Moebius New trucks......KW, Peterbilt.....others? New trailer?

[chuckyr]

I wonder how much licensing is, it must be a lot.

Licensing is generally not expensive. What many businesses want to do is to protect their products or services image. Mack, for example is a major collector brand. Belt buckles, old toys, graphics to name a few are highly collectable by Mack enthusiasts To maintain the value of such items, Mack tries to protect the .integrity of the items that bear their name. Caterpillar is the same way. Kind of like Coke Cola, If you were to make one or two of an item with a particular businesses trademark for your own personal use, this would not be a problem. But if you try to sell them, then this would be a problem.

Also, businesses want their produces or services to represent them to the standard in which they want. That is why Moebius has to get final approval from International for the model trucks they offer.

And finally, bootlegging parts is pretty much stealing. All the effort and money to create is gone out the window when someone else uses your investment to make money without crediting the original creator.

[niteowl7710]

Dave - Would Moebius consider updating the LoneStar to 2015 specs? They seem to only come with Cummins ISX engines now, and they lost all of the tank skirts/fairings with the placement of the DEF tank behind the driver's side steer tire. Guys would probably buy it for the engine alone, plus if you just added the "open side" parts and the new engine on separate runners, it would allow the kit to be built in either variation.

[BigBad]

Licensing is generally not expensive. What many businesses want to do is to protect their products or services image. Mack, for example is a major collector brand. Belt buckles, old toys, graphics to name a few are highly collectable by Mack enthusiasts To maintain the value of such items, Mack tries to protect the .integrity of the items that bear their name. Caterpillar is the same way. Kind of like Coke Cola, If you were to make one or two of an item with a particular businesses trademark for your own personal use, this would not be a problem. But if you try to sell them, then this would be a problem.

Also, businesses want their produces or services to represent them to the standard in which they want. That is why Moebius has to get final approval from International for the model trucks they offer.

And finally, bootlegging parts is pretty much stealing. All the effort and money to create is gone out the window when someone else uses your investment to make money without crediting the original creator.

I agree with what you just said, and thanks for clearing some of the licensing principles. I think Mack would easily agree to let Moebius produce the Pinnacle or the Titan!

[chuckyr]

Dave - Would Moebius consider updating the LoneStar to 2015 specs? They seem to only come with Cummins ISX engines now, and they lost all of the tank skirts/fairings with the placement of the DEF tank behind the driver's side steer tire. Guys would probably buy it for the engine alone, plus if you just added the "open side" parts and the new engine on separate runners, it would allow the kit to be built in either variation.

Guys would probably buy it for the engine alone

http://www.auslowe.com.au/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=281&category_id=16&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=27

http://www.modelcarsmag.com/forums/?showtopic=40781

[chuckyr]

I agree with what you just said, and thanks for clearing some of the licensing principles. I think Mack would easily agree to let Moebius produce the Pinnacle or the Titan!

Yes, Mack would welcome model kits of their trucks. I was told that from a Mack representative. The issue is are there any model companies that would go through the process of getting a license from them.

I think Ertl/AMT Round2 LLC still has an active license agreement with Mack. The R600, Cruiseliner, DM600. DM800 and 1/32nd scale Superliner have been reissued over the years.

Revell has an active license agreement with Mack. The recently reissued Mack Bulldog and 1/32nd scale R600 confirm this.

I'm not sure if those license agreements entail producing modern, current model subjects.

[highway]

They don't have the license for anything other than the Internationals right now. That isn't a very common truck either. A new kit would need to appeal to a wide market.

Honestly Jake, I don't think it has anything to do with it being a "popular" truck to appeal to a wide market, I for one think anything modern would sell like hotcakes! The Mack may have its niche market when it comes to the real trucks and the Pinnacle is mainly geared toward owner operators, but I know I would get one or two (at least) if Moebius (or anyone for that matter) would offer a kit of the Pinnacle and add them to my stable of R model and Superliner bulldogs. I don't really care for the Prostar myself, it is a truck that doesn't appeal to me, but that won't stop me from eventually getting one to build a fleet truck out of.

As for licenses, if Moebius would get the license to use the Mack name, that also opens the door for more Mack options as well as Volvo, since Volvo now owns the Mack name.

[alangarber]

What ever we see it's good to get something new. With the economy the way it is you would think that companies would be glad to have their trucks replicated at a smaller version and receive a small income from it. Too many nice trucks have disapeared because there in nothing to remember them by but a few pics.

Maybe some day that will change and we will get a much larger option of new products. All we can do is hope for that and for now take what we get.

[Aaronw]

Dave - Would Moebius consider updating the LoneStar to 2015 specs? They seem to only come with Cummins ISX engines now, and they lost all of the tank skirts/fairings with the placement of the DEF tank behind the driver's side steer tire. Guys would probably buy it for the engine alone, plus if you just added the "open side" parts and the new engine on separate runners, it would allow the kit to be built in either variation.

A base model daycab Prostar without the fairings would be a nice option. Not sure if the layout on the sprues would make sense, but like the Lonestar / Prostar it would get additional mileage out of the tooling.

Yes I know there is a daycab available in resin which serves my needs, but that doesn't make any money for Moebius. Lower end day cab opens up a lot of building options. A new engine would be just another carrot to get people to pick up a different version as well. Seems to be working for Revell to tool up minor variations of the same kit (57 Ford, 50 Olds, 62 Corvette).

[Dave Metzner]

The funny thing is that the first LoneStar we photographed had a Cummins ISX in it; it was a test truck built before the Maxx Fore 15 was ready. Navistar wanted their own engine in the model kit so we waited for that engine to be ready to tool the kit. Now, I believe that all new Lonestars have ISX engines..

Edited August 26, 2014 by Dave Metzner

[Petetrucker07]

It would be cool if you guys did an engine kit like you did with the rims and tires. I buy the rim and tire sets every time i see them. But i know licensing from cummins needs to happen 1st. I would buy quite a few engine kits if they were come out

Edited August 26, 2014 by Petetrucker07

[Thatswhatshesaid]

Honestly Jake, I don't think it has anything to do with it being a "popular" truck to appeal to a wide market, I for one think anything modern would sell like hotcakes! The Mack may have its niche market when it comes to the real trucks and the Pinnacle is mainly geared toward owner operators, but I know I would get one or two (at least) if Moebius (or anyone for that matter) would offer a kit of the Pinnacle and add them to my stable of R model and Superliner bulldogs. I don't really care for the Prostar myself, it is a truck that doesn't appeal to me, but that won't stop me from eventually getting one to build a fleet truck out of.

As for licenses, if Moebius would get the license to use the Mack name, that also opens the door for more Mack options as well as Volvo, since Volvo now owns the Mack name.

Like Dave said any new truck kit would have to be a hit. I'm not knocking the Mack but I think it would appeal to a smaller market than say a Freightliner Cascadia or a Peterbilt 587 or 579. A new kit may sell like hot cakes but from what I've heard the Prostar isn't exactly flying off shelves. It's a nice kit and I bought 6 of them but it may be a slow seller.

The only real advantage a Volvo would have over the ROG/Italeri offering would be an engine unless they did something vocational. But then again that is more of a niche market. The 670 and 780 haven't changed enough to offer a new tooling IMO.

[Jim B]

Maybe the problem with the ProStar is that it doesn't have enough "bling" to appeal to the car modelers like the LoneStar did. Sure, us "truck guys" like the ProStar because it's a modern truck that is very popular with fleets and some O/O, but it really isn't that flashy to attract the non-truck modeler. Do I think Moebius made a mistake with the ProStar? Not at all! I just think it has a more limited audience than the LoneStar did. I built the LoneStar & I enjoyed the kit; so I will purchase future truck kits from Moebius.

[chuckyr]

I like the ProStar better than the LoneStar. I'm not into a lot of so called "bling" on a big rig truck. To me they can look cartoonish.

I have learn that many that like chrome this and chrome that, lowering trucks suspension, cutting the roofs and lowering them, turning them in to hot rods are not truck modelers first.

I prefer models of typical working and fleet trucks. To do one of those and make it look real is the sign of a very skilled truck modeller.

[Brett Barrow]

Maybe the problem with the ProStar is that it doesn't have enough "bling" to appeal to the car modelers like the LoneStar did. Sure, us "truck guys" like the ProStar because it's a modern truck that is very popular with fleets and some O/O, but it really isn't that flashy to attract the non-truck modeler. Do I think Moebius made a mistake with the ProStar? Not at all! I just think it has a more limited audience than the LoneStar did. I built the LoneStar & I enjoyed the kit; so I will purchase future truck kits from Moebius.

The ProStar sells OK, for us anyway. The LoneStar was a juggernaut when it came out. But it was the first and there was so much pent up demand for a new truck kit I think which ever came first was going to be the bigger seller. Now that they've each been out for a while sales are about even.

I've mentioned several times before what a great seller the Revell Peterbilt wrecker has been for us and I think a Moebius LoneStar wrecker would be great choice.

[Guest]

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Edited August 29, 2014 by Modeltruckbuilder

[Guest]

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Edited August 29, 2014 by Modeltruckbuilder

[Aaronw]

I agree that the Lonestar had a lot of things going for it, first modern truck kit in nearly a decade, appeal to the car modelers, good platform for a resin transkit, and just generally a good kit. The Prostar doesn't have the same crossover appeal to car modelers, and doesn't have the same pent up demand for a new truck kit that benefitted the Lonestar. It wouldn't surprise me though if after a couple of years the Prostar overtakes the Lonestar in continuous sales.

I don't really think the bling factor is really that big of a deal with truck modelers. Sure there are builders who like the heavily customized trucks, but it seems like working trucks are at least as popular from what I see being built online anyway.

[BigBad]

I think the trucks with more bling will appeal to the less experienced modelers and if they're lucky, a younger audience as well. Once they get more experience, they look for different things. I know, when I was a kid, I'd look at kits that had good box art, nice colors and lots of chrome Equipment. I knew my favorite makes too, they needed dual exhaust to start with, chrome disc wheels and as much as I could is to get kits with Detroit power... Don't ask... I just liked the sound of the real ones. I wanted chrome fuel tanks, a roof spoiler, and rear wheels that would match the front ones. What can I say, I was a kid, so thats what I wanted at the time. I still like chrome on trucks, dual vertical stacks (have you ever seen a daycab Kenworth without stacks? poor thing...), polished wheels and tanks. But I can really appreciate a truck that looks like the real thing, with painted wheels and bumpers, rear spokes or 2 hole discs. I agree that some kits need to appeal to the eye of the unexperienced to pull them into the hobby. Just like you have a Viper or a Corvette in a 1:1 car showroom to stir curiosity. I would like to see a kit of a trailer or a truck with 2 hole discs as standard and a daycab too, those would be pretty cool. Custom truck modelers? Why not, there are a lot of people modifying car kits, so I can see guys making pretty nice customs too.

[Chuck Most]

Bling and top-end equipment might sell models, but I do think it's about time the other end of the

spectrum got a little more attention. Besides, you don't need to have a bunch of fancy polished parts and wild graphics to make something that's an attention-grabber (if that's your thing). Even a bare-bones fleet tractor can look pretty good with the right paint scheme. May I present Exhibit A-

Nothing even remotely "blingy" about an Estes ProStar, but it sure does stand out in a sea of refrigerator-white examples, does it not? (And not that it's anybody's business but mine, yes, I do intend to build a Moebius LoneStar as an Estes day cab. Got a problem with that? )

While it's true I do like custom trucks, and when it comes to car models I'd gladly have a Shelby GT500 instead of a base model V6 Mustang, when it comes to Class 8 trucks and tractors my expectations are a bit different- I'd really like to see some more workaday subjects. I'd love to see a kit that comes with two-hole Budds and less chrome than a Model T. I like seeing realistic looking (if fictitious) markings, not the tacky graphics you find on many kit decal sheets that look like something out of a '70's van customizer's drug-addled nightmares. Not that all graphics are bad (the yellow Italeri DAF XF 105 comes to mind ), but I'd rather just see duplicates of factory stripe graphics, when applicable.

I'm more of a "casual" heavy commercial modeler, I only started building them about five years back, but even I can see the appeal of offering something that wouldn't exactly be Large Car Magazine material if built out of box. And it looks like the "hardcore" guys agree. Give us something basic... we can handle it from there. Even if they did a "decontented" modified reissue of the ProStar like some have suggested, I think even something like that would be a great start.

[Petetrucker07]

I think it would be a good idea to offer a happy medium with the plain jane and flashy, rim options for 1, maybe exhaust options, weed burner, single and dual.

Vons grocers out here have plain jane prostars, white 2 holes on the drives, alcoas for steers.

[Guest]

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Edited August 29, 2014 by Modeltruckbuilder

[chuckyr]

Nothing even remotely "blingy" about an Estes ProStar, but it sure does stand out in a sea of refrigerator-white examples, does it not? (And not that it's anybody's business but mine, yes, I do intend to build a Moebius LoneStar as an Estes day cab. Got a problem with that? )

It's a Transtar. I posted it back in post #79.

It could be offered by Moebius. The Prostar has a 113 BBC and the Transtar has a 107 BBC. Shortening the frame, a new hood, modifying the firewall and modifying the steering would do it. Of course a different engine for the sticklers of engine representation would be needed to quiet the whining of that aspect of the model kit.

Several fine examples of two-hole disc wheels are available by a number of aftermarket suppliers. All types of accessories can be found to make your model anything you want. To me, that is the fun in building.

If all of these options and variations are put in to a kit, the price would be astronomical. Just like buying a real vehicle, the more you want, the more it costs.

And of course chrome can be removed by the builder.

[Chuck Most]

I think it would be a good idea to offer a happy medium with the plain jane and flashy, rim options for 1, maybe exhaust options, weed burner, single and dual.

Vons grocers out here have plain jane prostars, white 2 holes on the drives, alcoas for steers.

I certainly don't object to that idea- a few choices never hurt anybody. If it could be done in a cost effective manner an optional feature or two would be nice.

[Petetrucker07]

Those 2 options seem simple enough, but im sure it would still cost a pretty penny to tool up those options. A seemingly simple option might directions to shorten the frame for those who arent quite skilled or dont have scale conv. rulers. Just a a few directions were to cut, were to place cross members. That might be a way cheaper option than tooling up new frame rails

[Chuck Most]

One in every crowd, right?

Sure there's all sorts of aftermarket stuff- resin, PE, decals, what have you, and it is fun finding and buying stuff like that. Waiting 4 to 8 weeks for it to arrive? Not so much. And since you're on this whole affordability shtick, consider how much any of that would add to the total price of the project. A kit, a set of resin Budds, a day cab panel... you might have a hundred bucks tied up in a project with just those three purchases. I know. I've done it. Let's face the facts- the days of buying a kit with the money you saved mowing lawns Saturday mornings are long gone, unless you own a successful groundskeeping business.

I did screw up the pic, but my point remains, you can build an eye-catching semi tractor without resorting to shiny stuff and wild paint. And come on, Mitchell... doesn't the idea of a kit that includes a set of Budds appeal to your "no-bling" sensibilities? Even a little bit? They wouldn't need to offer many options beyond that, if any at all- just a kit that could serve as a base for something less flashy than your typical lux owner/operator rig. Less is more!

If all of these options and variations are put in to a kit, the price would be astronomical. Just like buying a real vehicle, the more you want, the more it costs.