Modelhaus going, going Gone !!!!!!

[Snake45]

I'm finding this discussion very interesting. It goes without saying that Don and Carol have carved out a very special, very specific place in the universe with the Modelhaus, and of course, it will be irreplaceable.

Best of luck to them in their retirement. They were more than fair and they tried to plan a smooth transition. I hope it ends up going well for them.

Moral stances aside on the possible profiteering angle, I'm not so sure that stockpiling for future sale would be a smart strategy. How would anybody know what their best sellers have been, unless Don or Carol told them? What kits would you order if you wanted to flip them and make piles of cash? Or parts? The best strategy I can think up is "bet it all on Jo Han (parts)". I would imagine parts for their Caddys, Javelins, GTX's and the like will become like gold- everything else? Not so sure about that.

I myself ended up finding one of their discontinued car kits on the Auction Place very recently, and it was something I have wanted for a long time. It has not been listed in their catalog for many years. I was prepared to throw down for it, but I ended up winning it for about 1/2 the price of most of their complete kits. I had been letting the hype get to me, but it turns out that it just didn't pan out. I'm very happy I got it and I'm gonna build it. Maybe there is simply no demand for at least a small part of their stuff- who knows?

Also- like Mark, my belief is that somebody, or perhaps several parties, might end up with at least some of their complete kits' molds. There are several categories of cars in which they offer a nice selection of unique kits. If they're not offering them anymore, I'm sure they would see the reason in selling some of those molds & masters, if they got the right offers.

The entire business, the parts business on the other hand- I don't think there is anybody on Earth who would be willing or able to take over the whole thing. Valued the way you would value a functioning business, I'm sure the cost would be way too prohibitive. It would have to be run as a full time concern, and with masters, molds, and supplies alone, you could probably buy a nice house in many parts of the country for what it would be worth. Not to mention the work ethic and talent you would have to bring to it.

I'm playing the Megaball tonight...if I hit it big, I'd be willing to buy the shooting works and set somebody up with a nice salary to run it. That would be me giving back to the Modeling community. ?

 

 

Great post!

[mike 51]

That was never the issue, never the intent, never the thrust of the argument.

I believe I said something about people incapable of making subtle moral distinctions. Thank you for so eloquently illustrating THAT concept.

 

You called people "maggots" for POSSIBLY profitting from Don and Catol's situation (something I'm sure they wouldn't do)...

Yes Bill I not only know what you meant, I even understand why you said it.

 Kinda sad...

 

[Ace-Garageguy]

There is no "moral decision" to be made here.

I buy a product from a seller. At their price. Fair and square.

I now own that product and am free to do with it as I wish. Use it. Give it away. Throw it in the trash. Or resell it at any price I want to charge.

"Morality" doesn't come into play here.

Perhaps not in your understanding of the concept, but you're free to define your version of "morality" as you see fit. 

As am I.

Timing and intent are operators here, and those particulars set this instance apart from a simple buy low / sell high scenario...which is usually a perfectly legitimate way to make money. But it's getting just too tiring trying to get a subtle point of ethics across to people who refuse to see.

[CapSat 6]

Great post!

Thank you, Snake! I try my best! ?

[Ace-Garageguy]

You called people "maggots" for POSSIBLY profitting from Don and Catol's situation (something I'm sure they wouldn't do)...

Yes Bill I not only know what you meant, I even understand why you said it.

 Kinda sad...

 

Please elaborate, Mr. Keeper of all Wisdom. Help me to be as enlightened as you.

In other words, if you're gonna put it out there, back it up.

I used the term "maggots" to refer to whoever ends up feeding off the corpse of a dead company. Appropriate, I think.

 

 

Edited July 9, 2016 by Ace-Garageguy

[CapSat 6]

Thank you, Snake! I try my best! ?

Oh- and I mean it about the Megaball thing. I have no interest in learning casting, but keeping the Modelhaus going would be great. Maybe even expand it into 3D masters and/ or injection molding. Wish me luck!!! ? 

[mike 51]

Please elaborate, Mr. Keeper of all Wisdom. Help me to be as enlightened as you.

In other words, if you're gonna put it out there, back it up.

 

 

Gee Bill I thought that was your Title.....you do realize this is just a model car discussion site right?

I no longer offer counseling services to strangers and certainly not for free....sorry.

Edited July 9, 2016 by mike 51

[Harry P.]

But it's getting just too tiring trying to get a subtle point of ethics across to people who refuse to see.

Or... different people have different concepts regarding what's "ethical" or not.

I see absolutely nothing unethical about buying a product and then reselling it. You do.

A classic case of "agree to disagree."

[Ace-Garageguy]

Gee Bill I thought that was your Title.....you do realize this is just a model car discussion site right?

I no longer offer counseling services to strangers and certainly not for free....sorry.

As usual, your response means...ummm...nothing.

Or... different people have different concepts regarding what's "ethical" or not.

I see absolutely nothing unethical about buying a product and then reselling it. You do.

A classic case of "agree to disagree."

Sounds good to me. Good night, Gracie.  

[mike 51]

As usual, your response means...ummm...nothing

LOL.. of course not.   

Edited July 9, 2016 by mike 51

[plastic-mechanic]

so if i am an overworked & underpaid expert, i am justified detesting the system. but if others are under-worked and make a profit, i detest them also. hmmm......

maybe just everything is bad?

[Tom Geiger]

Many years ago on anudder board, a guy posted that his Holy Grail was the old All American Resins   Mustang Coupe (Think the Revell 1990 Mustang LX Coupe kit).  This was a sought after kit of the time.  A good intentioned guy on the board said he had one he didn't need and wanted to make this guy's life complete and GAVE it to him.  What a great gesture to the hobby.  I'd be eternally grateful if someone did that for me.

What did the recipient do with his Holy Grail Mustang in his hands?   Immediately build it and enjoy it forever?  Nope,  he put it on eBay for $500.  The board went nutz!  

Anyone have a moral problem with this one?

[Snake45]

Oh- and I mean it about the Megaball thing. I have no interest in learning casting, but keeping the Modelhaus going would be great. Maybe even expand it into 3D masters and/ or injection molding. Wish me luck!!! ?

I know you meant it because I had exactly the same daydream.

[MrObsessive]

What did the recipient do with his Holy Grail Mustang in his hands?   Immediately build it and enjoy it forever?  Nope,  he put it on eBay for $500.  The board went nutz!  

Anyone have a moral problem with this one?

Tom, I remember that! IIRC, without mentioning their name (they may be posting here) the guy's first name started with a "D".  His handle on the board in fact had something to do with Mustangs.

The board went into a near maniacal FRENZY when they found out what this guy did.............I mean it got real UGLY! IIRC, it was later mentioned that there was some shill bidding going on which made things much worse! Now if his intention was to take the money to raise capital towards perhaps casting that kit into more for a business------Ok, that's not so bad. But I don't remember that being the case at all, and I almost forgot about that incident until you mentioned it!

EDIT: I want to say also that happened back in the early '00's-----I can remember where I was living at the time, and the ruckus carried on for quite some time. It devolved into a spate of cursing (that's how bad it got) and Tom had to step in to quiet things down. This fellow "disappeared" after that, but it was not soon forgotten as guys were talking about it for what seemed forever.

Edited July 9, 2016 by MrObsessive

[Snake45]

Many years ago on anudder board, a guy posted that his Holy Grail was the old All American Resins   Mustang Coupe (Think the Revell 1990 Mustang LX Coupe kit).  This was a sought after kit of the time.  A good intentioned guy on the board said he had one he didn't need and wanted to make this guy's life complete and GAVE it to him.  What a great gesture to the hobby.  I'd be eternally grateful if someone did that for me.

What did the recipient do with his Holy Grail Mustang in his hands?   Immediately build it and enjoy it forever?  Nope,  he put it on eBay for $500.  The board went nutz!

Anyone have a moral problem with this one?

Yes, I have a problem with that one. Dunno if it rises to the level of a "moral" problem but it is definitely sleazy behavior and I would probably "un-friend" anyone I knew who did that.

[Ace-Garageguy]

so if i am an overworked & underpaid expert, i am justified detesting the system. but if others are under-worked and make a profit, i detest them also. hmmm......

maybe just everything is bad?

Not "everything". Just a lot of what's accepted as "the way it is".   

[CapSat 6]

Many years ago on anudder board, a guy posted that his Holy Grail was the old All American Resins   Mustang Coupe (Think the Revell 1990 Mustang LX Coupe kit).  This was a sought after kit of the time.  A good intentioned guy on the board said he had one he didn't need and wanted to make this guy's life complete and GAVE it to him.  What a great gesture to the hobby.  I'd be eternally grateful if someone did that for me.

What did the recipient do with his Holy Grail Mustang in his hands?   Immediately build it and enjoy it forever?  Nope,  he put it on eBay for $500.  The board went nutz!  

Anyone have a moral problem with this one?

Wow. Just- wow.

I don't remember that one. Probably not the outcome the giver expected. At the least, that takes some, er, stones on the recipient/ seller's part...

[CapSat 6]

& of course shill bidding, if it did occur, is detestable. 

[Ace-Garageguy]

Many years ago on anudder board, a guy posted that his Holy Grail was the old All American Resins   Mustang Coupe (Think the Revell 1990 Mustang LX Coupe kit).  This was a sought after kit of the time.  A good intentioned guy on the board said he had one he didn't need and wanted to make this guy's life complete and GAVE it to him.  What a great gesture to the hobby.  I'd be eternally grateful if someone did that for me.

What did the recipient do with his Holy Grail Mustang in his hands?   Immediately build it and enjoy it forever?  Nope,  he put it on eBay for $500.  The board went nutz!  

Anyone have a moral problem with this one?

I'm sure a number of folks here would say that once the giver gives a gift, he has nothing more to say about what happens to it, any more than a manufacturer / seller has no say in the disposal of his product, and that once the ownership of property changes hands, the new owner is entirely free to do whatever he pleases with the property.

I personally think it's an unappreciative and greedy recipient who would turn a very kind and generous gesture from a fellow modeler into a quick profit.

But that's just the opinion of a warped, twisted, angry and bitter old man. 

[Tom Geiger]

 

I personally think it's an unappreciative and greedy recipient who would turn a very kind and generous gesture from a fellow modeler into a quick profit.

And that's how we feel about Don and Carol.  They could've just shut down the website without warning, filled the orders in the queue and left with their reputation as legend. Instead they decided to be kind to us and give everyone one last chance. They will work several months past their retirement date, just to be nice to us all.  You have to respect that.  

[High octane]

And that's how we feel about Don and Carol.  They could've just shut down the website without warning, filled the orders in the queue and left with their reputation as legend. Instead they decided to be kind to us and give everyone one last chance. They will work several months past their retirement date, just to be nice to us all.  You have to respect that.  

Your right about respecting Don & Carol as they deserve that and more. I haven't placed any last orders with Modelhaus, as I have enough kits and parts without adding more to the "pile." I'm also getting tired of trading ca$h for plastic & resin just to take up more room, as I'm not a person who starts or finishes a lot of builds every year. In fact I'm currently on a 6 month hiatus and hopefully I'll get back to building this fall.

[Howard Cohen]

And that's how we feel about Don and Carol.  They could've just shut down the website without warning, filled the orders in the queue and left with their reputation as legend. Instead they decided to be kind to us and give everyone one last chance. They will work several months past their retirement date, just to be nice to us all.  You have to respect that.  

I wonder if right now Don and Carol are regretting their decision to give so much notice without putting a limit of the size of orders. I wonder what the modelling community would do if they decided to just close up, return all the money, say 'Thanks, we are done' and go on a very long vacation  

[Danno]

Tom, I remember that! IIRC, without mentioning their name (they may be posting here) the guy's first name started with a "D".  His handle on the board in fact had something to do with Mustangs.

The board went into a near maniacal FRENZY when they found out what this guy did.............I mean it got real UGLY! IIRC, it was later mentioned that there was some shill bidding going on which made things much worse! Now if his intention was to take the money to raise capital towards perhaps casting that kit into more for a business------Ok, that's not so bad. But I don't remember that being the case at all, and I almost forgot about that incident until you mentioned it!

EDIT: I want to say also that happened back in the early '00's-----I can remember where I was living at the time, and the ruckus carried on for quite some time. It devolved into a spate of cursing (that's how bad it got) and Tom had to step in to quiet things down. This fellow "disappeared" after that, but it was not soon forgotten as guys were talking about it for what seemed forever.

I vividly remember that episode also.  If I recall correctly, before he sold it, he announced he was going to cast it and sell it as his own creation.  Being an AAM and occurring right after AAM shut down, his scheme wasn't highly regarded.  He kept running "polls" to see how much "demand" there was for his 5.0 scheme.  Still not much favorable response, but I guess there was at least one guy willing to part with big bucks for the last AAM casting.

Guy's still around and occasionally floats a "poll" to ostensibly determine what market there is for "new" resin products.  I still have little stomach for his shall we say "business plan."

 

 

[MrObsessive]

 

 He kept running "polls" to see how much "demand" there was for his 5.0 scheme.

That's it!! That was part of his handle! 5.0 Man or something.......

Another reason I remember this incident is that it happened around the same time my "incorrect" wiper motor in my '69 Dodge Daytona hit the mags. That raised a rather big firestorm as I had composed a rather irreverent, but truthful response to the fella that raised the stink about it in the mags back then.

[gtx6970]

Selling a product at your own suggested full blown retail price is a much different scenario than giving something away for free to someone under the assumption they were to build it are 2 VERY different things .

Its not like Modelhaus is giving anything away for free. They are getting THEIR price that THEY decided on well in advance. So I have my doubts they  will  give it any thoughts or even care as to what the paying customer has planned for said purchase.

In case anyone is wondering , NO I did not put in a final order or do I have a backorder with them on file with Modelhaus. Actually the last time I ordered from them at all was nearly 10 years ago. But that's not going to stop me from buying there former product when/ or if it pops up for sale if I need it at the time.

 

A few years ago I put my 1970 Challenger 340 up for sale. I got nearly 30k for the car,which was pretty good money at the time. A few years later a dealer had it at the big Cruze  auction in AZ. The car sold for over double what I got out if it . I had no I'll feelings or even gave a snot. I was happy with the sale price I received for it and the fact he made money on it was irrelevant to me .

Edited July 9, 2016 by gtx6970