Question on Revell Sprint cars

[Luc Janssens]

Got this Revell Steve Kinser Bass Pro Shops sprint car, as part of a deal and was wondering if it is a re-pop of an old Monogram tool, or is it upgraded?
Also do they still use these on the track today?, if yes are they similar to this kit, or did they through the years got updated/upgraded and with what?
Please fill me in cuz I wanna know
Thanks!
 

Edited February 17, 2016 by Luc Janssens

[Junkman]

Yes, they are Monogram repops.

No, nothing has changed. Not really, at least.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Part two of your question...just google "2015 sprint car action" and you'll see these cars are still racing, in pretty much the same configuration. This is a shot from 2014.

The old Monogram kit, one of several iterations...    

The Revell / Monogram version of the Kinser kit...     Same basic tooling, some car-specific mods.

Again, same basic tooling...   

 

Edited February 17, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

[Art Anderson]

Luc,  American "Sprint Cars"  have evolved only slowly over the past nearly 50 years--the basic chassis layout changing truly very little.  Bodywork, of course, is a good bit different than in say, the 1960's, becoming much simpler, and more aerodynamic.  Engines, while based on production V8 engines (at least in their basic design) haven't really changed all that much--most of that is internal.  Suspension systems of today would still be recognized by sprint car drivers and their mechanics from 1966 with the exception that no longer would they see a transverse leaf spring up front, as some 1960's sprint cars (and their larger USAC Championship Dirt Car "Big Brothers" might have had.   The biggest evolution has been, of course, in wheels and tires, just as it has been with wheels and tires in Formula 1, Indianapolis Cars, and even in all forms of high-level motorsports.

Revell's sprint car kits are very much straight reissues of the series that Monogram tooled and produced back in 1996-97, though.

Art

 

[DrKerry]

Some things have changed, of course the most noticable is the tins on the body. Most of whats underneath stays the same with a few changes. A friend of mine runs the 410 series and has ran the same chassis set up for 6 years now and has only changed the tins and paint... He is running an older Kinser chassis..

[Art Anderson]

Some things have changed, of course the most noticable is the tins on the body. Most of whats underneath stays the same with a few changes. A friend of mine runs the 410 series and has ran the same chassis set up for 6 years now and has only changed the tins and paint... He is running an older Kinser chassis..

Tins?

[Helix]

You can buy upgraded parts such as wheels, Hood, exhaust, Mud guard for this kit, through 'The Parts Box' in Australia.....

At least it will look updated if you utilise these parts, here's an example of what I achieved.

 

[Deano]

Tins?

Art,

I read that as "sheet metal parts" . Body panels, wings, end plates ... that sort of stuff.

 

[alan barton]

To answer your question in a bit more detail, it is quite true that sprintcars have evolved slowly but there have been numerous changes since  Monogram released it's kits way back when.  If you build one of these kits straight out of the box it will definitely look like a current sprintcar.  If you want to build an exact or fairly accurate replica, there are some things you might like to upgrade.

Nearly all modern sprintcars use a highbar style chassis.  Monogram updated their frame to this style a long time ago but for true accuracy you need to google some frame manufacturers to see how many bars need changing.  I built an accurate replica of the Australian champion about 15 years ago and even then I changed over 20 bars in the frame!

Front tyres - the Goodyear implement style is now replaced by a fatter treaded tyre - there are some AMT Goodyears in old muscle car kits that make a good substitute.

Seat - a modern sprintcar seat is a full containment device, with much higher, wider side panels to wrap around the drivers ribcage and a complex helmet brace mounted at the top - I believe Dirt Track Modeller does a photoetched one.

Like Ray said, thepartsbox.com does current hood, armshield (mudguard) and wheels. It is easy to make the tins (flat aluminium side panels) alongside the engine and driver and also up the back bars of the rollcage.

The more recent kits have angled front wing sideboards and the small midget style fuel tank.  Earlier kits have straight front wing sideboards and a full sized fuel tank or tail.

The engines are largely the same but they often have a large air filter box on top of the injection rather than the individual foam style air filters in the kit. They now tend to have a cylindrical oil tank in the engine bay rather than the wedge shaped one in the drivers compartment that is in these kits.

Which ever way you go they are a great kit.  Suspension is fiddly but that is because it is so accurate.  Don't expect to get the front and rear end on in one night!

 

Cheers

Alan

 

[DrKerry]

Art,

I read that as "sheet metal parts" . Body panels, wings, end plates ... that sort of stuff.

 

Correct, sorry for the confusion. Tins are the sheet metal parts of the body as Deano mentioned....

[Luc Janssens]

Are the cars then sort of (CKD) kit cars, or cobbled together by the racing teams, to their own or national (US, CAN, AUS safety) specs, with parts from different original equipment manufacturers (OEM)?

And also thanks guys for your responses so far...

 

[DrKerry]

They have guidelines and ules as to how they are built and what they need for chassis builds. Just like anything over here they have sanctioning bodies that control the rules and safety of the cars built....

They aren't cobbled together like the old modifieds and jalopies of yesteryear at all...

[Junkman]

As Kerry stated, they have to be built to a very rigid rulebook, hence there is little room for actual development.
It's entirely up to the teams how they get their car, they can build it from scratch, buy a turn key car, or anything in between.
Make no mistake, despite they look old fashioned on paper, they are very sophisticated machines indeed.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Are the cars then sort of (CKD) kit cars, or cobbled together by the racing teams, to their own or national (US, CAN, AUS safety) specs, with parts from different original equipment manufacturers (OEM)?

Once again, Google is your friend. For definitive answers, try searching "sprint car chassis kits".

Several manufacturers supply chassis and body kits that meet the sanctioning body requirements, and there are specialized engine builders, component suppliers, etc. These are NOT junkyard cars...though there is nothing to stop a competent fabricator from building his own chassis, providing it meets the specific technical requirements of the relevant rulebook. Similarly, engines can still be based on junkyard-sourced major components. Some engine builders STILL prefer to start with "seasoned" blocks that have been run in extended passenger car service, citing post-machining dimensional stability.

 

Edited February 18, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

[alan barton]

Bill is absolutely correct there, Luc.  There are some classes that run smaller engines (360 cu in) or a lower spec and these may use OEM cast iron blocks while the heavy hitters such as the World of Outlaws series uses 410 cube alloy racing blocks.  Almost exclusively Chevy small-block but on very rare occasions you might see a Ford, Mopar or Holden based engine. We also have a budget class here in Australia that runs a V6 Holden engine - still the same frame however.

As far as I can tell USA, Canada and Australia all run very similar rules and there is plenty of international competition - we see USA drivers here every season.  I suspect some tracks may run without mufflers but most Aussie tracks have to use them.

There are also wingless sprints which are just that - sprintcars without the wings.  Awesome to watch!  They  usually run a winged chassis - you will see the wing mounting stubs sticking up on top of the rollcage on most of them.

 

Hope that helps

Cheers

Alan

[Skip]

Bill,  you are correct on the seasoned blocks.  I remember reading an article about another guy named Bill.  Bill "Grumpy" Jenkins, back when he was running his Pro-Stock Vega's, he would search out high mileage NYC Taxi Cab motors.  When the time the article was written it said he would swap in a rebuilt small block Chevy for a good rebuildable "core".  As in all he wanted was the block.  His reasoning was exactly the same, that a high mileage engine had taken a "set" and would remain the same even after the extensive machine work he did to them.  I've also heard the same type of statement attributed to Smokey Yunick.  Who are we mere mortals to argue with genius!!!

[Junkman]

For the same reason BMW used used blocks to build their formula 1 engines back in the 80s.

[Luc Janssens]

Thanks all for the info, truly appreciated!

Luc

[angrydawg]

'Merican translation for "high bar" car is: "down tube" chassis.

[Art Anderson]

As Kerry stated, they have to be built to a very rigid rulebook, hence there is little room for actual development.
It's entirely up to the teams how they get their car, they can build it from scratch, buy a turn key car, or anything in between.
Make no mistake, despite they look old fashioned on paper, they are very sophisticated machines indeed.

To add to this:  Sprint cars run primarily on dirt tracks (at least here in the US), the primary length of tracks being 1/2 to 5/8 mile in length (oval tracks).  Given the style of racing, and the dirt surfaces, there really has never been a lot of room for radical experimentation (at least that worked), so development over the years has been very incremental.  Put a 1960's sprinter next to a brand-new car, and at quick glance most uninitiated spectators will see mostly the changes in bodywork, wheels and tires.  Torsion bar suspension has been the preferred setup since the late 1960's, but of course, the linkage systems have evolved considerably.

However, if one were to remove the roll cage and it's associated down-tube braces, the raw chassis, to the casual observer, would look very similar still, today compared to yesteryear.  They have become ever more sophisticated, in ways that most people would never notice, unless they are true fans of the sport.

Art