Very Interesting...

[The Creative Explorer]

I do like both magazines, I have had a subscription to Scale Auto and when I was in the States, I bought a couple of MCM magazines at a local hobbystore. Personally I don't have huge funds and living in Europe doesn't make things easier.

We don't have any car-only modelmagazines, so it has to be imported from the States. 2 years ago, I chose Scale auto because I didn't knew MCM existed. now I am in doubt, I have a strong preference for MCM, but it's price is working against me.

If I go for Scale auto, I have to pay 89,95 for 18 issues over 3 years. When I choose MCM, it costs me 123,00. When I break it down, it is 4,99 for SAM and 6,83 for MCM. I know it is easier for SAM to ship and makes it cheaper, but with all the words about the late issues and getting damaged, it doubts me a lot.

[mikemodeler]

Harry,

Thank you for the math, I already knew the costs but am glad my math matches yours.

It has never been about cost as much as it has been about consistency. Your efforts have had a great effect on the quality of the magazine, unfortunately the biggest problem remains out of your control.

Real easy to take the "hey, it's only a magazine and I don't mind if it is late" attitude but then why not apply that same lame attitude to my modeling? Why offer tips in the magazine if improving upon past performance isn't really necessary? Let's go back to sewing thread for wires, silver paint for trim, thick brush paint jobs etc. because afterall, if I can accept an inconsistent schedule for the magazine, surely they will accept inconsistent build quality for features, right?

[ian ashton]

Just curious, but if everyone here, (just in this thread alone), were to contribute an article to the magazine, how will that solve it's erratic publication schedule or spotty distribution?

Distribution is one thing, but every car magazine editor I know will tell you content deadlines are the hardest part of the job. I'm positive that is one (if not THE) reason why they are late with new issues. Producing a magazine like that with quality content 9 times a year is a ton of work. Quality contributors = quality product

[mikemodeler]

Distribution is one thing, but every car magazine editor I know will tell you content deadlines are the hardest part of the job. I'm positive that is one (if not THE) reason why they are late with new issues. Producing a magazine like that with quality content 9 times a year is a ton of work. Quality contributors = quality product

Ian,

I would leave the speculation up to Gregg or Harry on why the magazine is late. I think they have the insight as to why they are behind. In the past Gregg admitted he was part of the delay and with him having final say on the magazine, I would suspect he would know.

[PatRedmond]

Ever hear the term "Biting the hand that feeds you", BM??

STFU.

[PatRedmond]

Running down the publication that fuels this board is attached to is disgusting.

THINK.

Edited January 24, 2011 by PatRedmond

[93Z34]

Well, if I knew this topic would stir so many feathers I would have simply kept my thoughts to myself. Sorry...

[Harry P.]

Well, if I knew this topic would stir so many feathers I would have simply kept my thoughts to myself. Sorry...

There's no need to ever apologize for having an opinion!

It's the people who take threads like this down the wrong path that need to do the apologizing.

[PatRedmond]

I'd also like to see the magazine grow and improve. No question.

I guess I find your contributions incendiary at the best of times.

It must be me.

[charlie8575]

Personally, I've begun to prefer Model Cars over Scale Auto, and did so many years ago. Ever since the present proprietor of Scale Auto took it over, I really feel it went down hill. I don't buy many magazines right now, even ones I want. I simply can't.

Yes- there are issues (no pun intended) with Model Cars re: timeliness, distribution and mutilation of issues received by subscribers, and YES- they must be fixed if the market is to truly take it seriously.

I don't know too much about magazine production, but I do know a little about production management as a broad topic, and the bottom line is the product must be out when it's supposed to be out. Of course, problems happen beyond all our control and those need to be dealt with as they come up, but a consistent predictable production schedule is the first thing that needs to be done, whether you're dealing with magazines, cars, stoves or service goods.

I don't know what I might be able to do to help, but if you need a scheduling manager, I'd be more than willing to give it a shot.

Charlie Larkin

[PatRedmond]

I guess i'm seeing it differently.

Constructive discussions are wonderful. I just don't see this one constructive.

AGAIN, it must be me.

[samdiego]

Well, if I knew this topic would stir so many feathers I would have simply kept my thoughts to myself. Sorry...

C'mon, a little family squabble, where's the harm? Variety is the spice and all.

Unless you're actually having a prob with feathered people

There is no way to make everybody happy every single time. Just doing the reviews that I do can be really challenging at times. Actually the hardest ones were three Gregg had me do that had to be short, 75 words or so. It was a forehead slapfest for me figuring that out. I can't imagine what The Hawaiian and Harry go through

Edited January 24, 2011 by samdiego

[jbwelda]

say didnt i post in this thread yesterday?

why i believe i did. and now i dont see the post.

thats kinda funny. anyone care to point out to me how i am not correct?

[Danno]

"Board Rules and Guidelines

Please remember to follow these basic Forum rules:

1) No vulgar language. This board was created for modelers of all ages and offensive language is completely unacceptable."

Unless the "F" in "STFU" means something different in Canadianesque, I don't think that using this kind of language toward other board members is really warranted. You don't have to like what Bluesman Mark says, or agree with him, or even like him as a person. However, this clearly goes beyond, to use your own term, "constructive discussion" doesn't it Pat? I think maybe you owe Mark an apology, maybe Gregg too.

Mark, I think he's exempt from the rules.

[Modelmartin]

I actually was a subscriber to SAE #1 and I endeavored to keep the set complete even when the content of the mag was not so great but finally in 2010 I couldn't take it anymore! When the editor starts doing multi-page articles showing how he bungles builds and then reviews really cheesey snap kits - you know it is going downhill! The last straw for me was the centerspread of that model of the Jungle Jim funny car. I don't want to rip on the builder or the model. I am sure he is proud of it and all but it was not a centerspread-worthy model. A single pic of it in contest coverage would be more appropriate. It was quite mediocre as is the mag. I don't buy magazines to see features about beginner models. Perhaps some do but it is hard to be inspired by it. Do you buy car magazines to see your neighbor's Ford Focus or Toyota Camry?

Model Cars still is interesting to me. I don't care about delivery schedules and such although I recognize the importance of it. I care about the content and the writing. This is what it boils down to for me: I believe that Gregg has a passion for model cars and it is just a job for Jim H.

[scummy]

I stopped buying SA not long after the new ownership because of poor content and less pages , and NEVER missed it .

I only stop buying MCM when local model shop wanted $20 bucks a copy , and missed it since !

Yer i hear ya i just might subscribe !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Guest]

Ever hear the term "Biting the hand that feeds you", BM??

STFU.

Interesting. Mr. Gregg said some time back that even swearing like this would result in someone being banned instantly. And they say there is no favoratism here, what a bunch of baloney.

[Peter Lombardo]

I am not in the publishing business, nor do I want to be. I can only imagine how difficult it must be….deadline after deadline. I also think finding relative and interesting content must also be difficult today. As advertisers dwindle, so does revenues. As new product slows, so does the excitement on new “stuffâ€â€¦.the lifeblood of the hobby. As less “new be’s†numbers drop, so does circulation.

I used to get a few golf magazines but stopped them….I mean; really, every issue had articles on “how to cure my slice†or “how to drain every puttâ€, or even, “How to hit it fartherâ€. Then they would have the same old interviews with golfing “Millionaires†that I really don’t need to hear about. The only information I really appreciated was the equipment reviews, but really, I don’t buy golf equipment that often. The point of this is the magazines became boring, predictable, over loaded with the same old ads and not entertaining enough to read.

I think the same can be true for model magazines too….especially for us more “seasoned†builders. I think Gregg and Harry, and this is just my opinion…I could be totally out of whack here, have a very difficult time making a magazine that is interesting, different and relevant each issue. How many articles about “how to apply Bare Metal Foilâ€, or “how to make door hinges†or “how to polish a car to a killer shineâ€? Think about it, most of us know these things. And in an age of slowing growth….less younger modelers coming into the hobby….there just is less need for all of these “how to†articles. And on top of that, this very forum stands in direct competition with the magazine, as we post “how to†stuff in here every day. We post new pictures every minute of every day. Back in the day (before the forum), I would get the two model magazines and pour through them looking for pictures of “new†builds because I was very interested in what everyone else was building.

Think about this, when someone opens a post here, they go straight for the pictures. I tend to write as detailed an explanation of my builds as possible to go along with my pictures, but I am willing to bet that most just look at the pictures. We all go for the “eye candyâ€â€¦.just like in the old days with “Playboyâ€â€¦.hey, I didn’t “read†the magazine for the articles….did you?

So how do you keep a “print†magazine relevant in an electronic age? Especially difficult when you manage an electronic forum that is FREE and in direct competition with yourself in a time with dwindling new relative content? The younger kids coming into the age where they could get into modeling have way too many distractions today. When I was a kid, back in the early 1960’s, this was it…modeling was one of the great hobbies to get into. Not today. To many electronic games, gadgets and toys to contend with.

On top of that, there really isn’t much “New†in the model kit industry today…..sure we get a smattering of new product and re-issues of old stuff, but paint is paint…glue is glue…putty is putty….and….plastic is plastic. Keeping a magazine full of new content is difficult enough, but when the subject matter is staying static, it is even more difficult. We are a very demanding bunch…if we don’t get new exciting pictures, new releases and new techniques every issue, we cry out that it is boring. Just like the Golf magazines….Woods are Woods, Irons are Irons and a good swing cures all ills. Model magazines face the same obstacles. Paint is paint, plastic is plastic, and new content and product makes us happy.

The hobby is relatively static, therefore content is relatively static. Sure, I am over simplifying a bit here. Glues have improved and paints have improved over time too….even the molding process has improved from the ‘60’s to today, but really, a 1957 Chevy circa 1962, and a 1957 chevy from 2001 are not that much different. We need a few new innovations to bring some new interest to the hobby and the magazine. I think the next big “thing†will be the ability for us to make our own model car kits from a computer database with a new generation of Stereo lithography machines….but that is still a little way off.

It is a shame we don’t have a Tiger Woods in the modeling community….you know, someone who could get press overage outside of the tight little modeling community that we have. Someone to draw attention to the hobby through exploits outside of the hobby….any volunteers?

Anyway, I don’t envy Gregg and Harry here, they are fighting an uphill battle keeping the magazine smart and relevant in a time when the main subject matter is standing relatively still.

Ok, rebuttals please. :) :)

[mikemodeler]

Peter-

Well said and painfully true. I tried to get my kids involved in modeling but they have chosen electronic entertainment instead.

The part about keeping it relevant is so true given the instant information world we live in. Why go to a model show if you have seen most of the models online in a forum or two? The details have already been explained in the forum posts, usually with WIP photo shots.

Maybe the Revell contest with Stacey David will draw some interest and new blood into our hobby. Getting exposure on a TV program can't hurt and maybe it will become an annual thing, who knows.

Thanks for posting.

[Harry P.]

Peter, you made some very good points. It is hard to come up with new content month after month, it is hard to have enough variation to please everyone (well, not literally everyone, that's impossible... but we try to have a wide variety of features), and it is hard to avoid the "same old" type of articles.

And as far as this forum cutting into the magazine's sales, yeah, I'm sure it does to an extent. There are plenty of people who spend a lot of time here that have never bought a single copy of the magazine. "Why buy the cow when the milk is free?" comes to mind.

The reason we have a free forum is that A: theoretically people will like it, the word will get out, and ultimately more people might buy the magazine... and B, because the other guys have one.

And then there's the fact that Gregg is a nice guy and he simply wants you guys to have this free forum!

[lizardlust]

One valid difference between MCM and the competition - how long do you think a similar discussion would have been allowed at the "other place's" forum???

[Dr. Cranky]

Okay, here's Doctor Cranky's ten cents--not that anybody asked --I got back into the hobby around the last few issues of Plastic Fanatic, but that magazine threw me into a whirlwind of model-building activity, why? Because it was a magazine that reminded you of how much fun model building is.

I think the same energy and vision continues into MCM, and it's the only magazine that I subscribe to currently (I pick up Tamiya at the bookstore) because I enjoy the pleasant surprises in it. The fact that you get a variety of voices and styles. It's great to have an article by say Tim Boyd AND then another by Chuck "Count Chuckola". MCM is not afraid to take risks with cutting-edge matirial, say rat rods, the Post-Apocypse--any of those things that I happen to be interested in as a builder.

That OTHER magazine is way too repetitive, and other than Ken Hamilton's columns which I read religiously (at the bookstore, but I don't buy it!) AND STALE. It's a magazine that had a lot of potential a few years ago, but now it's too squeaky clean when it comes to subject matter. It's a magazine that worries too much about WHAT PARENTS ARE GOING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT NEXT!

Personally I left that OTHER forum a few years ago when I got tired of getting my hands slapped way too many times.

In short, a magazine that lacks forward-vision and diversity is bound for doom and failure . . . or an editorial board change, which might be too late . . .

[PatRedmond]

I apologize for using 'F'.

[samdiego]

As per Pete's suggestion, I will stand up to be the Tiger Woods that we obviously need. Not that my modeling skills are the styrene equivalent of TW's golf skills, I am referring specifically to his dating habits and the SUV crashing (I've never gotten to wreck a car, I must be missing out).

As for my skills both on the greens and on the bench, I think I could do better with a baseball bat but they won't let me. You guys can thank me later. And the movie deal. I'm working on a screenplay about model car builders by day who use their scale skills to fight crime in the later afternoon, mostly until the streetlights come on.

Get ready, we are in for a boatload of prime positive publicity. Maybe a 1/177 scale boat.

[Harry P.]

Ok, on the different content, a direct comparison between both mags.

The last issue of MCM I found & bought some time last year had that beautiful 1/12 scale black 67 Corvette on the cover, along with an article on it, purporting it to be an accurate representation in scale of the 1/1 car. Well, it had a set of the rally rims from the 1/12 scale 69 Camaro. All well & good, however, the 67 Rallys had a one year only center cap that is different from the Rallys for 68 on. Now I understand that there is no representation of the 67 Rally rims in 1/12 scale, but at no point in that article was it even mentioned that the rims weren't 100% accurate for a 67 Chevy. making it appear that the model was an accurate replica stock build, which it couldn't be, due to the rims. Now, while I'm sure most of us know the difference, it's somehwat important that the difference be mentioned, so those that don't know aren't given misleading information.

Both magazines have their strengths & weaknessess, but overall SA provides more content across all spectrums of the car modeling hobby, from beginner, to "middle of the road" modeler, through to the "lunatic fringe" whack-a-loons such as myself, who live & breathe styrene. :)

To your first point: It was never claimed that the model was a 100% correct-to-the-last-detail replica, and no "misleading information" was given. In fact, to quote from the article itself: "Keeping with the unique theme of the build, I added the rally rims from the Camaro kit"... there was no intent to give any misleading information.

You are really picking on some very small nits with your commment.

To your second point: Are you serious???

How many articles about jet-drive boats, old steam tractors, diorama building, old promos and vintage kits and their history, how box art is done, how to build a photo backdrop, etc. have appeared "over there" lately? These, and many more, have all appeared in MCM.

I don't see how MCM doesn't offer content across all spectrums of the car modeling hobby.

O for 2, Mark.