Race car lettering

[Bandit17]

I am wondering what others are using to letter their race cars, (fine tip markers, paint brushes, etc.) I am building a couple of 1960's short track cars, and really want to paint the numbers and sponsors on it like the real cars were (before vinyl) Any suggestions?

[slusher]

Have you thought about going to a sign shop that prints signs and logos out of vinyl. Sometimes they will give you scraps and you might see if they can print some..

[Bandit17]

That's what I want to avoid! I have plenty of "vinyl guys". I would like to paint it on instead, just to make it more realistic.

[Chief Joseph]

I know a guy on Facebook who does this sort of thing. He does a lot of short- and dirt-track cars. I believe he uses sign-lettering enamel and does it all by hand.

[Bandit17]

I know a guy on Facebook who does this sort of thing. He does a lot of short- and dirt-track cars. I believe he uses sign-lettering enamel and does it all by hand.

Any chance you could find out what kind of brushes or other items he uses or recommends to? I can do the lettering etc. I just don't know what to use to apply it, or if there is such a thing as markers or paint pens that are fine enough and user friendly enough to do it?

[wisdonm]

I know a guy that used to letter 1:1 racers. He now hand letters his model race cars. He uses the same 1-shot lettering paint for both.

[Bandit17]

I know a guy that used to letter 1:1 racers. He now hand letters his model race cars. He uses the same 1-shot lettering paint for both.

I may have stated my questions incorrectly! I am not necessarily looking for which paint to use (although that is helpful) I am wondering which brushes to use to get clean lines, and if it is possible that there is an easier way (like a fine tip paint pen) to get the correct lines and letters? I am not a sign painter, or pinstriper, but I can draw, just not sure what tool to use?

[LoneWolf15]

Bandit ,

Head for the local art supply store and explain your needs . Might cost you a bit , but you'll be using quality brushes which will produce a stellar outcome !

[Bandit17]

Bandit ,

Head for the local art supply store and explain your needs . Might cost you a bit , but you'll be using quality brushes which will produce a stellar outcome !

I'll try that! Not sure why I didn't think of that....

Thank you!

[Ace-Garageguy]

When you get there, look at something like these. Thinning One-Shot striping enamel to work correctly in them might take a fair bit of experimentation, but I'm 90% sure it's possible. NOTE: The color coding denotes tip size, not ink color.

http://www.usartsupply.com/ItemDetail.aspx?ItemNo=ALV+3165SP7A&gclid=CP_2s_Lujb0CFS9p7AodLHYAYA

Edited March 12, 2014 by Ace-Garageguy

[Psychographic]

As someone who has hand lettered vehicles for over 40 years, I will suggest lettering quills for brushes, One Shot or Ronan lettering enamels for paint, and for reducer, I use Dupont 3812 enamel reducer. A lot of people will tell you to palette your paint using a phone book, I strongly disagree, flat paper can pull fibers into your paint so use a glossy magazine. Practice on some glass as when you are done you can wipe it off or let it dry and scrape it off with a razor blade.

Lettering is not as easy as many think, very few people pick it up right away. To letter a 1/25 scale model is WAY harder than 1:1. If you need more assistance, PM me.

This was all done with One shot and the numbers are 23K gold leaf.

Edited March 13, 2014 by Psychographic

[Dave Van]

Any decent soft, sable etc, brush will work. The biggest factor is hours of practice. Back in the 1960's when I built stock cars there were no decals so I painted all mine. But even after years of doing it....I was never 100% happy. So practice practice practice....no magic secret to it.

[Art Anderson]

Any decent soft, sable etc, brush will work. The biggest factor is hours of practice. Back in the 1960's when I built stock cars there were no decals so I painted all mine. But even after years of doing it....I was never 100% happy. So practice practice practice....no magic secret to it.

Some thoughts here:

1) There was an excellent "how to" article in either Rod & Custom or Rod & Custom Models magazines circa 1962-64, by legendary Los Angeles car modeler Don Emmons on hand-lettering on model cars. If you can find this article, it's a God-send, literally, because the techniques Emmons showed are both simple and very doable, even more-so today. Surely someone who frequents this forum or the one sponsored by Spotlight Hobbies has that article and can scan it for you.

2) The techniques for "sign writing" on a model car are really not that much different than the old "classic" sign-writers used--only 1/25 (or whatever scale one is using) smaller.

3) Good reference photos are most valuable, even if they aren't of the exact graphics you are trying to replicate, as sign-painters tended to have a pretty good repertoire (albeit often huge) of lettering fonts and styles that they learned over time. Many of those lettering fonts and styles can be found online. Of course, a lot of race car numbers tended to be very "stylized", particularly by the late 1950's and through the 60's, even beyond, but the basic principles and techniques really didn't change all that much back in the days of hand-painted signage (virtually all the painters who lettered and numbered those race cars of decades past were professional sign painters, and in between the infrequent race car gigs could be found lettering all manner of commercial vehicles, as well as painting signs, storefronts, even lettering office and retail store doors. And this leads me to the next suggestion:

4) A very good reference for how those sign painting artists did what they did, is to look for pictures of well-worn commercial vehicles (they are out there online for the sheer dozens. Worn hand-painted signage often shows the brush strokes, how they did what they did, which can show how sign painters filled in the larger, wider graphics, brush stroke by brush stroke, and that leads me to what I used for brushes in 1/25 scale:

5) I pretty much settled on just three or four sizes of detailing brushes: #1, #0, #5/0 and #10/0 artists "rounds", which can be found with shorter handles like the detailing brushes we modelers tend to use. Look for good quality red sable brushes, and further, look carefully through any selection, choosing only those which have a well-defined sharp point to them. Rather than looking at common brushes often found alongside model paints in a hobby shop--if you have an art supply store handy (or even the artists' supply department of a Michael's or Hobby Lobby), check out their brushes--and keep looking to find the best.

6) As for paints, while yes, "One Shot" sign writing paints are tremendous, they are not available just anywhere, and they do come in pretty large cans--4-6 fluid ounces. In addition, One Shot is old-fashioned "4-hour" enamel (unless their formula has changed markedly) meaning that they take almost that long just to get to the "tacky" stage, and require a good 24 hours or more to dry thoroughly. For my model race cars (mostly built 1966-85) I found that Testors bottle paints worked just fine.

7) While I didn't have available clear decal film for most of my race car building "period", when it became generally available, I found clear film very valuable for hand-painting letters, numbers and race car logo's, simply because it was far easier to do that "on the flat" than on the undulations and curvature of a model car body shell. Once these were done on decal film, they can be cut out, and applied just like any printed decal.

For a palette, I found, per Don Emmons' article, that a small glass mirror (Emmons used mirrors from his wife's old purses and/or cosmetic compacts) for testing brush strokes and even for mixing tiny bits of color. When done, a razor blade, Xacto knife, or even a bit of paper towel soaked in lacquer thinner cleans all the paint off glass in a heartbeat--and the paint does NOT soak into glass.

Here is the one remaining example of an Indy car that I built in 1978, AJ Foyt's 1977 Coyote, the car that carried Foyt to his 4th Indianapolis Victory--virtually all the graphics specific to this car were hand painted with the brushes and paints I described. Those include the #'s 14, the Gilmore Broadcasting Logo, Foyt's "signature" name on the sides of the cowling, the "cowboy hat" logo, and the "Coyote" emblem on the front of the cowling. Of course, the Diehard and Goodyear logo's are decals.

In short, nothing beats the look of that old-school hand painted work by classic sign painters (who ruled before the advent of laser-cut, computer generated graphics) than miniature hand-painted race car graphics, in my opinion.

Art

[DrGlueblob]

Just to add, One of my more precious possessions is my old Letteraset catalog, circa 1980. It contains hundreds of fonts that Letteraset offered for graphic designers back then. Today, just download any font ya want and print if off.

"Juan Chott" is still the Gold Standard of lettering sign paints, IMHO.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Yup, Letraset dry-transfers were a really great modeling product, and some fonts even came in white and red, as well as black. I used them extensively in my RR modeling days, and in design work. Sorry to see them gone, but there are still options. Chartpak continues to offer a limited range, and also sells film to print your own. There is a variety of fonts available from RR modeling suppliers too.

Here's a way to make your own, any font, any color. http://www.pulsarprofx.com/decalpro/

NOTE: These are NOT decals. They are true, carrier-free, rub-down dry transfers.

Edited March 13, 2014 by Ace-Garageguy

[Skip]

When you get there, look at something like these. Thinning One-Shot striping enamel to work correctly in them might take a fair bit of experimentation, but I'm 90% sure it's possible. NOTE: The color coding denotes tip size, not ink color.

http://www.usartsupply.com/ItemDetail.aspx?ItemNo=ALV+3165SP7A&gclid=CP_2s_Lujb0CFS9p7AodLHYAYA

graph

One Shot will not flow through a Rapidograph Technical Pen, they are made to flow illustration ink only. They are somewhat of a pain to clean with ink, I cannot even begin to imagine cleaning enamel paint out of one. I have uses some of the liquid watercolor paints in them, but at $20 plus per pen I wouldn't feed any other paint through it. They don't like India ink either it's too grainy and tends to plug up then pen nibs.

I gave a rather long winded but accurate answer to someone asking almost the same question here.

http://www.modelcarsmag.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=75616&hl=

This was essentially the same question you are asking. For model car leer rearing almost any enamel brush type paint will work, the little Testers jars are about the same consistency as One Shot, Ronan, Little Daddy Roth striping and lettering paints. There are a few old Signwritters and Stripers that hang around here, if you ask nice we could provide a little guidance.

While you are looking up lettering fonts look up "Snap" it is the quick informal lettering style used on a lot of race cars and signs. At least that's the name I've always heard that style referred to. There are tons of font styles on the Net, you should have no problem finding more than you need out there.

For what you are lettering you might look at a "Rigger" watercolor brush, cutting the tip as described in the other post. Riggers are named so because they are used by watercolor artists to paint ships rigging.

Hope this helps you get where you want to go.

[Bandit17]

As someone who has hand lettered vehicles for over 40 years, I will suggest lettering quills for brushes, One Shot or Ronan lettering enamels for paint, and for reducer, I use Dupont 3812 enamel reducer. A lot of people will tell you to palette your paint using a phone book, I strongly disagree, flat paper can pull fibers into your paint so use a glossy magazine. Practice on some glass as when you are done you can wipe it off or let it dry and scrape it off with a razor blade.

Lettering is not as easy as many think, very few people pick it up right away. To letter a 1/25 scale model is WAY harder than 1:1. If you need more assistance, PM me.

This was all done with One shot and the numbers are 23K gold leaf.

Great work!! Thank you very much. I'm going to try it out, I just want to make it look original!

[Bandit17]

Some thoughts here:

1) There was an excellent "how to" article in either Rod & Custom or Rod & Custom Models magazines circa 1962-64, by legendary Los Angeles car modeler Don Emmons on hand-lettering on model cars. If you can find this article, it's a God-send, literally, because the techniques Emmons showed are both simple and very doable, even more-so today. Surely someone who frequents this forum or the one sponsored by Spotlight Hobbies has that article and can scan it for you.

2) The techniques for "sign writing" on a model car are really not that much different than the old "classic" sign-writers used--only 1/25 (or whatever scale one is using) smaller.

3) Good reference photos are most valuable, even if they aren't of the exact graphics you are trying to replicate, as sign-painters tended to have a pretty good repertoire (albeit often huge) of lettering fonts and styles that they learned over time. Many of those lettering fonts and styles can be found online. Of course, a lot of race car numbers tended to be very "stylized", particularly by the late 1950's and through the 60's, even beyond, but the basic principles and techniques really didn't change all that much back in the days of hand-painted signage (virtually all the painters who lettered and numbered those race cars of decades past were professional sign painters, and in between the infrequent race car gigs could be found lettering all manner of commercial vehicles, as well as painting signs, storefronts, even lettering office and retail store doors. And this leads me to the next suggestion:

4) A very good reference for how those sign painting artists did what they did, is to look for pictures of well-worn commercial vehicles (they are out there online for the sheer dozens. Worn hand-painted signage often shows the brush strokes, how they did what they did, which can show how sign painters filled in the larger, wider graphics, brush stroke by brush stroke, and that leads me to what I used for brushes in 1/25 scale:

5) I pretty much settled on just three or four sizes of detailing brushes: #1, #0, #5/0 and #10/0 artists "rounds", which can be found with shorter handles like the detailing brushes we modelers tend to use. Look for good quality red sable brushes, and further, look carefully through any selection, choosing only those which have a well-defined sharp point to them. Rather than looking at common brushes often found alongside model paints in a hobby shop--if you have an art supply store handy (or even the artists' supply department of a Michael's or Hobby Lobby), check out their brushes--and keep looking to find the best.

6) As for paints, while yes, "One Shot" sign writing paints are tremendous, they are not available just anywhere, and they do come in pretty large cans--4-6 fluid ounces. In addition, One Shot is old-fashioned "4-hour" enamel (unless their formula has changed markedly) meaning that they take almost that long just to get to the "tacky" stage, and require a good 24 hours or more to dry thoroughly. For my model race cars (mostly built 1966-85) I found that Testors bottle paints worked just fine.

7) While I didn't have available clear decal film for most of my race car building "period", when it became generally available, I found clear film very valuable for hand-painting letters, numbers and race car logo's, simply because it was far easier to do that "on the flat" than on the undulations and curvature of a model car body shell. Once these were done on decal film, they can be cut out, and applied just like any printed decal.

For a palette, I found, per Don Emmons' article, that a small glass mirror (Emmons used mirrors from his wife's old purses and/or cosmetic compacts) for testing brush strokes and even for mixing tiny bits of color. When done, a razor blade, Xacto knife, or even a bit of paper towel soaked in lacquer thinner cleans all the paint off glass in a heartbeat--and the paint does NOT soak into glass.

Here is the one remaining example of an Indy car that I built in 1978, AJ Foyt's 1977 Coyote, the car that carried Foyt to his 4th Indianapolis Victory--virtually all the graphics specific to this car were hand painted with the brushes and paints I described. Those include the #'s 14, the Gilmore Broadcasting Logo, Foyt's "signature" name on the sides of the cowling, the "cowboy hat" logo, and the "Coyote" emblem on the front of the cowling. Of course, the Diehard and Goodyear logo's are decals.

In short, nothing beats the look of that old-school hand painted work by classic sign painters (who ruled before the advent of laser-cut, computer generated graphics) than miniature hand-painted race car graphics, in my opinion.

Art

Thank you Art, very cool, and very good information!

[Bandit17]

Thank you everyone! I have some great info to work with now. Exactly what I needed. I will post some pictures as soon as I get it done......gonna be a little while, but the work has begun!

[Dave Van]

Yup, Letraset dry-transfers were a really great modeling product, and some fonts even came in white and red, as well as black. I used them extensively in my RR modeling days, and in design work. Sorry to see them gone, but there are still options. Chartpak continues to offer a limited range, and also sells film to print your own. There is a variety of fonts available from RR modeling suppliers too.

Here's a way to make your own, any font, any color. http://www.pulsarprofx.com/decalpro/

NOTE: These are NOT decals. They are true, carrier-free, rub-down dry transfers.

The graphics supply house in Charlotte carried every Letraset sheet made and some other brands. A whole wall of the store was big drawers of transfers. They even did custom work and I had a number of custom runs made.......the good old days.....

[Art Anderson]

Thank you everyone! I have some great info to work with now. Exactly what I needed. I will post some pictures as soon as I get it done......gonna be a little while, but the work has begun!

A very good way (from my experiences with race car models going back to the mid-1960's) to develop hand-lettering/sign painting techniques in model form is to overpaint decal numbers and even lettering with very small paint brushes and Testors enamels. I had to learn to do that with the often very poorly printed decals on such cars back in the 60's and 70's--most were lithographs rather than screen printed, which gave their colored portions a very grainy look very much like the old "rotogravure" process with photographs printed in newspapers and magazines, or were so weakly pigmented that they did not cover darker body colors well at all.

This is sort of like painting up one of those old Craftmaster "Paint-by-Numbers" paintings that were highly popular back in the 50's and 60's--very much learning to "paint between the lines", but I found that process to be both easy to do on poor decals as well as a learning curve for doing my own freehand graphics, such as on my AJ Foyt Coyote which I posted above in this thread.

Art