Tape attacked lacquer. Thoughts?

[atomicholiday]

I’m really hoping there’s an easy fix here.  Here’s the deal.  Yesterday I shot the hood (trunk lid in this case) Testors extreme lacquer blazing black.  Today I taped it off and shot the rest of the body Tamiya TS-26 pure white.  I let the white cure for about three hours, then pulled the tape off.  I pulled it slowly, and at angles away from the tape line.

Two types of tape were used.  Tamiya was used for all the separation lines and regular Scotch blue painters tape was used to cover the rest.  Doesn’t seem to matter though.

As you can see from the picture, the glue on both types of tape appear to have attacked the Testors paint.  I’m guessing it should have cured longer before taping.  

It still feels very smooth, and it’s not glue residue.  I tried washing it with dawn dish soap and it’s definitely in the finish.

Since it’s smooth, do you think the lines will disappear if I just shoot gloss over the whole thing?  Or maybe I should lightly wet sand it first?

 I’m open to suggestions, but I’d prefer not to strip and start over if possible.

 

Sucks, because the black was flawless.?

Edited June 19, 2023 by atomicholiday

[stitchdup]

I've had tape do that because it was on too long. I usually remove the tape as soon as its safe to pick up the parts. I think its caused by the thinners in the paints softening sort of wicking through the glue in the tape and lifting the colour. To fix it i'd  just mask off the white and shoot a light coat of the black again if the surface is good, but maybe play it safe and give a 1500 to check cos our hands aren't always that good a tell and black is pretty unforgiving. If it didn't work then i'd think about stripping it. Just take the tape of after 5-10 mins ifs its safe to do so and i think you'll be good

[Ace-Garageguy]

Different tapes do different jobs.

Blue tapes are designed primarily for latex paints, not for hotter solvent-based paints. Sometimes you can get away with using the blue stuff, sometimes not.

Most likely, enough solvent wicked through the blue stuff to disturb the Testors lacquer underneath...but why there's no tape adhesive residue on the black is baffling, as solvents usually cause it to become tacky and transfer to the surface.

I also don't understand why Tamiya paint solvents would wick through their own tape that's supposedly designed to be compatible. I suspect there might be something more to the story.

Whatever the exact cause is, I use masking tapes designed for real cars and never have any issues like this...but I'd also give the first color more than overnight before two-toning.

Les is right though...the minimum it's going to take to correct it is to sand the black flat and re-shoot it...and there's a chance those lines will still ghost back through as it drys.

[StevenGuthmiller]

I personally would never mask anything for a next day 2-tone paint, especially if it’s Testors paint.

Even their lacquers take much longer to cure properly than a true acrylic lacquer automotive paint.

Allowing a couple of days at least is always a good practice.

For the life of me, I can never understand the need to rush through these things.

That said, it has become evident to me over the years that the best practice for masking is to basically avoid masking tape as much as you possibly can.

It can be full of little surprises such as this.

I use just the very minimum of tape, most of which is Tamiya, and then do as much of the masking as possible with masking paper.

As a rule, the only tape on the body once I’ve finished masking, is Tamiya tape on just the demarcation lines between the two colors.

I find it very beneficial to never let regular, or blue painters tape touch my paint.

 

 

 

Steve

[atomicholiday]

13 hours ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

 

I also don't understand why Tamiya paint solvents would wick through their own tape that's supposedly designed to be compatible. I suspect there might be something more to the story.

The black is Testors extreme lacquer.

 

My bad.  I’m new to lacquer and thought I’d read somewhere that it cured much faster than apparently it actually does.  Lesson learned.  
I’ve actually used blue tape many times in the past and never had issues, except for one time that I left it on for about a week.  But in this case, I don’t think the tape was the problem, because the Tamiya tape did it too.  Just a case of uncured paint.

 I’m going to set it aside for about a week and then try wet sanding/reshooting the black.  Worst case, it gets stripped.  Not a huge deal, but it’s a shame.  This was turning out to be my best paint job yet.  Absolutely NO orange peel!

Thanks for your input gentlemen.
 

Trying a two-tone paint job is probably a little past my skill level, but as I see it, no guts no glory.  You’ll never improve if you don’t push yourself to your limits.  Not every attempt is a success, but sometimes it works out and you surprise yourself.  And even the failures offer the benefit of a learning experience.

[Anglia105E]

Not sure if this will help you Jeremy at this stage, but when I carry out two-tone paint jobs on my 1:24 scale Rolls-Royce Silver Clouds, the tape that I use is a specialist automotive tape . . . The tape is orange, 6 mm wide, shiny PVC type surface to it, and it bends around corners. This tape is primarily intended for coachlining work between two colours on full size 1:1 cars, like Pin Stripe . . . . Here is a link to an Ebay seller for the product . . .

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/175544494533?hash=item28df4469c5:g:0HoAAOSwMEBjpHEy&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA4CkrGR1SKtrhjGMbAhjZ6yenoDF9UPaABPLqc93VP4ZJh1Z4l87mRh9AAWAFRhnsWAjCeVEqbbdOn92g1n8x7xa9Z5fxEZDZm8atZXFpjXg9rwE3AUcftyfkvT5p3UJ5wwZXyuPVPU6ttVXnX4vGuJmCYKwxpvUGmI9QPsYL8SSyzqMjHvpH0N1%2B9HMVsO6tdq0f5hJZh8%2Bq6IkEVfvl0wli8QtHHkJRE6Ku9cfBh%2BrVg5BVFvl7G%2Bcvb5%2Ft8oI3ZWLgvwgwHFaFJsUgeUCLUllZNaG9Rh4yVFtXffrUCBzD|tkp%3ABk9SR4bTuImbYg#

Two photos of a previous masking job. The tape is also available in 3 mm width and different colours.

David

[ctruss53]

It sounds like you waited long enough. But that sure looks like the paint wasn't fully cured before you put tappe over it. So I don't know what to tell you.

[Bainford]

I'm pretty sure one of the factors here is not enough time permitted for the black to cure. However, the problem is not solvents of the overcoat reacting with the tape adhesive. The problem is more insidious than that. I have had this same problem occur on two occasions. Both times, the paint was cured for months, both times it was lacquer paint (once Duplicolor, and once Tamiya), both times it was Tamiya tape only, and both times no paint was applied over the tape. The tape was used for a purpose other than masking paint, such as protecting painted surfaces during final assembly (how ironic). My problem was the tape was left on too long, probably a couple weeks or so. The result was exactly as shown in your photo. A heavy alligator skin texture with no transfer of adhesive to the paint. The only way forward is sanding out the texture, and if necessary, repainting.

I was quite disappointed to find Tamiya tape had this reaction, especially to Tamiya's own lacquer paint, but there it is. To stay on the safe side, be sure paint is FULLY cured (time is your friend) and remove any tape as soon as possible (time is your enemy). In your case the tape was not on too long, but the result is the same.

I am intrigued, though, but the vinyl tape David shows above. Some experimenting is in order.

[StevenGuthmiller]

2 hours ago, atomicholiday said:

My bad.  I’m new to lacquer and thought I’d read somewhere that it cured much faster than apparently it actually does.  Lesson learned.  

I don't consider Testors lacquer to really be "lacquer".

It's an entirely different animal than the lacquer that most people have in mind when they're talking about lacquer.

There's acrylic lacquer automotive paint, which cures extremely quickly, and then there's paint like Testors "lacquer", which is formulated for plastic models.

I don't really know what the heck it is.

But I do know that it requires more curing time than automotive lacquer.

 

 

Steve

[bobthehobbyguy]

3 hours ago, atomicholiday said:

The black is Testors extreme lacquer.

 

My bad.  I’m new to lacquer and thought I’d read somewhere that it cured much faster than apparently it actually does.  Lesson learned.  
I’ve actually used blue tape many times in the past and never had issues, except for one time that I left it on for about a week.  But in this case, I don’t think the tape was the problem, because the Tamiya tape did it too.  Just a case of uncured paint.

 I’m going to set it aside for about a week and then try wet sanding/reshooting the black.  Worst case, it gets stripped.  Not a huge deal, but it’s a shame.  This was turning out to be my best paint job yet.  Absolutely NO orange peel!

Thanks for your input gentlemen.
 

Trying a two-tone paint job is probably a little past my skill level, but as I see it, no guts no glory.  You’ll never improve if you don’t push yourself to your limits.  Not every attempt is a success, but sometimes it works out and you surprise yourself.  And even the failures offer the benefit of a learning experience.

You have the right attitude on making mistakes. Learn from them and don't make the same  mistake twice.

Side note when sparying a 2 tone paint job the lighter color is sprayed first. It can be harder to cover the darker color with the lighter.

I definitely think you need to let it sit for more than a month. Let the black completely out gas.(the paint is fully dry when you can smell it.

I'd then carefully mask the white and sand the black.when done remove that tape. Remask and shoot the black.

 

[Mike 1017]

I pull off the tape as soon as possible.

[Fat Brian]

I've had this happen with Tamiya tape as well. If you want to try to save the paint job you could wet sand the black and try to reshoot it. I got some no name tape off Amazon that seems to work better. It's not as this as the Tamiya stuff but it hasn't eaten the paint underneath it yet.

[Dpate]

I would never use painters tape regardless who’s been successful with it. Use it for your house walls if you can’t free hand anything. My main tapes are Tamiya along with their curve tape, and AK has curved tape now that is blue also works great. Did you de tack the tape? I always de tack Tamiya every time I use it. 

[atomicholiday]

20 hours ago, Dpate said:

Did you de tack the tape? 

Yup.  De-tacked both types.  Almost has to be a reaction between the adhesive and the uncured paint. 

Anyway.   I'm going to set it aside and come back to it after a few weeks.  Then, as suggested, wet sand and probably reshoot the black. 

Guarantee I won't do that again...