chrome silver

[Project X]

Hello there,

Basically, i am through with using Humbrol's chrome silver enamel, it just doesn't look like chrome. I am currently doing a truck and wondered what the best chrome finish product was on the market.

Thanx in advance

[my66s55]

Molotow liquid chrome marker. There are recent posts on in the this general forum.

[Erik Smith]

Yup. Molotow. Only downside is it takes a long time to fully cure - but so does Humbrol, so...

You can buy Molotow pens or a refill bottle to spray with an airbrush. 

[Casey]

Might be a good candidate for a merge and pin in the Q&A section?

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 4, 2018 by Casey

[SfanGoch]

I was interested in the Molotow Chrome pens until I checked out Skip Jordan's thread about ALSA Easy Brush. Sure, 200 bucks for a 4 oz. can sounds like a lot; but, that's just a bit more than the cost of four Molotow 30ml refills. Plus, unlike Molotow, it's a paint, not an ink. It won't rub off. The Easy Brush could probably be used in one of the Molotow empty markers to paint trim with.

[Erik Smith]

6 minutes ago, SfanGoch said:

I was interested in the Molotow Chrome pens until I checked out Skip Jordan's thread about ALSA Easy Brush. Sure, 200 bucks for a 4 oz. can sounds like a lot; but, that's just a bit more than the cost of four Molotow 30ml refills. Plus, unlike Molotow, it's a paint, not an ink. It won't rub off. The Easy Brush could probably be used in one of the Molotow empty markers to paint trim with.

Has anybody actually purchased and tested this stuff?

I watched the video and looked at the website earlier and it seemed it was similar to Alclad (gloss black base). The scene of the guy hand painting looks a little fishy...but would like to see actual application for small scale use. 

[SfanGoch]

Elaborate on what you mean by "fishy". It looks fairly straightforward. There isn't any video hocus-pocus used to deceive the viewer. I'm going to get a can and empty Molotow markers after taking care of the rest of the Christmas-inflicted bills. One difference between Easy Brush and Alclad is that Alclad has to be airbrushed to achieve the finish. I tend to look for and use the simplest solution to simple problems. Use a small paintbrush like you would with normal hobby paint. Mask molded on trim and brush it on. Small parts can be painted the same way one normally does it, unless one thinks using an airbrush to apply paint on an ignition coil and two valve covers is worth the extra time and effort. Molotow offers a 1.5mm soft brush tip which can be used with the empty markers to paint parts. For small scale use, get some empty paint jars and store the amount of Easy Chrome you intend to use so you don't need to keep reopening the can. 

[Erik Smith]

48 minutes ago, SfanGoch said:

Elaborate on what you mean by "fishy". It looks fairly straightforward. There isn't any video hocus-pocus used to deceive the viewer. I'm going to get a can and empty Molotow markers after taking care of the rest of the Christmas-inflicted bills. One difference between Easy Brush and Alclad is that Alclad has to be airbrushed to achieve the finish. I tend to look for and use the simplest solution to simple problems. Use a small paintbrush like you would with normal hobby paint. Mask molded on trim and brush it on. Small parts can be painted the same way one normally does it, unless one thinks using an airbrush to apply paint on an ignition coil and two valve covers is worth the extra time and effort. Molotow offers a 1.5mm soft brush tip which can be used with the empty markers to paint parts. For small scale use, get some empty paint jars and store the amount of Easy Chrome you intend to use so you don't need to keep reopening the can. 

Oh, low quality video...I don’t know...just didn’t sell me instantly - maybe it’s just too cool to believe. 

I would love for this product to be an easy solution to an old problem. The results in the video look good. 

I have not, though, seen or been able to find anybody using this product for models or even brushing it on (outside Alsa’s promo video). 

You still need a gloss black base, and Alsa recommends drying time of 48 hours at 70 degrees for the base...then spray or brush and dry 48...so, yes, brush on is easier than AB, but Molotow you can just paint directly on. 

Also they list as kit only - any way to just buy, say, one ounce of the chrome? 

I look forward to you trying it out! Hopefully it works as advertised. 

[SfanGoch]

1 hour ago, Erik Smith said:

Hopefully it works as advertised. 

You and me both. I have a couple of Moebius Jupiter 2's needing a chrome job.

[Matt Bacon]

3 hours ago, SfanGoch said:

I was interested in the Molotow Chrome pens until I checked out Skip Jordan's thread about ALSA Easy Brush. Sure, 200 bucks for a 4 oz. can sounds like a lot; but, that's just a bit more than the cost of four Molotow 30ml refills. Plus, unlike Molotow, it's a paint, not an ink. It won't rub off. The Easy Brush could probably be used in one of the Molotow empty markers to paint trim with.

I don't know where you're buying your Molotow refills, but Amazon in the UK has them for around £16, which is more like $20-$25, which by my reckoning makes 8-10 for the same price as a can of Easy Brush. Plus, I KNOW Molotow Chrome pens give great results, and it airbrushes very easily as well. Once it's cured properly, like 24 hours in a warm airing cupboard, it doesn't rub off, and you can mask over it with no issues. I hope the ALSA works out for you, but I'm sticking with Molotow...

best,

M.

[SfanGoch]

I'm not buying any refills. I checked around for a ballpark price and Amazon on this side has them for $27-$31.18 each. As to it not rubbing off, I definitely beg to differ. It does. Who sez? This is taken directly from the Molotow website:

"The ink is alcohol based, so it is advised not to cover it on the same day with an acrylic varnish (tests with Alclad Aqua ALC600 over Chrome resulted not so good). Other enamel or lacquered based clear cotes/varnishes should be used cautiously and only after experimentation (light mist first, many thin layers, not one wet). Using varnishes there is always the danger of solvent/thinner chemical reaction to destroy the finish. Using any kind of varnish/sealer/clear cote over chrome is generally not advised – unless it is absolutely needed (eg. decals, washes, etc). Most varnishes tend to make dull or even “kill” chrome/natural metal finishes anyway. Tests and practice are always advised before trying anything for the first time.

Once the chrome paint is dry, it won't show accidental fingerprint impressions, but if you purposely touch or rub your finger across it a few times the finish does haze (normal handling will do so over time as well). So, let enough time to dry completely and do not touch the parts at all - before and after painting. Preparation and cleaning of surfaces are equally important. Use of protective (powder free) gloves are highly recommended at all times. The chrome painted surface is durable enough once dried after some hours (days - better to be on the safe side) and does not pick up easily fingerprints but if you keep handling the model with bare hands you risk rubbing the shine off, ruining a good job anyway. Chrome looks great as long as you never touch it. It is also advisable not to mask with tape over chromed painted surfaces. Make sure that the chrome is your last paint step."

Here's the complete article titled The MOLOTOW LIQUID CHROME 1MM on plastic model wheels. This is straight from the manufacturer so I ain't just blowing wind outta me bone box.  

 

[Classicgas]

4 hours ago, SfanGoch said:

Sure, 200 bucks for a 4 oz. can sounds like a lot;

It sounds outrageous. I use professional automotive paint at work, and it's probably less than that a gallon.

[SfanGoch]

Well. as Ace-Garageguy pointed out in the ALSA thread, that's more than enough to chrome at least 100 bumpers and grilles plus a whole lot of other chrome-worthy parts. Something to consider: how much would that cost if you had to send all that out to one of the professional plating services, maybe 4-6 times the cost of that one can? 

[Matt Bacon]

I'm just going by experience using it in my last year's builds. I dare say it will rub off if you try hard enough, but in the normal handling of a model being built (say for example using the chrome marker to outline the window trims before putting the glass in and then assembling the body and chassis) I've not had any issues requiring redoing the chrome. And I've used Tamiya masking tape over it with no problem about lifting the chrome layer off the base or even the lifting of silver particles you often get with metallics like Humbrol Metalcote, even after it's been polished. I'm sure the makers are right to be cautious, and not over promise -- it's not miraculous, after all. But the way I use it -- and I have used it, repeatedly, using the pens, fine detail brush painting and airbrushing, so I'm not "blowing wind outta my bone box" either -- it works very effectively for the jobs I'm using it for. You want "bullet-proof" chrome, then send the parts out to be plated by a specialist; you want an affordable, easy to apply (compared to BMF) and pretty tough solution for chrome trim on a model car, then Molotow is a good one...

Like this:

or this:

or this

 

best,

M.

Edited January 4, 2018 by Matt Bacon

[Classicgas]

Well if you have that kind of money more power to you. 

[Erik Smith]

Well, it’s $200 for the kit.

That includes special formula base coat, chrome, and gloss coat plus a brush. 

I don’t apply Molotow until I really need to, because it does dull and rub off with handling. 

[highway]

20 minutes ago, SfanGoch said:

I'm not buying any refills. I checked around for a ballpark price and Amazon on this side has them for $27-$31.18 each. As to it not rubbing off, I definitely beg to differ. It does. Who sez? This is taken directly from the Molotow website:

"The ink is alcohol based, so it is advised not to cover it on the same day with an acrylic varnish (tests with Alclad Aqua ALC600 over Chrome resulted not so good). Other enamel or lacquered based clear cotes/varnishes should be used cautiously and only after experimentation (light mist first, many thin layers, not one wet). Using varnishes there is always the danger of solvent/thinner chemical reaction to destroy the finish. Using any kind of varnish/sealer/clear cote over chrome is generally not advised – unless it is absolutely needed (eg. decals, washes, etc). Most varnishes tend to make dull or even “kill” chrome/natural metal finishes anyway. Tests and practice are always advised before trying anything for the first time.

Once the chrome paint is dry, it won't show accidental fingerprint impressions, but if you purposely touch or rub your finger across it a few times the finish does haze (normal handling will do so over time as well). So, let enough time to dry completely and do not touch the parts at all - before and after painting. Preparation and cleaning of surfaces are equally important. Use of protective (powder free) gloves are highly recommended at all times. The chrome painted surface is durable enough once dried after some hours (days - better to be on the safe side) and does not pick up easily fingerprints but if you keep handling the model with bare hands you risk rubbing the shine off, ruining a good job anyway. Chrome looks great as long as you never touch it. It is also advisable not to mask with tape over chromed painted surfaces. Make sure that the chrome is your last paint step."

Here's the complete article titled The MOLOTOW LIQUID CHROME 1MM on plastic model wheels. This is straight from the manufacturer so I ain't just blowing wind outta me bone box.  

 

Of course Molotow isn't going to suggest ANOTHER COMPANY'S PRODUCT, any idiot could figure out that wouldn't be smart especially when the other company also offers paintable chrome products! 

Before more bovine exhaust gets released, the 4th post on the first page of this thread from someone who knows what he is talking about says just the opposite:

 

[SfanGoch]

I don't have the kind of money to send all of the chrome parts I have to get replated.

[Classicgas]

Lol. I hear ya.

[1972coronet]

As one whom adheres to the K.I.S.S. Principal ( Keep It Simple , Stupid ! ) , I stand by the Molotov Cocktail Pen . No videos to watch ... No base coats ... No fragile finishes ( *ahem* Alclad *ahem* ) ... No nonsense .

As for its dry time : in my experiences , Molotow dries rather quickly ----- even in 65-70 degree room temperature . And , it is durable ; I've handled the parts numerous times with zero ill-effects .

Now , I can't speak to how it looks / holds-up on big(ger) parts , as I've not tried it there ( no need to --- I have Duplicolor aerosol Chrome for big pieces ... and that really does look and work really well ---- again , no base coat B.S. , no fragility , no Clean Room settings , ... )

[SfanGoch]

2 hours ago, highway said:

Of course Molotow isn't going to suggest ANOTHER COMPANY'S PRODUCT, any idiot could figure out that wouldn't be smart especially when the other company also offers paintable chrome products! 

Using loaded language to disparage a discussion ain't in the spirit of friendly public discourse. You must mean any moron or high imbecile. Idiots are only capable of self-preservation and don't possess the cognitive functions required for reason and judgement. Either of the former would also know that Easy Chrome, Alclad and Molotow are three completely different products with three different formulations and properties (permanence and durability come to mind) and wouldn't make the mistake of conflating the three into one neat package for the sake of argument. I consider durability and permanence as selling points. The ability to brush paint Easy Chrome is an additional plus. Alcohol based inks are inferior in those regards when compared to lacquer/enamel-based coatings. As a counterbalance io Matt Bacon and smhardesty's experiences, Erik Smith corroborated that Molotow Chrome does indeed dull and rub off after handling. You also missed where it was noted

 

2 hours ago, highway said:

Other enamel or lacquered based clear cotes/varnishes should be used cautiously and only after experimentation (light mist first, many thin layers, not one wet). Using varnishes there is always the danger of solvent/thinner chemical reaction to destroy the finish. Using any kind of varnish/sealer/clear cote over chrome is generally not advised – unless it is absolutely needed (eg. decals, washes, etc). Most varnishes tend to make dull or even “kill” chrome/natural metal finishes anyway. Tests and practice are always advised before trying anything for the first time.

Also, if you read it carefully, they don't recommend any clear coats/varnishes, including the named product, because, as any moron or high imbecile knows, "Most varnishes tend to make dull or even “kill” chrome/natural metal finishes anyway." Unless you are using a manufacturer approved clear coat, you'll accomplish nothing except wasting your time and money. That said, even Testors Metalizers, for example are notorious for losing their natural metal sheen after the recommended sealer, or any clear overcoat is applied. But, you already knew that.

[Ron Hamilton]

It took some serious practice, but I am satisfied with my Motolow pens. I am still using Bare Metal Foil for most of my chrome work. I cannot afford the other stuff.

[highway]

On 1/4/2018 at 8:47 PM, SfanGoch said:

 

Also, if you read it carefully, they don't recommend any clear coats/varnishes, including the named product, because, as any moron or high imbecile knows, "Most varnishes tend to make dull or even “kill” chrome/natural metal finishes anyway." Unless you are using a manufacturer approved clear coat, you'll accomplish nothing except wasting your time and money. That said, even Testors Metalizers, for example are notorious for losing their natural metal sheen after the recommended sealer, or any clear overcoat is applied. But, you already knew that.

I might suggest you read this thread, especially the reply from Zoom Zoom: 

 

[SfanGoch]

Thanks, I did. He did mention that it doesn't take well to masking. I previously read the same from other people on other sites. That's the problem. I've used Alclad and SNJ Spray Metal (when it was still available) on display model aircraft I built for a hobby shop. I could mask over both finishes to airbrush I.D. bands on F-86 Sabres without the metal finish pulling off or dulling. The Easy Chrome, according to ALSA, should be applied over a glossy black base coat; although, I read that some people have applied it over a clear coated gray or white primer base or a colored top coat and the results were similar. If you have already painted and clear coated a body, you could brush the stuff, or use an empty Molotow marker loaded with some Easy Chrome and a soft brush tip, on masked off trimwork. Like I said, I'm going to splurge and get the kit. If it works, great. If not, I can refinish the chromework on my kid's Schwinn Grey Ghost Krate Bike.

[niteowl7710]

FWIW that review on the Molotow U.S. website is a submitted review from another e-zine, not the gospel truth from the manufacturer in Germany.

Which is neither here nor there in what it states per se, but like so many reviews of so many products in the hobby - such as Revell using IPMS builds as substantive proof their products are good - buyer beware on the reviewer knowing what they were doing/knows what they're talkng about.