narrow gauge.

[OldTrucker]

  On 4/26/2024 at 2:50 AM, 89AKurt said:

I took Amtrak from Chicago to north of me, a stop that has been dropped since, Williams Junction, several years ago.  At first it was fun, but I hated it towards the end.  The best moment was eating breakfast with an elderly couple, second best was getting off the train.  Been there done that, never again unless it's a tourist day trip like the Silverton Durango narrow gauge.

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Haven't been on a train since my trip to the AFIC in Chicago and an overnight in the cockroach hotel followed by my first commercial airline flight!

[Bronzekeg]

I know what the problem is but can't say because of forum rules.

[bobss396]

The ATC woes is a sister act to the ongoing Boeing saga. I know a couple of guys who were fired back in 1981 (?) and they always had a harrowing tale to relate with near misses. I worked on an ATC project back around 1982, that division got sold off by 1985.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Interesting incident a few days back with a controller arguing over the radio with a seasoned instructor pilot about a particular maneuver he did, and she used as her authoritative source "I GOOGLED IT!!!".

She was 100% wrong both in what she told him (not being a pilot herself and believing an incorrect source she didn't know enough to ignore) and in the way she handled it. 

Edited May 10, 2024 by Ace-Garageguy