Body filler

[Super28]

What is a body filler that won't break the bank?

[Eshaver]

Terry , I'm not quite sure how to answer your question . Are we working on a Full size car , a large diorama or just an average plastic model kit .

I do large dioramas . Yes, LARGE pieces , like 3 X 4 feet . In my case , I buy my products by the gallon .

[Super28]

Ooops.....talking 1/25  model cars

[Mooneyzs]

Here is my preference for Body Filler, It's a 2 part and this sands really nice, although this one is a little more pricey and I get it at  auto body paint supply store:

 

 

But as an alternate I also will use this Bondo 2 Part which you can get at any automotive store... Orielly's, Napa, Autozone...etc... probably for 10 bucks or less:

 

These are my personal preferences as I am not a big fan of any of the model glazing putty's, some tend to shrink and Crack (that is if you put it on too thick).  You  also have to wait for it to dry a lot longer. The 2 part stuff I use, you can be sanding parts in 15 mins or less depending on how hot you actually mix it.

[martinfan5]

I agree with Chris above on the one part from Bondo, it works great, dry's fast, and doesnt shrink a lot that I have noticed.

 

Tamiya's putty is decent as well.

Edited July 14, 2017 by martinfan5

[Super28]

Thank you . I didn't want to use model putty because of the cracking. I will try the bondo . I have an O'reilly's here in Middleburg.

 

[Mooneyzs]

You are welcome Terry.... also FYI the bondo I have shown here Part number 801 is a 2 part as well where you add the harder to it. I believe at O-reilly's will also have a bondo glazing putty as well where you don't have to add hardner. You could try both. It also may take a little trial an error on how much harder to add in the 2 part. If you add too much hardner it will just set up much quicker and you won't have as much time to work with it.

[ChrisBcritter]

On the two-part Bondo in the tube, what's the ratio of hardener to putty when you're only mixing a very small amount (about the size of a jelly bean)?

[Ace-Garageguy]

On the two-part Bondo in the tube, what's the ratio of hardener to putty when you're only mixing a very small amount (about the size of a jelly bean)?

Just for clarification, the ratio is always the same, whether you're mixing a very small amount or a bucket full.

For a blob of bondo the size of a jelly bean, try a small blob of catalyst (people call it hardener, but it isn't, technically) about the size of a round-head pin, or less.

As stated above, getting the sweet spot figured out in your mixing ratio takes a slight learning curve.

Not enough catalyst and the stuff NEVER cures. Too much, and either it cures almost instantly, or it gets rubbery and won't sand correctly.

Don't be intimidated by this, however. The stuff is GREAT once you're familiar with it.

PRACTICE mixing and sanding BEFORE you put it on a model. You won't be sorry you 'wasted' a little bit.   

Unlike the one-part fillers, the two-part fillers can be put on very thick, and they'll cure all the way through with no appreciable shrinkage or cracking...so you can do very heavy modifications and bodywork quickly. The stuff is ready to sand in about 20 minutes if you mix it correctly.

And don't be in a hurry to sand it. When it first starts to cure, it goes through a rubbery phase where it can be easily sculpted with sharp tools, but if you try to sand it during the rubbery phase it will tend to pull off of the part you're working on, because it doesn't achieve FULL adhesion until it's hard.

Again, give it 20 minutes or so before you sand it.

 

AND...for VERY SMALL IMPERFECTIONS, the ONE-PART putties can be helpful.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[espo]

I have used Tamiya Putty for many years with no issues. That said, if you're trying to "build" a body section and really piling it on you might want to try an Automotive type filler.    

[Super28]

Wow! Thanks for all the input! I really appreciate it. I've worked with Bondo and Glazing putty on real cars before,. Never thought about using it on models, them being plastic and all.

My other hobby is my last "hurrah" in building a street rod. I've built several over the years and my dumb butt sold them . Got the itch again and decided on a 1972 Ford Ranchero. Off frame rebuild.

Thanks again for the info

[BigTallDad]

Thank you . I didn't want to use model putty because of the cracking. I will try the bondo . I have an O'reilly's here in Middleburg.

 

FYI O'reilly's gives veterans a 10% discount.

[Super28]

FYI O'reilly's gives veterans a 10% discount.

That's me!!!

[crazyjim]

I use the Bondo 2 part for major work and Squadron white or green for very minor items.

And yes, O'Reilly's does a Veteran discount. I just show them my VA card.  They're also an excellent source for Duplicolor primers.

[George Bojaciuk]

I use Evercoat Eurosoft....love it! Sands easily! Quarter to dime rule on mixing. Mark Gustavson mentioned this stuff in an article and I have not looked back since. No shrinkage or issues down the lane!

[BigTallDad]

I use Evercoat Eurosoft....love it! Sands easily! Quarter to dime rule on mixing. Mark Gustavson mentioned this stuff in an article and I have not looked back since. No shrinkage or issues down the lane!

I'm old school math; can you define the ratio in terms of numbers, such as 3:2 please?

[Super28]

Where would you get Evercoat Eurosoft?

 

[Darren B]

My fav right now is the basic Tamiya filler, its hard enough to hold a shape but not so hard you need power sanders to shape it. I also love the spot putty from bondo brand to fill in small holes after the Tamiya putty. I have never used bondo on models but Ricky Couch comes to mind when I think hobbies and bondo he would make these insane creations all out of bondo, I need to try that stuff sometime.

[George Bojaciuk]

The can states 1/4 putty from the can to 1/4 of the tube of BLUE hardner.  From my experience 3:1. If you dig out a blob with a tongue depressor and it's about the size of a quarter, add a dimes worth of hardener. The color should be a light blue, when mixed. If you use too much catalyst (blue), it will harden rapidly, not leaving you time to work with it. Too little and it will take a while. The proper mix will give you a good 20 mins work time. Let it set overnight before you sand for the best results. 2lb can was about $29.00 with a tube of hardener.

Autobody Toolmart.com has it. Any good auto store will carry it as well as an automotive refinishing supply shop. When I worked at Eastwood, we had it on the shelf. 

I've done wheel flares and hood scoops and never had it shrink or crack. Love this stuff. Sands easily. My '70 Motion Chevelle had it on the hood and to this day, it looks great! Squadron Green stuff always disappointed. 

My rule of thumb is...if it is single stage, it uses a solvent to cure. As that evaporates, it will shrink. A two stage uses a chemical reaction to cure. If using on metal, prime the metal first as any chemical cure produces heat and heat causes condensation. Trapped moisture will cause rust. The two stage does not rely on evaporation and there is no shrinkage.

One of the party bonuses working at Eastwood! Get to know about this stuff.

 

[Ace-Garageguy]

A two stage uses a chemical reaction to cure. If using on metal, prime the metal first as any chemical cure produces heat and heat causes condensation. Trapped moisture will cause rust. 

One of the party bonuses working at Eastwood! Get to know about this stuff.

As an engineer and a guy who's been using fillers, primers and paint on high-end real cars for closing on 50 years now (and standing behind my work) I have to clarify a couple of points here.

First, it's cooling that causes condensation of atmospheric moisture, not heat. That's why water droplets form on the outside of the glass your cold drink is in, but not on the outside of a hot cup of coffee.

Second, bondo is porous and absorbs moisture. That's the main reason for seeing rust pop up under filler work on real cars...that, and having pinholes in the metal that allow moisture ingress from the backside, or improperly treated rust down in pits and other sheetmetal imperfections. If rust isn't completely neutralized with something like phosphoric acid prior to filling or priming, it's almost guaranteed to pop up again.

Third, applying bondo or or any 2-part filler over EPOXY primers is generally highly recommended (because the epoxy creates a layer of material that's impervious to moisture and actually improves adhesion of filler to metal), and filler should be sealed with epoxy primer as soon as the work is completed...again, to inhibit moisture absorption.

But applying most 2-part fillers over wash-primer, urethane primers or lacquer primers (yes, some people still use it) is something the paint manufacturers have been warning against pretty much forever. Sometimes you get away with it, sometimes you don't. I don't risk it, as I really REALLY hate doing work over for free.

When advising "prime the metal first" before applying fillers, it's good to specify WHICH primer to use to avoid confusion and unpleasant surprises.

And when in doubt, READ THE MANUFACTURER'S DATA SHEETS AND INSTRUCTIONS.

You'll often find that the people who MAKE and TEST the stuff disagree with the legions of internet "experts" and even sometimes the people who SELL autobody materials. I know who I'm gonna believe.  

 

Edited July 15, 2017 by Ace-Garageguy

[George Bojaciuk]

Agree with Ace and my bad for not being specific on the primer, yes....epoxy primer on metal. On plastic you should be fine.

[waynehulsey]

What is the shelf life on this stuff? 30 bucks for something I may use 1 or 2 times, then find its went bad on you is a little too much. That's like with CA, I buy the smallest bottles they have and still throw 3/4 of it away since its harden. Same for the Bondo red spot putty, don't think I've ever used over half a tube before it harden.

Is epoxy primers available in spray cans?

[cowboy rich]

What is the shelf life on this stuff? 30 bucks for something I may use 1 or 2 times, then find its went bad on you is a little too much. That's like with CA, I buy the smallest bottles they have and still throw 3/4 of it away since its harden. Same for the Bondo red spot putty, don't think I've ever used over half a tube before it harden.

Is epoxy primers available in spray cans?

I also agree with Bill, as far as shelf like as you asked I have a can I dated in 2008 that still looks good. As far as I know the stuff won't harden until you add the catalyst sounds like the other one you used was one part, that will harden like .ca.

Rch

[oldcarfan]

Evercoat is the superior of the two, but if you're like me, and only use a small amount before it goes bad, it isn't worth it. I usually get Bondo two-part because it's cheaper. While you're there, get a tube of Bondo spot putty. Once you've got the body work done and shoot that first coat of primer, you'll probably find a few scratches or sand marks you missed. Spot putty works great for that.

[George Bojaciuk]

I mix on business cards, not in the can. Only take what I need. My original can lasted years. Always made sure the lid was on tight. Occasionally, I'd check for separation and mix it up. The blue hardener tube (actual container) broke down over time and cracked. I just picked up another tube for only a few bucks. I finally threw my original putty away, since I had access to a fresh batch. I'd say I had it about 10 years. I've used it on home projects, as well.

Use what you want and what your budget allows. Just sharing my personal experience with both types of fillers. If I spend many hours working on something, I don't want it cracking 6 months from now. Had it happen and it's most frustrating.

My Motion Chevelle appeared on the cover of my book....around 1997... As I said, it still looks good more than 20 years later. (It was a magazine article car prior).

You can get epoxy primer in cans. However once you activate the can, you have a window in which to use it. The can uses an internal bladder which you puncture to activate the two components. Freezing the can may get you a week's use since lowering the temp slows the chemical reaction. Again, on plastic, you don't need epoxy primer.

If you go to Eastwood's site and search for "epoxy primer", there is a nice explanation and a video by Kevin Tetz. Nice guy, as I got to meet him and chat at our car show. There are a lot of great videos on the Eastwood site as well as YouTube.