Peking to Paris Rally CBP

[Aaronw]

22 hours ago, Harpo said:

I'm pretty sure the Willys Jeepster was only available in rear wheel drive, no 4x4.

I did not know that. The only one I've ever actually seen was 4x4, but it could have been converted. The Jeepster Commando was of course 4x4, but I think that is pretty solidly in early SUV category like the Bronco, or Scout so it wouldn't qualify. 

[Aaronw]

On 11/24/2018 at 9:30 AM, Jantrix said:

I believe that rule is more concerned with the utility aspect of the vehicle than the fact that it has four wheel drive. I'm going to allow this as long as the Model T is a passenger vehicle. 

 

I'm heavily leaning towards a roadster body. A four door would provide more room for stuff, but I think the key to the T is lean and mean. Loading it down with 1000lbs of gear would kind of defeat the point.

 

The dizzying array of aftermarket for the T is the appeal to me. You could buy 4x4, 6x4, 6x6, halftrack, tractor and snow mobile conversions. It wouldn't surprise me if somebody tried to market amphibious and flying T conversions, although I've not seen anything for those.

 

 

and I found, there was a 1913 Model T in the 2013 race and it didn't do too bad.

 

Edited November 25, 2018 by Aaronw

[Pat Minarick]

 I built my roll bar and working on a intake . Also filled in the big holes in the firewall.

[Harpo]

My PMC has arrived!  

[Jantrix]

I have some work done. First off, I have added the X member from the convertible kit to strengthen the chassis. I've added a drive shaft hoop and a beam that the traction bars will attach to. Working on a panhard bar now. I've smoothed out the firewall and inner fenders. I've removed the spare tire well and stock gas tank. This build will be mostly kit parts, with minor mods and parts box replacements throughout. I'll be opening and hinging the trunk which is not the norm for me, but I think this build requires it.

I'm relocating the gas cap (likely to the C-pillar) as the tank location has changed and I want an external gas cap rather like an AC Cobra. I've looked at my AMT Cobra kit and it's a little dinky thing. Can anyone think of a kit that has a decent gas cap?

 

[stavanzer]

Aaron. I owned a '27 T Speedster. It was a blast to drive. However, 55mph in a T is far faster than it would seem. An open, Speedster Body at 55, gives a subjective 100 mph feel.

Here are a buncha links from the Old Motor online site. They may provide some useful background on Ruxtell Rear Axles and Rocky Mountain Brakes. Two of the Most Common T accessories, and some of the most useful as well. Follow the links at the bottom of the articles to learn more. Also some great Flavor Pieces, if you are not a T fanatic like me.

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=136181

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=151395

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=159089

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=165896

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=139059

http://theoldmotor.com/?p=129106

Enjoy.

 

[Jantrix]

20 hours ago, Aaronw said:

I'm heavily leaning towards a roadster body. A four door would provide more room for stuff, but I think the key to the T is lean and mean. Loading it down with 1000lbs of gear would kind of defeat the point.

and I found, there was a 1913 Model T in the 2013 race and it didn't do too bad.

I like this idea.

You gotta give respect for the guys that drove 5500 miles in that little buggy.

[stavanzer]

And what might be a better link from the Old Motor.

http://theoldmotor.com/?s=Model+T+ford+Speed+Equipment+&&paged=1

 

[Aaronw]

3 hours ago, alexis said:

Aaron. I owned a '27 T Speedster. It was a blast to drive. However, 55mph in a T is far faster than it would seem. An open, Speedster Body at 55, gives a subjective 100 mph feel.

Here are a buncha links from the Old Motor online site. They may provide some useful background on Ruxtell Rear Axles and Rocky Mountain Brakes. Two of the Most Common T accessories, and some of the most useful as well. Follow the links at the bottom of the articles to learn more. Also some great Flavor Pieces, if you are not a T fanatic like me.

Enjoy.

 

I'm not committed enough to own one, but over the past several years I've become quite interested in these beasties. They were not just cheap, there were other cheap cars nobody remembers. They are pretty amazing cars, and yes with no shocks, and a wobbly transverse leaf spring suspension 55 must be "exciting" (terrifying might be a better word). I am looking at some of the popular suspension and braking improvements, although I'm going with the strategy of spending less time stuck in the mud, and finding alternate routes around narrow passes, rickety bridges etc will help make up for the lower top speed once hitting the more civilized roads in the west. 

 

3 hours ago, Jantrix said:

I like this idea.

You gotta give respect for the guys that drove 5500 miles in that little buggy.

 

I've found a few short articles about their experience. That was a mostly stock T, and it is helpful to see where they had issues. Apparently the springs got beat to death, and they broke the axle, but luckily the car is so simple that it was easy to get repairs done in the middle of nowhere. That tells me beefier springs and axle support are on my list of improvements. 

[Jantrix]

16 hours ago, Aaronw said:

I've found a few short articles about their experience. That was a mostly stock T, and it is helpful to see where they had issues. Apparently the springs got beat to death, and they broke the axle, but luckily the car is so simple that it was easy to get repairs done in the middle of nowhere. That tells me beefier springs and axle support are on my list of improvements. 

There's no rule against adding shock absorbers, a panhard bar or some sort of anti-sway device. After seeing several racers online, it seems that modifications that improve survivability without giving an unfair advantage are both acceptable and encouraged. 

[MeatMan]

A quick update on the Tiger.

Well we finally got the engine back from the speed shop. Had the heads opened up to get the compression ratio down to 8.0:1 so that it will run on that bad Mongolian fuel.

We changed the carb to an Edelbrock small bore 4 barrel to help increase the torque, and went to a high flow water pump. The gang and I threw on a pair of Cobra valve covers we had laying around, along with a set of headers which we had ceramic coated to hold in the heat. 

Finally we dug up some racing seat frames which we plan to add some padding to.

[LouO]

Input, thoughts, opinion needed on if this is kind of stuff is permitted?

I'm building a 69 Nova for the P2P, and am thinking about extending the roll bar to the rear of the car. Within this design I'd also like to carry my 2 spare tires, however it looks like it might require partial or complete removal of the trunk lid, and/or possibly the rear window. I still have figure this all out.

I also thought about maybe doing something like a hatchback, or adding an inner wall and creating something similar to an  El'Camino. I'm just not sure what modifications like this can/can't be performed.  

Mainly do things like this fall under the technical specifications...8.1.10 No body panels of alternative composite materials or is there another place to get further details?

 

 

[Pete J.]

To all who requested them, the decals are in the mail.  With the exception of Jhedir6 and W409 you should have them by the end of the week.  The envelops may look like junk mail but in the return address they have "Peking to Paris Decals"  so keep an eye out for them.  For Niko and David, I have no idea how long it will take to get to you.  Finland and Canada deliver on their own schedules.  

For the rest of the Board members who are participating,  I have three blank decals leftover.  If anyone is interested let me know.  I will send you the blanks at no charge.

[Pat Minarick]

8 hours ago, LouO said:

Input, thoughts, opinion needed on if this is kind of stuff is permitted?

I'm building a 69 Nova for the P2P, and am thinking about extending the roll bar to the rear of the car. Within this design I'd also like to carry my 2 spare tires, however it looks like it might require partial or complete removal of the trunk lid, and/or possibly the rear window. I still have figure this all out.

I also thought about maybe doing something like a hatchback, or adding an inner wall and creating something similar to an  El'Camino. I'm just not sure what modifications like this can/can't be performed.  

Mainly do things like this fall under the technical specifications...8.1.10 No body panels of alternative composite materials or is there another place to get further details?

 

 

You can cut out wheel openings for clearance, and doesn't say anything  about removing body panels ?

[Pete J.]

Having looked at a lot of the real deal photos, I suspect that major surgery to the body panels would be frowned on.  Taking out an interior parts such as seats, carpet and non structural bulkheads to increase stowage would probably be ok, but changing the profile of exterior panels wouldn't.  It is still about having a passenger car.  No pickups, trucks, station wagons, panel vans or other large capacity hauling vehicle are permitted.  Yes, it is about getting as close to the line as possible, but it is also all about maintaining the spirit of the challenge.  That is driving "regular" passenger cars from Peking to Paris. 

[Pete J.]

Just now, Pete J. said:

Having looked at a lot of the real deal photos, I suspect that major surgery to the body panels would be frowned on.  Taking out an interior parts such as seats, carpet and non structural bulkheads to increase stowage would probably be ok, but changing the profile of exterior panels wouldn't.  It is still about having a passenger car.  No pickups, trucks, station wagons, panel vans or other large capacity hauling vehicle are permitted.  Yes, it is about getting as close to the line as possible, but it is also all about maintaining the spirit of the challenge.  After all, this is a "gentleman's" race.  Not a blood and guts, race.  That is driving "regular" passenger cars from Peking to Paris. 

 

[Jantrix]

10 hours ago, Pete J. said:

Having looked at a lot of the real deal photos, I suspect that major surgery to the body panels would be frowned on.  Taking out an interior parts such as seats, carpet and non structural bulkheads to increase stowage would probably be ok, but changing the profile of exterior panels wouldn't.  It is still about having a passenger car.  No pickups, trucks, station wagons, panel vans or other large capacity hauling vehicle are permitted.  Yes, it is about getting as close to the line as possible, but it is also all about maintaining the spirit of the challenge.  That is driving "regular" passenger cars from Peking to Paris. 

I'd say Pete has the right of it. Please refer to what other actual racers have done if the rules create a question on what is allowable.

Question. I've run into a snag with my '51. Opening the trunk. Easy. Hinging the trunk - a nightmare. The tulip panel is very narrow and the interior package shelf rather full so adding a hinge would involve major surgery. I think I'm just going to open the trunk and add dzus fasteners to hold the trunk on.

[LouO]

25 minutes ago, Jantrix said:

I'd say Pete has the right of it. Please refer to what other actual racers have done if the rules create a question on what is allowable.

Question. I've run into a snag with my '51. Opening the trunk. Easy. Hinging the trunk - a nightmare. The tulip panel is very narrow and the interior package shelf rather full so adding a hinge would involve major surgery. I think I'm just going to open the trunk and add dzus fasteners to hold the trunk on.

Kind of what I'm running into, after looking closer at the Nova. The top of trunk hits the bottom of the back window, so I started thinking of other ideas. Then I came across Rick Johnson's Snortin Nortin 73 Nova and was intrigued by the way the way the spare tire is being carried. I was thinking about doing something similar (but further toward the rear of car). However, it still involves cutting away part of the trunk lid. 

Oh well, there is always "plan B", back to drawing board. LOL. 

[stavanzer]

Lou, after finding a photo of the spare tire mount on the Nova, I think that mounting it that way might be OK for this race. It really doesn't affect the profile look of the car, and if you stayed with smaller 'street' sized tires, I could even see two tires working. As long as it was a clean, neat job, I'd be okay with it.

Just me though.

 

[426 pack]

Would it be ok to run just two roof rack rails like this?

[MeatMan]

I'd say yes, as long as that style was available when the car was new. I just think they were trying to make sure the big oversized racks weren't used.

8.2 Roof racks are permitted provided they meet the following
specification:
- They must be of a design available at the time the car was in production
- They must be made of metal
- They must be no longer or wider than the roof panel
- They must have sides no higher than 45 cm (18 inches)
- The roof rack and spare wheels must not be covered

[Fat Brian]

2 hours ago, 426 pack said:

Would it be ok to run just two roof rack rails like this?

You're in a bit of uncharted territory since they didn't really make racks for Mustangs. The rails are fine but if you want something with a bit more carrying capacity this is style of rack available at the time and you adapted it to your car. I'm going to be building something similar to this for the Beetle but from metal to meet the rules.

[FredRPG]

I didn't get very far last time I tried to finish for cannonball, but I'm going to give this a shot.  I had plans to redo this Rambler I built 30 years ago as a Carrera-Panamerica car so this fits right in.  I'll go with #62 if it's still available. 

[426 pack]

Ok here is another question. Can I run duall rear tires? I have read through the rules and can’t find anything saying I can’t do this but just to be sure I will see what you guys think. 

[Pete J.]

4 hours ago, 426 pack said:

Would it be ok to run just two roof rack rails like this?

I remember using roof rail systems like that in the 60's. There were many roof rack systems in the 50's through current day that were adjustable for various cars.  They used gutter clips to hold them on and had adjustable width bars.   They have a lot of options.  They have attachments for snow skis, surfboards, bikes canoes and a just plain basket.  I had the ski rack for my 69 Mustang when I was in college so I have to believe you are on the right track.  You could also use something like Brian suggested.