I don't care for it.

[Guest Johnny]

It is easy to be tactful face to face and almost impossible online because a persons physical actions speak as loud as what he says and without the visual it will always come off harsher to the recipient.

I can remember sitting next to one of my boys looking over a build he was doing. Even then I had to be very careful not to discourage in showing him what was wrong and how to do it better.

I know it would have been a train wreck trying to do the same thing over the internet!

The unfortunate thing here is there are some that have no tact at all when it comes to pointing out mistakes.

Same as there are some who just cannot take even the most sincere creative criticism.

Kind of a catch 22!

[Rob McKee]

Personally I want to become a better modeller so I would prefer an honest opinion on my models. Learning from the constuctive words of those who are better modellers than I will help me improve. Really, we should all be accustomed to this. For example, when we play on any sports team we are exposed to critism constantly which make us better players. If a coach or a team-mate praised when we make errors we would just repeat the errors. When we are in school we are constantly being corrected and told how to improve.

On the other hand, I can understand why some may not want the feedback. Modelling is their hobby and they may not want to take it to seriously. They may feel they can learn from doing and watching all of the others on this forum. Posting their builds may just be to celebrate a personal accomplishment of finishing the model.

It's a tough call. I guess if the person asks for feedback then it should be given in a friendly constructive manner.

Another thing to consider, communcation via text on a computer is difficult. Often the writers mood and the context of the message is misunderstood. We have to try and word our messages in such a way to ensure the reader understands that the message is meant to be friendly.

[Harry P.]

On the other hand, I can understand why some may not want the feedback. Modelling is their hobby and they may not want to take it to seriously. They may feel they can learn from doing and watching all of the others on this forum. Posting their builds may just be to celebrate a personal accomplishment of finishing the model.

If you post photos of your work on a public forum, your work is legitimately open to comments and critiques. Period. That's how a forum works. If a person doesn't want feedback they shouldn't be posting their work in the first place! Like I said earlier, there is no "magic bubble" that protects one's work from comments, nor should there be.

If a person doesn't want feedback, they should not post pictures, simple as that. It's completely unfair for someone to post photos of their work and then expect everyone else to not say a word, or worse yet, offer false praise and meaningless "attaboys."

If a person can't handle comments and criticism, they should not post their work. Makes sense to me.

[Bartster]

I agree with everything said so far. Being "reborn" into the hobby recently, I comment only on models I can praise. There are too many more experienced & talented modelers here for myself to be giving ANY advice or criticisms no matter how constructive. That said, the ONLY reason I would ever post a build here would be to take advantage of the more knowledgeable artists on this forum. To have the opportunity to learn from master craftsmen-for FREE-is a win/win situation whether your 12 or 50!! The only thing I could add to this thread is that it should be required reading!!!i

[Mercman]

I use my wife as a guide for my builds. She'll let me know in no uncertain terms what looks good or doesn't. I post what I build looking for critiques both good and bad. Like it was mentioned it is a ongoing learning experience. I only got into HO scale a few years back being inspired by Ken H. I look at his work along with others who work in this scale, and try to do what they do. It has made me a better modeler in my opinion. If I see something I don't care for, a particular build I wont comment on it. When I see something taht I like I'll post a comment. Recently I pointed out a small oversight on a great builders project he finised. He thanked me for pointing it out. Like he stated he thought he was done, but missed one little componet of the build.

Basically I build for myself when it comes to cars. The quality of the work now for a killer contest model is beyond my comfort zone. The stakes have risen so high that I choose to not to do them anymore. Yeah I know I probably could but then I would have more unfinished projects.

I welcome comments on all of my builds good or bad. If asked for comments I will post them, but I wont get NASTY, or Snide.

[Scott Colmer]

If I see a really great in progress build that has what appears to be some technical error. I'll PM the builder, letting them know how much I like what they are doing, and this or that looks like it is an issue. The few times I've done this, the recipiants were open and responsive.

Once I did do an construction error comment in a thread on a finished build in another forum. I thought about it for a while afterwards and decided for me the PM method works better.

Scott

[Terry Sumner]

I use my wife as a guide for my builds. She'll let me know in no uncertain terms what looks good or doesn't.

That part had me laughing to myself when I read it. And why you might ask? Because I do the same thing! My wife will tell me in no uncertain terms when something looks bad or looks out of place to her eyes. Now sometimes she's wrong and I can explain to her why it is the way it is. But she will definitely speak her mind. And I gotta love her for that. She's been looking at my models and has come with me to a bunch of shows for many many years now and she actually knows what she's looking at!

In fact, she has been looking over my shoulder on occasion here on the forum and has seen a few of these poorly done models that we're talking about here...the ones with all the sheep comments. And even SHE has said to me, "Why are they all saying it looks so great? Look at the orange peel in the paint!" Or something like that.. Cracks me up that even a non-modeler can see the error of our ways in this regard.

Edited February 28, 2012 by Terry Sumner

[Casey]

If you post photos of your work on a public forum, your work is legitimately open to comments and critiques. Period. That's how a forum works. If a person doesn't want feedback they shouldn't be posting their work in the first place! Like I said earlier, there is no "magic bubble" that protects one's work from comments, nor should there be.

If a person doesn't want feedback, they should not post pictures, simple as that. It's completely unfair for someone to post photos of their work and then expect everyone else to not say a word, or worse yet, offer false praise and meaningless "attaboys."

If a person can't handle comments and criticism, they should not post their work. Makes sense to me.

It can be hard to separate Harry's personal opinions from his actions as a Moderator if this forum, but I think this is what leads to some confusion and why some are hesitant to post honest critiques:

"Rules for On The Workbench For those viewing others who are presenting their works in progress in this section of the forum, please keep your criticisms, sarcasms, and other comments to yourself, unless the builder/poster has specifically asked for such replies."

So, unless someone specifically ASKS FOR critques or comments, they are not allowed, even if they are meant as constructive cirticism. I understand why snide remarks and sarcasm aren't welcome, but from what I'm reading, comments aren't even allowed. I'm guessing the rules were tightened up to deal with members who like to test the limits, but read word-for-word, it's pretty much "look but don't comment unless asked to".

Edited February 28, 2012 by Casey

[Terry Sumner]

That's only in the workbench section. Not in the "Under Glass" finished models section. Or at least that's how I see it.... I could be wrong!

Edited February 28, 2012 by Terry Sumner

[Harry P.]

It can be hard to separate Harry's personal opinions from his actions as a Moderator if this forum, but I think this is what leads to some confusion and why some are hesitant to post honest critiques:

"Rules for On The Workbench For those viewing others who are presenting their works in progress in this section of the forum, please keep your criticisms, sarcasms, and other comments to yourself, unless the builder/poster has specifically asked for such replies."

So, unless someone specifically ASKS FOR critques or comments, they are not allowed, even if they are meant as constructive cirticism. I understand why snide remarks and sarcasm aren't welcome, but from what I'm reading, comments aren't even allowed. I'm guessing the rules were tightened up to deal with members who like to test the limits, but read word-for-word, it's pretty much "look but don't comment unless asked to".

Yeah, that's a problem. I very much disagree with that rule. Yes, it was put in place to try and stop the bashers from doing their thing, but I don't agree with it being there. If I see a legitimate comment or critique that's directed at the model ("I think you should try to tighten up your foil work in the future"), as far as I'm concerned that's perfectly ok. If I see a comment directed at the person or the person's style ("I really think your model looks stupid," "I think your building style is dumb"), that's not ok, and if I see a comment like that I'll delete it.

That's why we have moderators... to moderate (and delete when necessary). To make a blanket rule saying "no comments allowed, period" doesn't make sense to me.

Other mods may feel differently, but IMO comments and critiques are the whole point of posting photos of your work.

[SuperStockAndy]

Yeah, that's a problem. I very much disagree with that rule. Yes, it was put in place to try and stop the bashers from doing their thing, but I don't agree with it being there. If I see a legitimate comment or critique that's directed at the model ("I think you should try to tighten up your foil work in the future"), as far as I'm concerned that's perfectly ok. If I see a comment directed at the person or the person's style ("I really think your model looks stupid," "I think your building style is dumb"), that's not ok, and if I see a comment like that I'll delete it.

Other mods may feel differently, but IMO comments and critiques are the whole point of posting photos of your work.

The way you said it couldn't be any better

Personally, I don't mind constructive criticism, as long as it's said in a humane manner.

[gray07]

Me i know iam not perfect, and i would never tell another person that the model they built was not perfect, ive seen so many models on model sites and shows that they put all this extra stuff on the model like brake lines, gas lines, hoses, carpet on the floor and other stuff but they forget the most obvious item on the outside of the car, The valve stems,. Now should i say nice work on the model but hey you forgot the valve stems, no, i wont do it, because my models are not perfect. Maybe iam wrong at that i dont know.

[1930fordpickup]

After reading this forum for awhile now ( and getting my password and username found in the pile of paper work) I was wondering why people need to add the wheels are not my bag comments? This makes me wonder if I ever want to post pictures (if I can figure it out ) . If you are telling someone how to make a better model that is one thing , to add your taste in the mix is not constructive .We all like different things .

[sjordan2]

In my opinion, constructive criticism based on knowledge and experience (not opinions of taste) is not merely directed at the builder, but is something the rest of us can learn from.

[Jantrix]

I was wondering why people need to add the wheels are not my bag comments?

I would consider this a compliment honestly. I would say that most of use rarely visit threads on subjects they aren't interested in. I just don't enough time to visit everything. So for them to visit the thread and compliment the work even though, "those wheels aren't my bag", I think you should be pleased.

The alternative is no reply or feedback at all.

[groo12]

I would hope people are being honest about my builds, it's the only way I am going to learn.

It's like any feedback , it needs to be honest to be helpful, friends always tell me my photos are great, that's nice, just not helpful.

Although I have to admit, I usually know where the faults are, it's still good to get a second or third opinion.

Having said all that, I don't feel as if I am experienced enough yet, to post feedback on other peoples builds, unless it is really obvious.

[Casey]

After reading this forum for awhile now ( and getting my password and username found in the pile of paper work) I was wondering why people need to add the wheels are not my bag comments? This makes me wonder if I ever want to post pictures (if I can figure it out ) . If you are telling someone how to make a better model that is one thing , to add your taste in the mix is not constructive .We all like different things .

True, but it sometime depends on the style of the build. Say you're building a Revell '49 Mercury with spotlights, fender skirts, a tuck and roll interior, and frenched head and tail lights, which would look to many like a traditional '50s kustom. Now, let's say you added some 17" billet wheels and 45-series tires to the model...it doesn't fit with the theme as a whole. Maybe that's what the builder wants, likes, and intends, but when viewed by another member, it doesn't all work well together.

Learning to think about parts and how they are used together, rather than just using what you find in a parts box and putting it all together is a skill. Maybe people don't care, and certainly tastes and opinions will vary wildly, but I think most people can see the difference between a well thought out model which works together as a whole and a model which just has different parts added until it's finished. Take a look at Sean Svendsen's builds for an example of well thought out models which are far more than the sum of their parts: http://homepage.mac.com/ssven5/Sites/Svensworldofwheels/images/modelcarindex.html

[groo12]

Having just said that, I went and checked my finished model posts and I forget to say comments welcome on the last two. I'll try to remember it for the future.

But thatdidn't stop some people and I found those comments helpful and will use the advice for future builds.

[Kit Basher]

Yeah, that's a problem. I very much disagree with that rule. Yes, it was put in place to try and stop the bashers from doing their thing, but I don't agree

OK that does it! I chose the screen name "basher" because I am a kit basher. I have seen the term used pejoratively in this and other similar threads, so I am going to change my name to "kitbasher" if I can figure out how!

Edit: The name "kitbasher" is already taken, I'll have to think of something else.

Edited February 28, 2012 by basher

[Harry P.]

OK that does it! I chose the screen name "basher" because I am a kit basher. I have seen the term used pejoratively in this and other similar threads, so I am going to change my name to "kitbasher" if I can figure out how!

Edit: The name "kitbasher" is already taken, I'll have to think of something else.

Go with Kit Basher (two words).

[1930fordpickup]

Thanks for the feedback . I did not look at it that way .

[Southsider]

I have not yet posted my first build, but I probably will once I get it done. I'm one of those guys that hasn't built a model in 25-30 years and is picking it back up. Back then in my teens, I know I wasn't very good, didn't have a ton of money to buy the good materials and such, impatient youth, etc. I remember how fun it was and now I'm trying to get my kids into it.

If/when I post some pics of a build, I would totally welcome criticism. I hesitate to put a but in that sentence, however I feel it needs to be there. I like criticism if it's accompanied by some helpful advice. Simply telling me "You've got some bleed through on that line." is probabaly not the most helpful statement. I would think if somebody thinks enough of themself to critique somebody elses work, they know how it could have been done better. Perhaps a reply like "You've got some bleed through on that line, next time you should try..." that is infinitely more helpful and I would love to hear things like that. It also benefits those of us that are using this site for helpful tips and advice. On numerous occasions, I've been looking for some tips on certain things. I will come across posts where somebody may make one of these negative comments, and I'm left wondering, "OK, he's having the same problem and you noticed it, why not tell how it can be done better."

[philo426]

I evaluate the comment to see if it has merit.on some of my builds,people have criticized my wheel choice ,stance or use of sidepipes.Since I build my models exactly the way I want them i just ignore the subjective comments as it is a matter of personal preference.In no case to I lash out or get defensive when a critique is posted,because this is supposed to be fun and relaxing!

[Kit Basher]

Go with Kit Basher (two words).

Thanks for the suggestion, Harry. I hope it was clear that I was not really upset, I was just playing with you. I am gonna change my name anyway, tho.

[Guest Dr. Odyssey]

I wonder why there are so many complimentary posts to what is clearly poor paint jobs?

Are the complimentors impressed because it is better than they can do? I think some one mentioned that but it doesn't make sense to me.

If that is it, don't they know what a good paint job looks like? They have to have seen a real car, or even just the models on box tops. Truly apples (shiny) and oranges (peely).