What Scared the Heck Outta You Today

[Falcon Ranchero]

Not sure if this is a thread alreday, but I'll start thisun off.

Experienced some sort of braking issue for the first time today, while driving my Mom's 2013 Toyota 4Runner (named Laverne) home from the Sault College. Stopped waiting to go on the road, and I'd step on the brake and she'd stop, but then my foot would keep going to the floor and she'd start to creep out onto the street while cars were passing by. Take the foot of and re-apply and she stops again, but then started creeping again. Played that game all the way home. Brake light never came on. Smelt some burning type smell but looked under and nothing was dripping. Then drove to my Grandma's and looked under then and there was dripping on the right side. Better to drip on a gravel driveway than our own paved one. But she was fine this morning on the way there. Just a scary situation, having to leave ample room behind a stopped cars at the red light so Laverne had enough room to creep up while waiting for the green. ? 

Edited November 15, 2024 by Falcon Ranchero

[Ace-Garageguy]

That's not "brake fade".

Brake fade happens from repeated stops or stopping from high speed...overheating the drums/rotors/shoes/pads...resulting in the coefficient of friction of the brake shoe or pad material decreasing, to the point that no matter how "hard" the brakes feel, the car won't stop.

What you experienced...with the pedal going slowly to the floor...is something entirely different, and is caused by fluid leaking out of the system while it's pressurized by your foot on it.

You SAW a leak.

GET IT CHECKED IMMEDIATELY FOR FLUID LEAKS.

ONCE THE FLUID IS ALL GONE, YOU WON'T BE ABLE TO STOP AT ALL.

IT CAN BE FATAL.

 

 

Edited November 16, 2024 by Ace-Garageguy

[Ace-Garageguy]

1 hour ago, Falcon Ranchero said:

Experienced "brake fade" for the first time today, while driving my Mom's 2013 Toyota 4Runner (named Laverne) home from the Sault College. Stopped waiting to go on the road, and I'd step on the brake and she'd stop, but then my foot would keep going to the floor and she'd start to creep out onto the street while cars were passing by. 

SEE ABOVE. THIS IS SERIOUS. GET IT LOOKED AT IMMEDIATELY. 

AND CHECK AND FILL THE BRAKE FLUID LEVEL BEFORE YOU DRIVE IT ANYWHERE.

Edited November 15, 2024 by Ace-Garageguy

[Falcon Ranchero]

2 hours ago, Falcon Ranchero said:

 

Edited November 15, 2024 by Falcon Ranchero

[Falcon Ranchero]

2 hours ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

SEE ABOVE. THIS IS SERIOUS. GET IT LOOKED AT IMMEDIATELY. 

AND CHECK AND FILL THE BRAKE FLUID LEVEL BEFORE YOU DRIVE IT ANYWHERE.

Not to worry; Laverne’s not going anywhere until the mechanic attends to the issue. It was a sketchy thing though holy smokes; never again

[That Plasticated Guy]

This has happened to me on more than one occasion. My car dates back to 2005 and it's wearing out but is still going along fine. And a stay over from my days of being a volunteer firefighter is that I keep to the speed limit. And if a vehicle that has more power than mine or if the driver is a bit of a lead foot then they can go around me. It's not a problem. But the problem is when the person behind me goes around me and doesn't take into consideration the oncoming traffic. They usually have no choice but to whip back right in front of me. And that's when my faith in God skyrockets, because I have to get on my brakes and pray that anyone behind me doesn't slam into me or the one passing me doesn't tag my front end. Not to mention that I also consider aiming for the ditch on my right side.

[Ace-Garageguy]

16 minutes ago, That Plasticated Guy said:

...But the problem is when the person behind me goes around me and doesn't take into consideration the oncoming traffic. They usually have no choice but to whip back right in front of me...because I have to get on my brakes and pray that anyone behind me doesn't slam into me or the one passing me doesn't tag my front end. Not to mention that I also consider aiming for the ditch on my right side.

I've been driving for something like 60 years, and this has been going on for as long as I can remember.

I've only seen one spectacular head-on as a result, and barely avoided getting caught in it as the car shot off the corner of  the oncoming semi like a billiard ball.

 

[espo]

4 hours ago, That Plasticated Guy said:

This has happened to me on more than one occasion. My car dates back to 2005 and it's wearing out but is still going along fine. And a stay over from my days of being a volunteer firefighter is that I keep to the speed limit. And if a vehicle that has more power than mine or if the driver is a bit of a lead foot then they can go around me. It's not a problem. But the problem is when the person behind me goes around me and doesn't take into consideration the oncoming traffic. They usually have no choice but to whip back right in front of me. And that's when my faith in God skyrockets, because I have to get on my brakes and pray that anyone behind me doesn't slam into me or the one passing me doesn't tag my front end. Not to mention that I also consider aiming for the ditch on my right side.

A common problem I have seen with many drivers when passing someone is that they turn back into the lane far sooner than they should. I don't think they even realize how close they come to taking off your left front fender. The old rule of thumb is to wait until you can see both of the headlights of the car you passed in your inside rear-view mirror before pulling back into that lane. 

[Falcon Ranchero]

We had a closer look at Laverne’s right brake line and there is in fact a little hole in the crease right above the nut so there’s no way to actually stop the leak via electrical tape, but it does slow the leak down some. She’s scheduled to have both lines replaced on Monday and so my dad is going to top up the brake fluid before leaving, and then drive it to the mechanic. Apparently putting it in neutral eased the pressure on her brakes so less fluid comes out but Laverne’s not going anywhere until Monday.

[NYLIBUD]

Driving home today from a friends house.I pull up into an intersection.Across the street are two cops in the parking lot of a 7/11.I go through the intersection.I could see they were looking at my car.Its got no front plate,and the inspection is overdue..Anyway,I cruised past,but thank God nothing happened.

Edited November 18, 2024 by NYLIBUD

[Falcon Ranchero]

Update with Laverne's brake issue dilemma, it was decided we'd let CAA take the truck to the mechanic this morning and so at around 7:30 this morning the flatbed came and took Laverne away.

[espo]

6 hours ago, Falcon Ranchero said:

Update with Laverne's brake issue dilemma, it was decided we'd let CAA take the truck to the mechanic this morning and so at around 7:30 this morning the flatbed came and took Laverne away.

Smart move, safety first. 

[peteski]

On 11/16/2024 at 3:17 PM, Falcon Ranchero said:

We had a closer look at Laverne’s right brake line and there is in fact a little hole in the crease right above the nut so there’s no way to actually stop the leak via electrical tape, but it does slow the leak down some. She’s scheduled to have both lines replaced on Monday and so my dad is going to top up the brake fluid before leaving, and then drive it to the mechanic. Apparently putting it in neutral eased the pressure on her brakes so less fluid comes out but Laverne’s not going anywhere until Monday.

Nathan,
When you apply brakes hard enough to stop a car weighting thousands of pounds, the pressure in rake lines is hundreds of psi.  That is why the are made of steel. Electrical tape is totally useless.  If the brake pedal is not depressed, there is no pressure in the line, so I suppose electrical tape would slow down the leak.  I do suspect that the brake fluid, in short order, will attack (soften or dissolve) electrical tape's adhesive.  It was a smart move to have the it towed to the shop.

[Falcon Ranchero]

Found out the problem was that the undercoating never covered the brake lines so the area got all rusty and I guess that caused the rip in the line 🤷‍♂️

Edited November 20, 2024 by Falcon Ranchero

[NOBLNG]

13 minutes ago, Falcon Ranchero said:

Found out the problem was that the undercoating never covered the brake lines so the area got all rusty and I guess that caused the rip in the line ??‍♂️

Brake lines should not need to be under coated, and they should not be rusted through on a vehicle that age…or any age really. If it was a “rip” in the line, then it was physically damaged somehow. Thankfully you had the good sense to have it transported to the repair shop.

[johnyrotten]

Best move you could have made, especially with your brakes. Most important system on any vehicle,  besides an alert, competent operator. Rust never sleeps. Hopefully the mechanic looks over ALL the lines under that truck. 

[iamsuperdan]

16 hours ago, Falcon Ranchero said:

Found out the problem was that the undercoating never covered the brake lines so the area got all rusty and I guess that caused the rip in the line ??‍♂️

If your mechanic gave you this diagnosis, I'd consider finding a new mechanic.

 

[Ace-Garageguy]

25 minutes ago, iamsuperdan said:

If your mechanic gave you this diagnosis, I'd consider finding a new mechanic.

 

Yup. Flexible brake lines don't get undercoated.

[Falcon Ranchero]

Regardless, the lines on both sides have been replaced, so there should be no problem, but yeah it's a 2013, and my dad's truck is a 2011 (Tacoma) and the lines on the truck are still good and it's two years older. Laverne is totally too young to have stuff like that goin' on.

[peteski]

Also (what many clueless panicking drivers out there fail to realize), when your main hydraulic brakes fail you can put the car in Neutral and use the parking/emergency brake to slow it down or keep it from rolling. I guess in a real emergency while the car is still moving you could try to shift the automatic transmission in "park:",  but that would likely not end well for the transmission (but might save a life).

I mentioned that because your vehicle is like still old enough to be able to do do the things I mentioned above.  New cars with electric parking brake and electronic pushbutton gear shifting will likely not let you do any of those things because it is all controlled by a computer which will decide that what you are trying to do is not safe for the car. We are losing control of out vehicles to their computer "brains". It is not a good thing.

[Ace-Garageguy]

52 minutes ago, Falcon Ranchero said:

Regardless, the lines on both sides have been replaced, so there should be no problem, but yeah it's a 2013, and my dad's truck is a 2011 (Tacoma) and the lines on the truck are still good and it's two years older. Laverne is totally too young to have stuff like that goin' on.

If the vehicle has ever had the brake pads and/or rotors replaced, it's entirely possible that damage to a brake line close to a fitting was caused by a lazy "mechanic" allowing the brake caliper to dangle from the hose, rather than tying it up in such a way that no excessive strain was put on the hose. I've seen this happen repeatedly.

It's also possible that a minor manufacturing defect didn't cause this particular hose to fail until now.

Manufacturing defects DO happen, and while not common, it's always a possibility when a part fails "for no reason".

Just FYI, Chevy and GMC pickups, for instance, were known for the front brake flex lines failing internally, allowing fluid to pass to the calipers when the pedal was depressed, but not allowing it to return to the master cylinder when pressure was released.

The result was anything from a "pull" towards the affected side, to the affected brake getting hot and smoking and ultimately "fading", to locking up completely. This has occurred on both my '89 GMC and my '92 Chevy, and the Chevy was younger than your vehicle when it happened.

[Falcon Ranchero]

12 minutes ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

lazy "mechanic"

It's not so much the main guy at the shop- he knows his stuff pretty well- it's the kids he's got working for him; if I may bring up another scare, A simple oil change for my dad's truck was turned into a hell because one of those dudes put the wrong size filter on, and it was a little crooked and leaky so my dad managed to somehow straighten it but then we drove to a Tim Horton's, parked in the lot and he went in to get a coffee or whatever, and then starts the truck up an backs out but there's some burning smell and a little smoke coming from underhood. Shuts it off immediately, gets out, and there was oil EVERYWHERE. People watching from inside saw that as soon as he turned it on, all the oil just gushed out all at once. It was one of those young kids working there that screwed it up, but we don't get oil changes there anymore regardless.

[rattle can man]

If you live in the north, salt can do a number on just about anything.

As for finding a good shop, it is hard. Alignment shop ripped the new boots I installed when rebuilding my front end.  Another shop repaired a temp sending switch and filled my tires to 45lb. On an 1800 pound car. Rational: the tire sidewall said to and there was no sticker on the door. Almost bounced under a semi like a basketball.  Another shop cross-threaded the screw for the distributor cap.

[JollySipper]

Nathan friend, do you have any mechanical inclination at all? Is there a tech school you could learn some mechanical basics from? Stuff like brake pads and oil changes should be basic maintenance........ The only way to insure that something is done right is to do it yourself! Especially nowadays......

[Falcon Ranchero]

6 hours ago, JollySipper said:

Nathan friend, do you have any mechanical inclination at all? Is there a tech school you could learn some mechanical basics from? Stuff like brake pads and oil changes should be basic maintenance........ The only way to insure that something is done right is to do it yourself! Especially nowadays......

I did in fact take the grade 10 automotive class and then the grade 11 small engines; and so I do have a very mild inclination about mechanical stuff; plus my dad knows quite a lot more than I do. Bringing the vehicles into the shop is basically because we have no time to do even the simple fixes (like an oil change) ourselves. Our particular mechanic is pretty cheap, too, this brake lines thing costing only $200 to replace both lines. But yes, I am aware of the fact that doing things yourself gets the job done right.