W-409 Posted April 12, 2014 Posted April 12, 2014 (edited) After finishing the '62 Impala Super Stock, it's time to start a new one. I've been planning on starting this one for a while now and finally I decided to put my hands into it. So what I'll build is a Lindberg's Don Nicholson '61 Impala kit that is a bit simple. I have started building this one already years ago, but it kinda stalled because Lindberg's horrible looking engine and other problems... Now I'll try to fix them as my "donor" will be an old built up of AMT '62 Bel Air (Non-Race Car kit). My plan is to use the 409 from that AMT kit and everything else from Lindberg. I have to do some modifying for the engine, however, as there was no option for two 4bbl carbs for 409 in '61. But I believe finding a proper intake is not a problem. I'm not going to build a very close replica of the real thing, but I want to create a car that has the right look and feel so that people can recognize that it's a Dyno Don's car. I have good pictures from outside the car, but I have no idea about the engine. I see there comes a scoop through the hood, so I'm wondering what kind of intake manifold has been installed under the hood. If anyone knows this, it would be a very good information. This is what I'll be using: Lindberg '61 Impala and AMT '62 Bel Air built up that I bought a couple of years ago. "Let's uninstall the engine...." Here is a comparison between Lindberg's poor 409 and AMT's much better 409. I built the Lindberg engine to that point years ago until I realized that it's way too poor quality to be installed under the hood of this beautiful car. Especially the shape of the intake and valve covers is not good, but it is really simplified overall. It can be installed somewhere where it can be hidden. These parts will go to the paint stripper... I've painted the interior poorly also, so I need to re-do it as well. Interior pictures of the real car would be fine, too, if someone would have them. I don't know what areas of the seats should be red or white, or if they shouldn't even be two tone... Thanks for lookin' in, I'll update as I go. So if anyone would have info/pics of the engine or interior, I'd highly appreciate it. Edited April 12, 2014 by W-409
slusher Posted April 12, 2014 Posted April 12, 2014 Great project, I will watch as I enjoy your builds..
10thumbs Posted April 12, 2014 Posted April 12, 2014 Hi Niko, What's wrong with the orange 409? Looks good to me. The pieces do not fit well, agreed. Fill the cracks between the heads/intake/block/pump etc. and get on with it. I like to dissolve rest casting frames and pieces in ethyl acetate, in other words, the stuff glue is made of. It dissolves plastic when immersed, and you can just brush it on to fill cracks. I do think though, the 409 was offered with 2-4's in 1961. I think the 409 was always available as a 2 carb option. That's what made the 409 so fine. She's so fine, the 409. Michael
W-409 Posted April 13, 2014 Author Posted April 13, 2014 Thanks Guys! Michael: The biggest problems with that Lindberg's engine are the intake manifold, which looks absolutely horrible. Of course it could be changed, but another problem is the valve covers. Their shape just don't look good to me. But overall, AMT's engine is much better quality... It has more parts, they are sharper and more accurate. The AMT engine is now in paint stripping, but I hope to have it back soon to clean the parts and get some paint on it. There was only one version of 409 available in 1961. It was with one Carter AFB carburetor and made 360 hp. Here is a quote from 348-409.com: "There was only one version of the 409 in 1961. It was the 360hp. It was equipped with solid lifters, high lift cam, and a 4-barrel Carter AFB carburetor. In 1962, a 380hp could be had. More importantly the 409hp 409 with 2 4-barrel Carter AFB's was now available. This is the one that the Beach boys were singing about in '62."
W-409 Posted April 26, 2014 Author Posted April 26, 2014 Not much done here, I've been building the interior for my 1:1 car and playing guitar... Luckily the interior is pretty much done, so I'll probably have more time to spend with this one. I got the engine back from paint stripping. After some sanding I was able to get the halves glued together. The seam needed only minor cleanup, so I painted the engine block and a couple of other engine parts with Model Master's Chevy Engine Orange. It dried a bit flat, so I clear coated the parts with thinned Revell's clear. Valve covers are painted with Humbrol Metallic #56 as well as the transmission.
gtx6970 Posted April 26, 2014 Posted April 26, 2014 Did some digging about this very car a while back Dyno Don's '61 Impala 409. In 1961, 409 engines were never factory installed, they were ordered by the dealers and shipped to the dealers, and the car owner had to install them himself. That was the last year that NHRA permitted Super Stock cars to have non-factory installed engines. in 1962, all the Chevy's with 409 engines were factory installed. This '61 started the ball rolling. Done operated the chassis dyno (one of the few around at the time) at Service Chevrolet in Pasadena. I purchased my '62 409 from Service Chevrolet and Don tuned it. He was the "tune-up guy" for the dealer. The blower scoop on the hood was eventually found to not be "legal" and was eventually removed http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=403865&page=5
1972coronet Posted April 27, 2014 Posted April 27, 2014 "OS/S" ... don't hear about that class too often ! "Optional Super / Stock" . Very cool !
Old Coyote Posted April 27, 2014 Posted April 27, 2014 The "409's" that debuted at the '61 Winternationals in Pomona were equipped with single Carter four barrels ............... but by the time the US Nationals opened at Indianapolis in September, the new class ( O/SS ) had been created and most of the '61 409 equipped cars were sporting new heads, a new camshaft grind, and a pair of Carter AFB's on a new intake manifold. That setup was basically the same as seen on the '62 SS/S 409's
Danno Posted April 27, 2014 Posted April 27, 2014 Watching this one . . . there just aren't enough good 409 models out there!
W-409 Posted April 28, 2014 Author Posted April 28, 2014 Thanks for the information and comments! Bill: I wonder about the hood scoop. According to Jonh's information, the car has two Carter AFB's, I wonder where the scoop is mounted in... I see no hole on the hood where the scoop would be sticking through, to me the dark grey area in this picture looks more like a shadow of the scoop than a real hole on the hood. Would the 2 Carter AFB's be so high setup that with the scoop it would stick out of the hood like that? John: Great information! I think I'll install those two Carters under the hood, then. I'm really surprised about the amount of information this forum has. It is very good to have knowledge how these things really were, Thanx Guys!!! That hood scoop issue is my biggest concern now... I hope someone would have some information on that one, too...
Old Coyote Posted May 2, 2014 Posted May 2, 2014 (edited) I really can't answer the question of how the scoop was attached to the carbs, as I have only seen the same pictures you have and never saw the actual car ........... but it was a "trademark" of Nicholson's .......... you can see the same setup on this '61 Biscayne that Nicholson prepared for Frank Sanders Edited May 2, 2014 by Old Coyote
W-409 Posted May 7, 2014 Author Posted May 7, 2014 Thanks Guys! First, I have to congratulate Mark. You did a great job with your Impala. I think if it was photographed in a "natural environment" it would be tough to tell if it's a real car or a model... Then the scoop. I was a bit afraid that no one would know how the scoop actually was attached. I've been thinking it a lot and I thought I would do so that I'll install the Carters regularly under the hood, then I'll drill two round holes on the hood over the carburetors and then make the scoop with also those two holes in the bottom plate. That would make air go to the carbs I guess. Of course if anyone has a better idea, I'd really appreciate hearing it, but for now I think this might be my best way. I'm sorry there's not much done. I've been very busy with the high school stuff and also we're building our Stock Eliminator Chevelle to be ready for the season opening that's coming in a bit over a week. Anyway I stripped paint from the intake. All paint didn't come off, so I have to continue removing it manually when I have time for that. The carburetors are resin pieces but I have no idea who made them.
Mister Twister Posted May 7, 2014 Posted May 7, 2014 Nice start here Niko....This will turn into one of your stellar builds. Good job!
W-409 Posted May 10, 2014 Author Posted May 10, 2014 Thanks Darryl! I appreciate it! Here's a bit more work with the '61. I started by drilling the carburetor throats open. That was really fast and easy, but made a huge difference as seen on picture #1. Then I painted them with Revell's #91 Silver and once that was dry, I mixed a bit of Humbrol's Clear Orange and some dirty thinner to get a bit like a gold shade on them. I also painted and cleared the intake. Wheel and tire combo is now decided, too. I'm using the tires so that rears are from AMT Racemaster Parts Pack and fronts come from Revell '60 Impala. Wheels are resin cast by a friend of mine. I mocked up the stance, and as I guessed, with higher front tires the front end lifted a bit, but it's still too low. Rear looks pretty good to me, but I will need to move the axle pins a bit on front to get it slightly higher.
Dragfreak Posted May 21, 2014 Posted May 21, 2014 Very nice Niko, have you made any more progress on it?
W-409 Posted May 25, 2014 Author Posted May 25, 2014 Thanks Guys for the comments! Unfortunately I've made no progress as I've been very busy with school and Drag Racing stuff. Last weekend there was the season opening in Finnish Championship Drag Race Series and I drove Stock & Super Stock there with the '74 Chevelle. I set four new ET records for that car and four new 60FT records as well. The Eliminator went well, too, now I'm on the third place in the points. And yesterday there was a West Coast Street Cup- event at Pori Airport which is not a Finnish Championship event. I set a new 60 FT record there as well! Anyway I'm planning on getting back to this one real soon. The summer vacation starts in one week, so stay tuned for more updates.
AZ Boy Posted May 25, 2014 Posted May 25, 2014 Congratulations Niko! Having a full-sized "model" to play with is far better than one in 1/24th scale.
W-409 Posted May 27, 2014 Author Posted May 27, 2014 Thanks Aaron! I agree with you, it's a lot of fun to be able to Drag Race in 1:1 scale, too. Here is a video from West Coast Street Cup that was on last weekend. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aMFeqyfz2dI Here's a little update on the Impala, too. I scratchbuilt the hood scoop, but I'm not completely sure if I like it or not. So I'd like to hear your honest opinion on that. Anyway the bottom part has two holes where air will go to the carburetors. Same size holes will be drilled on the hood when I can mock up the engine and see where those holes need to be located. If I will end up using that scoop, I have to do some finishing touches for it with Bondo. I'm sorry the pics are not the best. That thing was very hard to photograph.
Dragfreak Posted May 27, 2014 Posted May 27, 2014 (edited) Looks great Niko! Edited May 27, 2014 by Dragfreak
W-409 Posted May 28, 2014 Author Posted May 28, 2014 Thanks Jason... I appreciate it! I started assembling the engine. Nothing really special, but I got the valve covers, intake manifold and carburetors on. Timing Chain Cover was installed, too and I painted all bolts and nuts with silver. I also added some minor black wash to the engine to bring out some depth and I think it's a bit better now. The next step would be scratchbuilding headers as I can't put plug wires yet. I broke my drill bit that I used for them and now I gotta get a new one.
superbike-shaun Posted May 28, 2014 Posted May 28, 2014 Dude, that sucks you broke your spark plug d/b. but your build is goin off! nice 1.1 car also! you might want to thin your edges on the "scoop" (all the way around the inside) b4 you mount it. im sure you already know, Awesome build ,Shaun.s
Terminator-Fox Posted May 29, 2014 Posted May 29, 2014 I've had this kit in my stash for years. I was lucky enough to meet Dyno Don when I was a kid. Super nice guy, can't wait to see how this turns out Niko.
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