"I thought that I would let you paint them and put them together for me..."

[Ridge Rider]

Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime. I would offer to get two of the same models and build them at the same time. 1. You find out how serious he really is. 2. He will cherish something earned a lot more than something given. 3. It could be a fun and learning experience for the both of you making you closer friends. Or you may never speak to each other again. It could go either way.

[philo426]

Hey Chepp.i dont think i could just throw it together like that.Even if the recipient did not notice the lack of effort,I would know! i built a '69 Firebird that i converted to a conv that matches my brother in law's 1:1 car and he was thrilled.came out pretty well even if it was not super detailed.

Edited July 21, 2014 by philo426

[Quick GMC]

The majority of people that find out I build model cars have always been dumbfounded how much time I put into them. Like it's been stated before, I think people just don't realize how much time could go into a model. Most people didn't know that you could buy detail parts or anything like that.

[Owie]

I saw above about someone and lexan rc bodies, my dad had a business selling those and it'd be funny when someone came up to him after seeing some of his best on the internet, and ask, "How much for something like this?" (Picture on phone, faded gold to silver with tiger stripes) and he said "$100, on a six month waiting list." He was great at what he did, bit it was darn pricy. We still have a "Prowler" body that's a replica of the monster jam truck. Apparently they're pretty rare.

[Joe Handley]

I saw above about someone and lexan rc bodies, my dad had a business selling those and it'd be funny when someone came up to him after seeing some of his best on the internet, and ask, "How much for something like this?" (Picture on phone, faded gold to silver with tiger stripes) and he said "$100, on a six month waiting list." He was great at what he did, bit it was darn pricy. We still have a "Prowler" body that's a replica of the monster jam truck. Apparently they're pretty rare.

When it comes to just paint and bodywork, it can take a lot of work to make it look right before the first coat of paint goes on, no matter if it's lexan, styrene, or sheet metal. I don't even want to think about what time and effort had been put into those Chevy Lowriders on Leno's Garsge last night before the final coats of primer went down to make them look that good, let alone what it took to make the final product look just that fantastic!

[Owie]

When it comes to just paint and bodywork, it can take a lot of work to make it look right before the first coat of paint goes on, no matter if it's lexan, styrene, or sheet metal. I don't even want to think about what time and effort had been put into those Chevy Lowriders on Leno's Garsge last night before the final coats of primer went down to make them look that good, let alone what it took to make the final product look just that fantastic!

It's crazy. He'd spend 40+ hours on a higher priced body. I can spray with rattle cans very well and on a bmx bike frame, and from when I start to strip the paint to the time the paint is ACTUALLY dry and cured, two or three months have gone by. And paint stripper, uhg. Wear thick gloves. Not thin doctor type ones. Learned that the hard way.

[moparfarmer]

I once had a guy from the local Chevy club if I would build him a model of a seventies Z 28..I said no but recommended a friend who did build pretty good stuff.Well I didn't know this guy hasn't done a model in years..When I saw it at one of our meetings(Winnipeg Model Car Club) it looked like poop..He gave it to the guy who said he would pay $100 just for the build..My 10 yr old grand-daughter could have done better..Glue on w/shield,rear glass,headlights...Just a mess..I sure regret mentioning his name and connection...He is now in a chair and figures he can still do nice stuff..I've suggested to try not to but keep the interest up..It just isn't going to happen...

[moparfarmer]

I sold a model to a friend in the states..I thought it was the best I ever did..Didn't know what to ask so he offered $100.00 and I said yes..I was afraid to as that as I thought it too much for a box stock model..He displays it proudly in his collection..I bought a replacement and hope to do another but won't be the same color..Jusst haven't gotten around to it ye..Sure do miss it...

[Tom Geiger]

This just reminded me of a story. A long time ago a friend of mine asked how many hours I had in a specific model. I told him probably 50 hours. His response was astonishment, saying that he redid his whole kitchen in 50 hours! That statement haunted me for a long time. To think about the time I spent on a little model truck could have produced those big result like a new kitchen! Then I thought a bit more and came to the realization that the time I spent on my model was down time, time I was to spend relaxing and enjoying myself. So those hours shouldn't be counted! So to this day, I put as much time as I need into every build, but refuse to ever add up the hours!

[Joe Handley]

Um, I kinda have to question the quality of work in that kitchen if it only took 50 hours. Seems way too fast unless all he had to do was remove the old and bolt in the new without painting, flooring, dealing with wall paper, ect.

[Pete J.]

You guys all make valid points and I agree with most of them. However, I think that there is a vast difference between a model that is acceptable to us and what is acceptable to the person who offers to buy a kit, a can of paint and pays you $20. If you want to do it for them and the car was available as a '60s style AMT annual, here's what you do:

Body: Snip the sprue off. Glue the hood on. Wash it in soapy water and set it aside to dry. Later, spray it with one coat of color. No primer, no removal of mold defects, no BMF, no decals, no detail painting, no nothing.

Interior: Snip the sprues off. Don't waste time washing it. Spray the dash, steering wheel, front seats and the bucket with whatever paint you already have that is vaguely close to the desired color. Or flat black, the recipient won't care. Glue them together. Again, no detail painting. Don't even bother glueing in the chrome stick shift.

Chassis and wheels: Snip the sprues off. Don't wash it. Spray the chassis and wheel inners flat black. Press the chrome wheels into the tires and wheels then onto the steel axles. No engine.

Final assembly: Snip the sprues off the chrome bumpers. Put the windows and interior into the body. Place the bumpers in position and screw on the chassis. If the kit came with clear red taillights and you're feeling generous, put some white glue on them and press them in place.

Really, it's a weekend of spare time. The recipient will be thrilled and won't notice what we notice. It will look good from ten feet away sitting on a shelf or perched on the dashboard of their car at a cruise night.

Great observation! I never thought of it that way! All of my "for pay" builds have been to my standard to people who appreciate that sort of thing. The average guy who may want a build, would be happy with a "toy" the same color as what he wants. Probably wouldn't take a ton of time to paint up a body and do a basic build. Nothing even close to contest standard but presentable. A couple of hundred or less for that would not be a real problem and would be "good enough". That gave me a different perspective on that kind of build. Thanks!

[Ace-Garageguy]

Why bother building a half-azzed model for $20? i don't get it. No satisfaction in doing mediocre or worse work...to me anyway. Sure not worth $20 to me to build crapp to pass on to someone who doesn't know any better.

But I guess it's all in the eye of the beholder. An aviation shop I worked at for a while got $15k to $35k (the shop rate back then was $35 per hour...you do the math) to strip and refinish composite sailplanes.

It's highly skilled work, cause you CAN'T use chemical stripper, and if you go too deep with the sander, you've destroyed a $100,000+ airplane. Plus, the 30 foot wings have to be blocked dead straight, several times. We did close to perfect work, and the aircraft that came out of our shop looked at least as good as new, with better finishes that would last MUCH longer than the factory gelcoat.

Guy comes in wanting a price and goes away shaking his head. Brings the airplane back in a couple of weeks, all proud and wanting to show us up," 'cause he did it hisself and saved a hole lotta money". It looked like it had been painted with used rollers and dirty brushes by drunk chimps (or drunk 5-year olds) with sander gouges in the fiberglass that weakened the structure.

He had his wife with him, and apparently she was just as clueless. When we asked her how long he spent on it, she beamed and said "oh my... 2 whole weekends !!!".

It looked like it, too.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Ace-Garageguy

[ChrisBcritter]

I've only built one kit for a friend, to match his Mercedes 560SEC; it ended up being a rather drawn-out process because I'm not a fast builder. It was a Tamiya Mercedes 500SEC Lorinser, which I modified to match by altering the 500 emblem, lowering the rear end, and modifying the kit wheels to look like the slotted rims his had by carving out the centers and replacing them with centers from (of all things) the mags from the Monogram '30 Model A street rod, with little bolts to simulate the center caps and tiny holes all around to look like the cap screws on the outer rim. Painted it white with gold trim and a tan interior, adding some real leather in the door panel recesses and a couple tiny cassettes in the console.

While I was doing this, however, real life threw a curveball: my friend and his partner got carjacked at gunpoint in Hollywood. Fortunately they weren't hurt, and amazingly the car was located undamaged in northern CA two weeks later, missing the license plates (which I'd already added to the kit). Soon afterward when I gave him the model, I offered to correct the plates, but he said he was too happy to get both cars back to worry about it!

Edited July 22, 2014 by ChrisBcritter

[Pete J.]

Why bother building a half-azzed model for $20? i don't get it. No satisfaction in doing mediocre or worse work...to me anyway. Sure not worth $20 to me to build crapp to pass on to someone who doesn't know any better.

But I guess it's all in the eye of the beholder.

It doesn't have to be a piece of @@@@@. Just do what you do to the best of your ability. My point is that if the customer wants a car the same color with license plates to match, then give it to them. If they want an interior exactly the same as their car, that costs more. I can do a very nice job of spraying a body in a couple of hours. A paint job I would be proud of. If that is all they want and it makes them happy, then that is good. That is not what I want on my shelf, but if he wants to drop $100 on that then fine. I am getting paid for my time at a rate I can live with. If he doesn't care about the interior, black out the window, do a clean job of gluing it up and done. Save the ultra detail for the person who wants it and is willing to pay for it. Instead of the old beauty line, success is in the eye of the customer.

Chris, when you are working on aircraft that is a different issue. The exterior has profound impact on how it performs as I am sure you are aware, but you wouldn't spend the same amount of time on an expensive sailplane as you would on a J-3. Unlike the sailplane on a J-3, you tear the fabric off, stitch on a new one and spray down some aircraft dope and you are done. No sanding, no buffing just new fabric and paint. That is what the customer needs and wants and the aircraft works right.

[dragcarz]

People really are clueless, I've restored and painted many 1/1 cars over the years, and I'm constantly asked to paint someone's car ,when I give them the price, they think I'm nuts because Maaco can do it for $500.00.they think I should be able to do it cheaper and save them some money. What they don't understand is the paint and materials alone cost me $1500.00, they think I'm trying to rip them off and get offended when I tell them to go to Maaco.

[DavidChampagne]

Ya know...............

Most repair shops, mechanics, etc charge $40, $50 an hour, maybe more.

How many hours do you put into a model?

That would be almost $200 just studying the parts and instructions for me.

[rmvw guy]

The local hobby shop owner wanted me to build for some customers. I told him I wouldn't know what to charge. A few other guys said they would build just for a duplicate kit for themselfs. No, not me. I thought of a flat fee like $100 or maybe what a Franklin Mint car would cost. They laughed. Now my price has gone up.

I got offered $50 for a paint job which I think is fair but, the guy never came through. Look what the "Old Man" charges, about $300 I think, and he does some award winning work. I say make it worth your while and build your confidence in your own work, or just build for yourself and enjoy.

[Tom Geiger]

Great observation! I never thought of it that way! All of my "for pay" builds have been to my standard to people who appreciate that sort of thing. The average guy who may want a build, would be happy with a "toy" the same color as what he wants. Probably wouldn't take a ton of time to paint up a body and do a basic build. Nothing even close to contest standard but presentable. A couple of hundred or less for that would not be a real problem and would be "good enough". That gave me a different perspective on that kind of build. Thanks!

I think what we're saying here is that we automatically assume that we will do that favor build to our personal standard. At the same time, the person requesting the model has never been exposed to that level of standard. All he wants is a reasonable replica of his car. How many times have we heard, "This is exactly like my old Chevy, only my Chevy was red... the interior was black.... and it had four doors!"

In most cases the person would be happy with a reasonably built box stock model painted in the appropriate colors. Or even a diecast... this thread just reminded me of a story. A couple of years ago a secretary at work asked me to find / build a 1968 or 1969 GTO like the one her husband once had for his Christmas present. Always a sucker to help a woman who wants to give her signifacant other a worthwhile car gift, I quickly found that there was a decent $20 diecast of the car, AND it was in the right colors. She had a photo of the car, so I copied the license plate in the Acme Platemaker, added them to the car with some MCG photo etched frames. I bought a $10 Revell(?) display case. The whole thing was $30.

On Christmas Day my cell phone rang and it was this lady. She was all apologies about calling me on Christmas, but her husband (who I never met) just had to speak with me. This guy was gushing with thanks and happiness. He was very, very pleased with this diecast. And rather than feeling disturbed on Christmas, his call made my whole day!

[Pete J.]

I did a respray on a die cast for a customer and don't deceive yourself it was a real pain! Stripping the beast was not fun. The trim all failed when I removed it so I had to replicate it with plastic and the metal work on the body getting all the file marks off took days to do. I did no interior work. The paint job was no big deal. I replicated all of his stickers and badges and he was a happy camper. I charged him $500 and wouldn't do it again for less the $1,000. I considered it a learning experience. Here are some before and after photos,

So don't ever think respraying a die cast would be easier than building a plastic kit.

[rmvw guy]

I think what we're saying here is that we automatically assume that we will do that favor build to our personal standard. At the same time, the person requesting the model has never been exposed to that level of standard. All he wants is a reasonable replica of his car. How many times have we heard, "This is exactly like my old Chevy, only my Chevy was red... the interior was black.... and it had four doors!"

In most cases the person would be happy with a reasonably built box stock model painted in the appropriate colors. Or even a diecast... this thread just reminded me of a story. A couple of years ago a secretary at work asked me to find / build a 1968 or 1969 GTO like the one her husband once had for his Christmas present. Always a sucker to help a woman who wants to give her signifacant other a worthwhile car gift, I quickly found that there was a decent $20 diecast of the car, AND it was in the right colors. She had a photo of the car, so I copied the license plate in the Acme Platemaker, added them to the car with some MCG photo etched frames. I bought a $10 Revell(?) display case. The whole thing was $30.

On Christmas Day my cell phone rang and it was this lady. She was all apologies about calling me on Christmas, but her husband (who I never met) just had to speak with me. This guy was gushing with thanks and happiness. He was very, very pleased with this diecast. And rather than feeling disturbed on Christmas, his call made my whole day!

I love this story Tom, it almost brought a tear to my eye, really! Thanks for sharing. This was better than money.

[Tom Geiger]

I did a respray on a die cast for a customer and don't deceive yourself it was a real pain! Stripping the beast was not fun.

Very nice work Pete!

Reworking a diecast into a model is really getting back to the roots of this hobby. In the beginning there were promotional models. Guys like Art Anderson grabbed onto those and created models. The manufacturers took note and packaged said promos in pieces as kits. Thus the industry and the hobby was born!

If there's no kit of a beloved subject, there's no reason at all not to buy the diecast and rework it to your desire. I've seen some truly amazing works of art done that way!