My personal feelings about Issue #158's contents....

[Danno]

I have a couple of diecasts that when I look at them it makes me feel like not building a model because they are really good, until I remember that someone had to assemble such a model somewhere . . . hum, let me guess: CHINA?

Yeah. And here's something for the hoity-toity model building snobs to think about: Those highly detailed, finely crafted outstandingly constructed exquisite-looking diecast mint models were assembled/detailed/built by young, 3rd-world slave laborers behind the erstwhile iron curtain!

Consider that next time you're sweating some BMF.

Edited May 18, 2011 by Danno

[Danno]

Well guys, this one man's,opinion certainly isn't going to change how anyone else thinks and that's ok...I just felt like expressing how I felt about it.

I don't look DOWN on diecast collectors....but it's like you said Harry...apples and oranges! Guys who purchase diecasts are collectors not modelers (if all they do is buy one). It's all in the process of how you get to have any model in your collection. I prefer to build them...some guys don't. No problem.

As for the woodworking/table analogy..well the difference there is similar to here. The guy who makes the table is a woodworker...the guy who buys one is not. Doesn't make him inferior at all...just different. The simple buyer probably cares not for the process of woodworking....he simply wants a table. And Chuck, of course the guy who buys a house is a homeowner...but he's not a carpenter! Same with diecast collectors...the guy who builds a model is a modeler and the guy who buys a diecast is not...at least in that particular purchase. No one said the guy who bought the table, the house or the diecast was INFERIOR. No, just different.

Traditionally the car model magazines have been all about the process of going from a kit to a finished model. IMHO, simply collecting diecasts does not fit that tradition. I will however concede that taking a diecast apart and rebuilding it or weathering it as in the case of the tractor, is modeling...the fact that it's made of metal is irrelevant. However, there is a difference in this case...the rebuilder has an easier job because he isn't starting with a kit...he's taking something apart and reassembling it after repainting or weathering it. Small difference but nevertheless a difference.

I just feel that the magazine should be all about the process of building, not collecting. There are diecast magazines out there that cover the diecast cars.

Precisely!

Total agreement. We're really very much in agreement here.

But, I'll interject my own, final, extra two-cents:

I don't mind an occasional MCM article about an exceptional die cast, either, but I don't want to see coverage of run-of-the-mill WalTarMart stuff ... and I don't want to see the frequency of 'exceptional die cast' articles get out of proportion, either. There are other mags that cater to that genre.

Buy it and shelve it, you might as well be buying hummel figurines or tourist bells, you're not a modeler. Build it or rebuild it and it really doesn't matter what media you started with, you're a modeler (as long as it looks like what it's supposed to represent).

'Nuff said.

[Danno]

If you OWN the house Chuck, then yes. If NOT, then no. Unless your renting to own.

Not 'unless.' If renting to own, still not a homeowner yet. Still a renter. May be or will be a homeowner some day, but the place still belongs to someone else in the meantime.

But his analogy would have been better if stated, "Because I own a house does not make me a homebuilder."

[Terry Sumner]

I said this earlier, but it bears repeating ... expecting to have your socks knocked off by every single article in any publication is kind of like expecting Ed McMahon to show up at your door with an over-sized novelty check, even though Ed McMahon has been dead for some time now ...

Ken...who said anything like that? I sure didn't.

[Harry P.]

I will however concede that taking a diecast apart and rebuilding it or weathering it as in the case of the tractor, is modeling...the fact that it's made of metal is irrelevant. However, there is a difference in this case...the rebuilder has an easier job because he isn't starting with a kit...he's taking something apart and reassembling it after repainting or weathering it. Small difference but nevertheless a difference.

I would say it's just the opposite–that the guy who starts with a pre-built diecast model, takes it all apart, strips the paint, corrects all the flaws and adds a ton of detail not present in the original model, repaints and rebuilds it–he has done a heck of a lot more work that the guy who starts with an unbuilt kit.

But I agree with everything else you said.

[Danno]

terry, im sure you know that back in the 80's they did infact make diecast kits that you actually have to paint and assemble with glue!!

i built one a while back, it was a stingray vette, horrible kit, but cool to build up.

the body, doors, and hood were all metal, the rest of the kit was plastic.

you got the body parts in raw metal that was cleared, you had to sand it all off and paint it your choice.

Jeff

Building a metal model of a plastic car is just plain wrong! No matter what magazine covers it.

[Greg Myers]

???

You said you expect the majority of the features (in the magazine) to cover plastic model cars.

And I said that they do.

So where do we disagree?

From the first post in this thread : " model CARS...not tractors or diecasts or trucks or motorcycles or boats. The title of the magazine is "Model Cars."" I think.

[Harry P.]

From the first post in this thread : " model CARS...not tractors or diecasts or trucks or motorcycles or boats. The title of the magazine is "Model Cars."" I think.

Oh, I see. I get you now.

But I have to disagree with you on one point... a diecast model car is a model car. Nowhere is it written that to qualify as a "model car," the model must be made of plastic.

[Von Don Koolkat]

The model car hobby is not big enough to support just one narrowly focused type of commercially produced magazine. They MUST be more generalized to survive.

A broader range of subject matter insures a wider circulation. Too broad of subject matter will insure a loss of interest by readers.

It's difficult to find the right balance as a magazine can't please EVERYBODY, and would be foolish to try to do that.

[Harry P.]

It's difficult to find the right balance as a magazine can't please EVERYBODY...

Amen!

[Terry Sumner]

Perhaps not in so many words, but the fact that you'd take the time to go on the Internet and kvetch endlessly about one lousy article certainly would imply it, though.

"kvetch endlessly"??? Ken you have an acerbic way of stating things.

[Darin Bastedo]

"kvetch endlessly"??? Ken you have an acerbic way of stating things.

I don't even know what kvetch means!

[Harry P.]

I don't even know what kvetch means!

You need a Yiddish dictionary!

[Greg Myers]

LOOK OUT! Isn't this the part where we usually go off the . . .

[Harry P.]

LOOK OUT! Isn't this the part where we usually go off the . . .

Maybe not. Maybe we can all keep this going without any problems. So far so good...

[highway]

Well guys, this one man's,opinion certainly isn't going to change how anyone else thinks and that's ok...I just felt like expressing how I felt about it.

I don't look DOWN on diecast collectors....but it's like you said Harry...apples and oranges! Guys who purchase diecasts are collectors not modelers (if all they do is buy one). It's all in the process of how you get to have any model in your collection. I prefer to build them...some guys don't. No problem.

As for the woodworking/table analogy..well the difference there is similar to here. The guy who makes the table is a woodworker...the guy who buys one is not. Doesn't make him inferior at all...just different. The simple buyer probably cares not for the process of woodworking....he simply wants a table. And Chuck, of course the guy who buys a house is a homeowner...but he's not a carpenter! Same with diecast collectors...the guy who builds a model is a modeler and the guy who buys a diecast is not...at least in that particular purchase. No one said the guy who bought the table, the house or the diecast was INFERIOR. No, just different.

Traditionally the car model magazines have been all about the process of going from a kit to a finished model. IMHO, simply collecting diecasts does not fit that tradition. I will however concede that taking a diecast apart and rebuilding it or weathering it as in the case of the tractor, is modeling...the fact that it's made of metal is irrelevant. However, there is a difference in this case...the rebuilder has an easier job because he isn't starting with a kit...he's taking something apart and reassembling it after repainting or weathering it. Small difference but nevertheless a difference.

I just feel that the magazine should be all about the process of building, not collecting. There are diecast magazines out there that cover the diecast cars.

I would say it's just the opposite–that the guy who starts with a pre-built diecast model, takes it all apart, strips the paint, corrects all the flaws and adds a ton of detail not present in the original model, repaints and rebuilds it–he has done a heck of a lot more work that the guy who starts with an unbuilt kit.

But I agree with everything else you said.

Terry, I wholehearted respect your opinions, this is sort of apples and oranges, but I'm going to throw some peaches into the mix! It was mentioned by Jeff earlier about the older unpainted diecast kits, one of which I had in my younger days, an Ertl early 80s Ford Bronco that received many 10 year old playtime miles! I don't play with them anymore (much ), but I do still enjoy a diecast kit every now and then, as I showed earlier in the thread with the diecast Impala police car, but here are where the peaches come in, and also why I highlighted the portion of your post, highlighted in blue, Harry quoted in his response I quoted above. These are just a couple of my "rainy day" diecast kits I quickly pulled of the shelf, and in the apples and oranges, these "peaches" are clearly not prebuilt diecasts.

Testors/Italeri Corvette ZR-1

Testors BMW X5

These are a couple I have already built, both were Testors Lincoln Mint diecast kits.

69 GTO Judge

69 Charger

I do agree most with prebuilt diecast are probably collectors and not builders, but then again there are probably more like me who are both. I have a quite extensive diecast collection as well as my collection of all media of kits, while most of my diecast will never be disassembled and rebuilt, such as my Dale Earnhardt diecasts like this one.

I guess I just see it this way, saying diecasts are not models would be just like saying model railroaders are not modelers, which is far from the truth. I also dabble in railroading too, and much of my rolling stock are kits like this!

[Kit Basher]

Regarding Harry's table analogy, I am a professional woodworker, and I am sad to say that you could probably find this same discussion on a woodworking forum. Some of those would say the guy who buys a table IS inferior. I don't agree, but that's the way it goes.

As far as the tractor is concerned, I appreciate quality workmanship and am interested in techniques, no matter what the subject. I think anyone who is interested in learning how to weather and detail could learn a lot from that article, and use it on whatever they wanted to build. Course, I'm biased, I like tractors.

Edited May 19, 2011 by basher

[Jordan White]

I will add that the only diecasts I still buy are the 1/18th scale. I do have some 1/24th scale diecasts, but I don't really like them due to the lack of detail compared to a 1/24th plastic model kit that I can build myself. The 1/18th scale diecasts also offer some subjects that aren't in plastic...plus I like the larger detail.

[Harry P.]

I will add that the only diecasts I still buy are the 1/18th scale. I do have some 1/24th scale diecasts, but I don't really like them due to the lack of detail compared to a 1/24th plastic model kit that I can build myself.

You obviously have never seen a Danbury Mint diecast...

[Kaleb]

To some people a tractor is a car. Not to mention their only way to make money. I collect die-cast Cars or I should refer to them as Miniature Replicas of an Original Car.

[Jordan White]

You obviously have never seen a Danbury Mint diecast...

Those are the (costly) exception.

[Rob Hall]

You obviously have never seen a Danbury Mint diecast...

I like the Danbury and Franklin Mint diecasts..have a bunch of their '50s subjects...

For great detail, I like Exotos also...I have a couple of their 1:18th '60s Lotus 49s..

Edited May 19, 2011 by Rob Hall

[lordairgtar]

Where I live riding lawn mowers ARE cars . . . people who lose their liscense ride them over to the liquor store!

That happens in Wisconsin all the time.

[lordairgtar]

This tractor was made to be used as a car to go to town. Would this be a model car?

Edited May 19, 2011 by lordairgtar

[Gregg]

I hate to bring this up (I didn't read all six pages of comments yet, so I may have missed it), but for the past 100 issues, Wayne Moyer has been bringing us our Collector's Corner since day one!

What, wait, 100 issues?

You mean you have done 100 issues already, and there was no big fanfare, no headline splash on the top of the magazine claiming to be number one?

Nope

Nada

Just 100 issues of your favorite model car magazine, by builders, and collectors, of anything automotive, be it cars, bikes, trucks, vans, plastic, metal, resin, even PAPER!!!!

Terry, thanks for your thread on this, and your opinion is appreciated.

MCM is about model cars, and that covers a lot

We did that great feature on the Franklin Mint/Danbury Mint rebuilds just a few issues ago, Jeff Koch has done a few diecast pieces, we have some Hot Wheels pieces coming up, and more diverse subjects, and materials, in the works.

I can't please all the people all the time.

That's a given.

But I do the best I can.

Harry knows and has a great feel for the mag, and I just his judgment on this as well.

I even had slot cars in MCM in the beginning, under Model Car Racing.

So, I guess we can say this is pau, yes?

mahalo nui loa

and watch for more interesting and different model cars coming soon.

Yes, even some more paper ones too!