Crate Motor Roundup

[Greg Myers]

Bill and John are both correct, and this is what I find confusing kit wise. I don't think any kit has presented their extra engine as a "crate motor" save one : 

Edited December 14, 2015 by Greg Myers

[Gregg]

I'm sorry, I usually don't like when images are put in posts, but this is funny, sorry

I know, hippocrate

:-)

 

[djflyer]

As some one returning from extended time away from the hobby this is the kinda question I like.  If I understand the OP, the question is where can you find the best rendition of motor 'X' and maybe the trans that goes with it.  Very much what I would want to know for my next street rod/ restomod/ pro-touring/ etc.  It would also help to know what scale it is and is it over- or under-scale.

So, where can I find that great LS7 or supercharged Ecotec?

 

[drummerdad]

It really depends on scale. A lot of popular stuff is available in 1/24 scale. The bigger scales, not so much. There are a few options, but you are limited to the most popular engines, SBC, BBC, Hemi, and maybe a ford 427. Rare engines will have to be fabricated. Unless you can go the 3D printing route. 

As for what I would call a crate engine, it would be an engine that comes from an engine manufacturer, usually built in several stages, from long blocks, to turn keys. I use the following companies, as they sell engines in several scales, and several different configurations:

Future Attraction

Teds modeling

VCG Resins

BNL Resins (Ebay store)

Clearly Scale

And dont forget Ebay and there are some on Facebook as well. I also stumbled upon picclick.com, too. It has some good stuff. 

 

 

 

[dshue76]

Assembled engines available to purchase ready to add your accessories to and drop in your vehicle are considered crate engines, from stock to performance, OEM to after market. In the industrial setting the are  considered a repower package.

I always used the term bonus engine for kit engines that are an option to the stock engine. Off the top of my head I can't remember which kits came with the best bonus engine, I've been doing commercial type vehicles for the last 18 years or so. I do like the engine that comes in AMTs 66 Chevy II pro street. Nice detail. I always liked the AMT kits that offered 2 engine choices like the 72 Nova. Not the most accurate and detailed but usually you got a small block and a big block. The Lindburg 34 Ford trucks I believe came with a display stand for the spare engine, so it could be said to represent a crate engine. There were a few kits that came with this setup.

Edited April 16, 2016 by dshue76

[my80malibu]

I have gone through four bottles of Excedrin on this.

Why is this so hard?

Brett and Michael seem to get the drift.

A "Crate Motor" is something you can buy now from either a car manufacture, or a lot of aftermarket engine builders.

So, what kits available now, NOT PARTS PACKS, have good replicas of those new "Crate Motors."

Yes, I agree with Brett, the new green '32 Ford has a great engine/motor/drivetrain that could or would be considered as a "Crate Motor."

Let's go with modern engine configurations here, just to be a little bit more clear.

As stated before engines sold by dealerships, and parts houses, come in a variety of ways. The first is the engine block without heads or sheet metal, just the basic internal Parts are there. This is referred to as a Shortblock

Second is an upgrade, all of the Shortblock parts,with the addition of cylinder heads. This is referred to as a Long block.

Third is a little more complete with the Longblock,an Shortblock, plus all the sheet metal parts freeze plugs installed as well as other parts like a water pump usually no intake manifold. This is referred to a a complete engine.

Fourth is an with all parts necessary to run from carb to pan water pump to distributor. Just add oil and coolant after install pretty much. This is referred to as a Crate Engine.

at no time should an engine be called a motor because motors are electric.

[Reeves Racing]

A "crate motor" is just a new or rebuilt engine sans the rest of the car. As brought out by many these come in various states of assembly.

The question is like asking "Which kits come with the best after market wheels?" 

So the answer to the OP's awkwardly asked question would be the same answer to the question "Which kits come with the best looking and detailed engines that can be bashed into another kit?"

As we all know a small block Chevy has the same outward dimensions whether it is a 265 or 400 (although the 400 has the cylinder bulges on the sides of the block) So any of them could be said to represent anything from a 327 to a 383 stroker, Same with a SBF, it could be said to represent everything from a 289 to a 347 stroker. Chevy big blocks from the truck based 366 to the 472 stroker. Your imagination equals what the displacement is...

So my answer would be the engines both small and big block in the recent Revell 69 Nova kits, as mentioned before the small block Fords in the 32 hot rods. The engines in the Revell 70 Mach one are very good and even have the "cool" Autolite inline four barrel carburetor.

Myself I picked up a Revell 98 Saleen Speedster to rob the engine and super charger from for a restomod 67 Mustang fastback so that would be a crate engine so to speak. I also picked up a Revell 99 F150 Lightning to rob the engine and super charger out of for a Moebius 70 F100 build. So that was a crate engine as well so to speak.

I am a Ford guy so I lean towards those builds but I bet the engine out of any of the late model Corvettes would make a decent "crate engine" for a bash of some kind.

I have used the 427/390 FE engine from the AMT 66 Fairlane and 67 Comet kits as well as the very nice 427 from the Revell Shelby Cobra.

I got a handful of JoHan Boss 429 and OHC 427 engines off of eBay to use in some drag builds so in our modeling world you can source a "crate engine" just about anyware.

Just my one cent (I'm running a 50% off sale)....

 

 

Edited February 24, 2017 by Reeves Racing

[wku88]

Gee, every Ford Indianapolis 4-cam DOHC Indianapolis engine was a crate motor, before crate motors were cool!  (So was every Offenhauser 4-banger ever built!).

 

Art

While we're at it, so was a Cosworth DFV.  I'll take 2!

[Greg Myers]

I like Doug's "Bonus Engine" call, makes sense , and I would think that IS what we are trying to discuss here.

Could be wrong.

[Mike999]

On ‎7‎/‎17‎/‎2015 at 12:08 AM, Gregg said:

Here's one for everyone:

What kit(s) have the best crate motors, Ford and/or Chevy?

What motors do they represent?

What's good about them?

What's not?

Also include tranny options.

Mahalo

Resurrecting this dead thread because of a current project - the AMT '34 Ford Modified Stocker, with Tobias chassis from the mid-1970's.  The same engine/chassis was used in several AMT Early Modified Stocker kits, with different parts included for the specific kit.  For those not familiar with the kits:

What motor?  A small-block Chevy 383 stroker crate motor. Some Modified Stocker box art calls it a "427 Chevy."

What's good?  Very nice Weiand finned valve covers; separate alternator, in scale for once, not huge; optional front covers/water pumps and air-cleaner setups; 4-bbl carb with fairly nice surface detail and screen detail in the throat.  Vertex magneto.  Very good separate oil filter and mount, complete with tiny "finger ridges" on the filter. Separate oil pan. Nifty "nest of snakes" racing exhausts. Best of all - NO CHROME PARTS AT ALL!  So no stripping needed.

What's not good? Ugly "half" starter molded into right side of block (easily scraped off and replaced with the real thing); no radiator hose neck on intake manifold; no fuel pump.  All the ugly/missing stuff can be stolen from many modern, better-detailed Chevy engines. 

Tranny options: none, 4-speed transmission is molded to engine.

 

Edited January 6, 2018 by Mike999
error

[Greg Myers]

On 1/9/2017 at 2:19 PM, my80malibu said:

at no time should an engine be called a motor because motors are electric.

American Motors

Ford MOTOR Company

General Motors

Motor mounts

Motor Trend Magazine

Motor Vehicle

Motorcycle

 

[Richard Bartrop]

If you really want to get pedantic about it, "engine" has traditionally refered to any sort of mechanical device, such as a seige engine,  Babbage's Difference Engine,  or a rose engine.   Motor refers to a device that imparts motion, such as the devices we're discussing in this thread.  In modern use "engine" and "motor' are interchangeable, and most people get what you're talking about.

[Mike Young]

Hey guys, resurrecting  this one again.

What about using this thread to post images of crate engines, engine assemblies, engine parts, transmissions, etc., for reference?

To be honest, I thought that's what this was supposed to be when I clicked on it. I was disappointed to see it had devolved in to a debate over semantics rather than it's intended purpose, yet it's still a sticky.

I like to take the crude rudimentary representation parts we get in the kits, and turn them in to something more accurate. I know I'm not the only one. This could maybe be a good place for a drive train reference resource. That, or drop it off the sticky list and put up something more useful. Just a thought.

[Greg Myers]

Just for your consideration, The original AMT trophy kits had a sort of "Crate" engines thing going if you consider the fact that all of these kits had motor mounts that would except any of the different engines from kit to kit.

'23 Tee kits, Lincoln FE

'32 Roadster, SBC (rather crude)

'32 Coupe, HEMI (too wide to fit the '40 Fords) 

'34 Pick Up, Chrome Ford FE

'36 Ford, Pontiac V-8

"39-'40 Sedan, Olds V-8 

'40 Ford Coupe / Sedan delivery, Buick Nail Head

All of these engines/Motors will interchange Kit to Kit

 

Edited June 5, 2020 by Greg Myers

[Greg Myers]

So it goes without saying, if it will fit on one of these stands you're in business.Well, the back row, anyway.?

Edited June 5, 2020 by Greg Myers

[Casey]

43 minutes ago, Greg Myers said:

The original AMT trophy kits had a sort of "Crate" engines thing going if you consider the fact that all of these kits had motor mounts that would except any of the different engines from kit to kit.

 

[Greg Myers]

Ah, casey, my shadow.?  You seem as confused as Gregg on this "Crate" thing

Edited June 5, 2020 by Greg Myers

[CapSat 6]

I'll throw a few in here:

 

The AMT '71 Duster Street Machine has the same basic block, heads, etc. (340 c.i. Small block Mopar) as the stock it, but the valve covers look like Mopar Magnum valve covers. They're not the later "Magnum" design, because the cover bolts are the old LA pattern and not the newer "Magnum" pattern, but if you paint them black, they have a crate-ish look to them. 

None of the Mopar crate engines came with the pseudo-Viper intake that that kit has, but if you use the Six Pack or 4-BBL intake from the stock kit with the Street machine valve covers,  (go ahead, each stock kit comes with one of each intake!), then you have something that looks a Mopar Small Block crate engine. I'm going to use at least one of these in an upcoming build.

The Revell Foose '67 Charger has valve covers that look a lot like the Mopar units used on their Hemi crate engines. The rest of the kit has a stock Hemi, but swap on a cross ram intake, or, my personal favorite, the old Jo Han single 4 BBL race intake (which looks A LOT like the old MP M-1 intake), and you have what really will look like a Mopar hemi crate engine.

I know these aren't whole engines, but swap on those distinctive valve covers, paint the parts just right, and you'll have engines that will look a LOT like crate engines.      

I might have to do a few of these up for demonstration purposes.

I still think Round 2 should create a Demon engine kit, to sell on it's own with a replica of a Demon crate.  

Edited July 15, 2020 by CapSat 6

[Big John]

I remember those old engine stands from the old AMT models.  So, would the old Parts Pack engines qualify as model 'Crate' engines>  Of course my Fave was the Allison aircraft V12.  and I remember Revel having an interesting Turbine engine once upon a time back in the 60s.  I bet landman has one!

[dimaxion]

On 6/5/2020 at 11:36 AM, Greg Myers said:

Just for your consideration, The original AMT trophy kits had a sort of "Crate" engines thing going if you consider the fact that all of these kits had motor mounts that would except any of the different engines from kit to kit.

'23 Tee kits, Lincoln FE

'32 Roadster, SBC (rather crude)

'32 Coupe, HEMI (too wide to fit the '40 Fords) 

'34 Pick Up, Chrome Ford FE

'36 Ford, Pontiac V-8

"39-'40 Sedan, Olds V-8 

'40 Ford Coupe / Sedan delivery, Buick Nail Head

All of these engines/Motors will interchange Kit to Kit

 

AMT Model T kits Scale down the ELM or 385 Series V/8 FoMoCo line of engines . Different from the FE's in many ways . 430 CID initially and ended up with 460 CID . The later 460's were a different family derived from the Cobra Jet 429's IIRC . Or was it the 428 CID ? My Pics of Crate Engines . 429 SOHC , 3 Long Blocks , the one on the Stand is complete . Thanx .. 

[Force]

The MEL (Mercury-Edsel-Lincoln) 383-410-430-462 engine looks kind of similar to the FE, the MEL and FE was developed at the same time and came the saem year but is very different in many aspects, and it's not related to the 385 series 429-460 as it was a different engine design.
Both the MEL and 385 were made at the Lima Ohio factory and the 385 series replaced the MEL after the 1967 model year.
The AMT 1925 Model T kits has a rough version of the MEL wich looks like a weird combination of the earlier Mercury-Lincoln 317-332-341-368 Y-Block and the MEL.

[Big John]

The Ultimate crate motor...

Edited April 21, 2021 by Big John

[horsepower]

On 9/21/2015 at 12:54 PM, 10thumbs said:

I don't understand the issue with "crate motors".  I didn't think for a second about real, 1:1 crate motors.  I'll bet when AMT and Revell made these motor kits, the "over the counter" boys in 1:1 dealerships couldn't readily relate to crate motors as they're known today.  Weren't they back then referred to as "whole engines".

We're talking here models.  Model motors.  AMT crate motors.  Revell crate motors.  This is a modeling site isn't it? 

Anyway, doesn't Mopar send their whole motors in boxes?   Not crates by any means. 

Maybe guys, a bit more imagination would be a good thing.

 

Welll.....They do call those plastic "boxes" shipping crates.?

[Big John]

Ok, in the spirit of the thread This is the ultimate crate motor!

[Greg Myers]

Nope. I disagree. ? My first thought was this one . . .