What do you see as the most common problems or errors in our model builds?

[Tonioseven]

I dig this thread!! Thanks for sharing these tips!!

[roadhawg]

Not taking time to eliminate the oil pan/transmission seam. I've seen some really nice models on here, built very realistically, but when you get to the underside pic, theres that seam!

Plug wires that seem to defy gravity by shooting straight up out of the distributor and making a giant arc on their way to the plugs. I call this the "spider on the engine" syndrome, and the model would actually look better without any wiring at all.

Another pet-peeve I have is seat belts, especially race cars. I have never seen a real race car where the driver got out, reached back in, routed the harness neatly over the back of the seat and the lap belts neatly over the side, and buckled them in the center. I'm not saying it couldn't happen, I'm just saying I've never seen it (been around a lot of race cars) and it's not likely. All of them I've seen are dangling over the sides of the seat, so the driver can easily get in without having to move them.

Same deal with a 70's "period correct" street machine.....back in those days, the seatbelts were either shoved down in the crack, pretty much out of sight, or removed completley....NOT neatly stretched out across the seat. The only time you see that is at modern car shows or cruise ins.

[Draggon]

Attitude, how it sits and looks overall is a big one for me. For example, like a NASCAR or road racer that sits higher in the front than in the back, and the track is so wide in the front that the tires stick out, yet the rear looks almost like it was tubbed. The theres the 49 Merc 4x4 look, or the rods that have shorter tires in the rear. OK, they mnight be wider, but look at the darn profile of the model and yuck. Wheels that have been twisted off the sprue so there is either a huge nub left on the rim, or a piece is broken out. Tires that come nowwhere close to having the bead sit on the rim. And finally, panel gaps. I see so many many times where someone takes the time to open doors, and then after the model is done the character lines dont match up, the doors sag, or have gaps so big yu could fit a hand thru them. OK, whew! Im done now

[sjordan2]

In general, I see very few metallic paints for models that have a fine enough metal flake size for 1/24-1/25 models, which can result in a certain "bass boat" effect. They just seem to make the finishes too sparkly. I wish more spray can colors were available as pearls.

Edited June 30, 2011 by sjordan2

[george 53]

  On 6/30/2011 at 2:47 PM, spkgibson said:

Very true, I guess it depends on the years, Where the car was made, Ect, So I guess any color could have been used, I'm pretty sure though Chrysler used Gray in the 60's and 70's. The 79 Nova that my brother and I are restoring has the Red Oxide under the White Paint. I remember touring the Fisher Body Plant in the 1980's on a school field trip, And they used to take the entire body shell and drip them, I can't remember if it was to rust proof the cars, Of if it was the primer bath, That was along time ago, 1984 or 85 I think, Then When my father worked at The Buick Engine Plant 36-4 I was able to go see how they made the Buick V-6, That was really cool. He started working there in September of 1965, He worked on the transmissions for the Then new 1966 Toronado. If I need to ask anything about Building a Buick model, I have him to ask, that pretty cool. Most of my family worked for GM , All divisions.

Holy cripes does this make me feel old!!! Anyways, the bodies are dipped in an electro bath called an "Elpo Dip" it is a galvanived primer? that seals the metal, they go thru an oven, then they go to the spray(color) booths where they are prepped and painted. Those bodies ARE COMPLETE with doors, hoods, trunklids and facias. Bumpers are color coded/serialized to a SPECIFIC body. ALL the parts match when they leave the plant. Any missmatched paint is a repair after the body was built. Of course this is a VERY simplified version of what happens, but yeah, basically, that's how it's done,

[Monty]

Premise: with the advent of Google, there's no excuse for getting the details wrong.

Some of my favorite pet peeves have already been covered: a mold seam across the top of the radiator, garden hose-sized plug wires, "angry spider" plug wire positioning & applying BMF over surfaces that should've been sanded smooth. Lotsa crinkly vent windows out there...

Here are a couple more that don't take much time to do correctly, but make a difference:

mold seams across the front and back end of mufflers - five minutes of sanding results in a subtle but effective change. Don't assume you can just detail by contrast, especially on chassis components. I see a lot of builders do this, and if called on it, say "I built it my way." Obviously. Seriously, make Google your friend.

My biggest pet peeve (this used to be in our Rants section) is the assumption that the box art model is dead-on accurate and should be emulated. Favorite example: Monogram's Boss 429 Mustang. When this kit was first released, there were at least two Mustang magazines available as resources. If I could find 'em in my little town, they couldn't have been that scarce. By not taking the time to see how the grille looks on a 1:1 car (especially around the headlights)

the builder convinced untold numbers of copycats that the front end should resemble a goldfish.

Moral of the story: A little research pays huge dividends.

Edited June 30, 2011 by Monty

[2002p51]

The grossly over done "factory overspray" on the underside of the car that has become so common lately.

If this overspray is present at all, it should be subtle and barely noticeable.

Also very heavy and unrealistic weathering, usually on dirt race cars. You need think about what direction the dirt comes from and how it hits the car. Too many modelers just slather "mud" all over the place and call it done.

Same thing with tire rings on the side of oval track race cars. I've seen them in all sorts of illogical places.

As several have already said, there's a wealth of information and photos as close as the nearest internet connection.

Do your research, study the photos with a critical eye and don't just assume you know how things should look.

[Ryan S.]

Good thread!

One thing that always bothers me, mostly because I think I'm super critical like that, is totally inaccurate order of plug wires on a distributor cap. Wires don't come out four on one side and four on the opposite all nice and even.

In these days of easy Google searches it's pretty easy to find out what the correct firing order of almost any engine is.

I like to get the order right on my builds, but even if someone didn't want 100% accuracy, changing up the order and crossing a few of the wires over will give a much more accurate appearance.

[LAone]

i have fendergapinitis at the moment..lols i didn't before, but now that it's gotten worse, im gonna have to fix it.

thing that gets me most are just lazy, sloppy builds. the kind that took one day to build and you can tell. sprue ends here and there, finger prints everywhere and glue coming out from the bumpers. ect ect...slow down, take your time, and do it right the first time.

the little things that count, straighten out the dang lines on the head lights and put your directional tires on the same way.

[Keef]

The most common problem I see is the inexperienced offering advise to others. If your still painting your chrome trim with what looks like a house paint roller, then you shouldnt be advising other members, both new and old, about the uses and applications of Bare Metal Foil, or the selection of kits, tools, paints, etc

[The Modeling Hermit]

Another one along the tire/wheel subject, would be angled wheels. I'm talking about the ones where you're viewing the vehicle from the front, and one or both of the wheels have such a tilt that they look like they're ready for a night of dirt track oval action.

[Casey]

Mold seams and joints seem to be the most common issue not addressed. It does take a bit of time sand everything smooth and even on both sides of the mold line/joint, but the results speak for themselves. I think it's one of those things people dislike doing, so 75% of builders don't bother or only attend to the seams which are readily visible, leaving the seams on the exhaust system, the edges of the leaf springs, and the rearend.

[jsimmons]

  On 6/30/2011 at 2:44 PM, Harry P. said:

Expensive solution???

Whenever I see a "detailed" engine with ignition wires, battery cables, heater hoses, etc., and that "magic floating alternator" I always think... why??? Why go to such trouble to add all the details, then leave off that one obviously missing detail?

I was thinking PE parts when I said expensive.

Your description of "detailed" is what I was talking about. If they're building OOB or just add spark plug wires, I consider a floating alternator to be acceptable.

[The Modeling Hermit]

  On 6/30/2011 at 9:40 PM, Casey said:

Mold seams and joints seem to be the most common issue not addressed. It does take a bit of time sand everything smooth and even on both sides of the mold line/joint, but the results speak for themselves. I think it's one of those things people dislike doing, so 75% of builders don't bother or only attend to the seams which are readily visible, leaving the seams on the exhaust system, the edges of the leaf springs, and the rearend.

I hear you on this one, and it catches me way too often. I'll spend hours making sure that all the seams are nice and clean, only to start buffing out a "perfect" paint job only to discover that where the top and windshield meet the body, I missed sanding the mold lines. How can I miss anything so blatant as those?

Edited June 30, 2011 by Kodiak Island Modeler

[crazyjim]

Soooo many issues. I'm thinking of compiling everything and making up a checklist in MS Word with several copies kept near my workbench. Anyone interested in a copy when it's done? Can I post a Word document here? If so, I don't know how.

I'm serious about the checklist. I think it would help me remember these issues so I know to look for them.

[jsimmons]

  On 6/30/2011 at 8:53 PM, LAone said:

slow down, take your time, and do it right

Truer words were never spoken. If a model has presented a problem you don't feel like dealing with, don't just say screw it and rush through the model. Put it aside, and start another one. I've currently got four on the bench, and work on the one I actually feel like working on. I was actually in the middle of a critical step on one build, and couldn't get my mind off the pro-stock version of the same car, so I whipped up a test assembly, took some pics, made some notes, and with that out of my system, I went back to work on the other model (12.5 hours, and I haven't started painting yet).

Edited June 30, 2011 by jsimmons

[Danno]

  On 6/30/2011 at 9:04 PM, mark taylor said:

While I agree with just about everything here, there are a couple I would add.

People mentioned mold seams, but the ones that drive me especially crazy are the as-molded tire with a shiny tread and big mold line down the middle...it just kills the illusion of reality to me.

Secondly, the molded in trademarks/officially licensed product/company logos on chassis pans.

Last would be big nasty ejector pin marks left hanging out there for the world to see...for some reason most of the time in the interior. I think many people assume you won't be able to see them when the model is done, but you usually can.

Mark took the words, almost verbatim, out of my mouth! But let me expand a little:

The tire issue! Besides being shiny-glossy black with absolutely no wear, and having a ridge line down the middle of the tread, displaying a finished build with bodies sitting on tires or oversized wheel/tire combos stuffed into fenders in a fashion that would not permit suspension travel ~ OR STEERING! And don't forget - wheels sticking out a couple of scale inches beyond the tires' beads.

Mold seams - flagrant violation! Especially the engine oil pan, transmission, drive shaft, radiator/cap, shocks, axles, mufflers, exhaust pipes, BUMPERS, and ROOFS!

The copyright engraving! Gimmee a break. I find it more than comical when someone brags about building "the most accurate" or "best detailed ever" whatchamacallit model and then buys dozens of aftermarket photo-etch, resin, or aluminum detail parts and slaps them onto a chassis that still declares in raised lettering: "© JoRevellograMT, patent pending" or some such. Purely hysterical. And, pathetic.

Ejector pin marks. On chassis, interior floors, fender liners, or hoods; particularly on the underside of early cars/trucks with 'wing' fenders, you think the tires hide 'em? Talk about ruining the mood! Fix 'em!

Speaking of hoods ~ as a seasoned veteran judge at many, many events - small and big and huge alike - I can't tell you how many times a killer model lost out because of an unfinished hood. I've been amazed at even the so-called top modelers who work hours on the exterior finish of their models and detail the dickens out of the engine compartment, but then don't (1) remove ejector pin marks (2) prime and paint the underside of the hood and (3) leave naked white plastic showing masking tape techniques. Unbelievable.

Very common but inexcusable faux pas - Seats. Multipiece seats with huge, untreated parting seams between their front halves and seatbacks. Come on, fill the gaps! Look at your own car (or mommy and daddy's car) ~ see the Grand Canyon running down the sides or across the top edges or through the middle of the headrest? I didn't think so.

And finally, incomplete chassis. Another deal breaker as a judge has been looking at the chassis to find no shocks or driveshaft or exhaust/mufflers, etc. Why not build the entire model?

This is a great topic, and it's interesting to see how many very common and frequent issues have been identified by so many different modelers! Just goes to show ...

And one final comment, again from the perspective of years of judging: Attending to all of the issues and concerns pointed out in this thread won't guarantee that you'll be known as a top modeler of legendary status, but I submit that you'll never attain that level of recognition until your models are consistently on top of the game in every one of these areas! The true masters never miss one of these things; never. That's why their models are consistently "awesome."

[Guest]

  On 6/30/2011 at 9:26 PM, Keef said:

The most common problem I see is the inexperienced offering advise to others. If your still painting your chrome trim with what looks like a house paint roller, then you shouldnt be advising other members, both new and old, about the uses and applications of Bare Metal Foil, or the selection of kits, tools, paints, etc

Saw that too. I think they should all be deleted.

[Keef]

  On 7/1/2011 at 6:28 PM, plowboy said:

Saw that too. I think they should all be deleted.

glad im not the only one

[diymirage]

  On 6/30/2011 at 9:26 PM, Keef said:

The most common problem I see is the inexperienced offering advise to others. If your still painting your chrome trim with what looks like a house paint roller, then you shouldnt be advising other members, both new and old, about the uses and applications of Bare Metal Foil, or the selection of kits, tools, paints, etc

i would be cautious here. if we dont allow the younger, inexpierenced ones thier saw we are at risk of quencing thier fire

how many of us havent build models with younger siblings or cousins or nephews?

i for one have a 12 year old nephew whose skills are are you described but i often ask his input on my models to keep him interested and going

i might nor always take the advise others have to give me (and this ranges from my nephew to some of the greats here, its my model after all) but i will ALWAYS apreciate someone taking the time to look at and reply to it.

as for common mistakes in models, one thing that very often gets me is when i get my model all ready for paint, everything is sanded down smooth, i have all the parts together and go to town

primer

primer

primer

paint

paint

paint

decals

clear

clear

clear

i take the model over to the chassis to do a mock up and there in the box staring at my, blinding me with thier pale white styrene look are the COLOURCODED SIDE VIEW MIRRORS I FORGOT TO ATTACH TO THE BODY BEFORE PAINTING

so out come the chrome partsbox mirrors

[futurattraction]

This is a fantastic thread and one that I plan to bookmark and/or I'd be interested in getting ahold of that list if it can get posted to have close-at-hand at the bench. Anyway, a couple things I wanted to mention that always gets my attention on race cars is when the roll cage tubing hangs down into the window area/driver's compartment. Ideally, it should be tucked up inside the roof as much as possible. One a 1:1 it would either be in the way or would reduce visibility. Another irksome thing I see is roll cage tubing that is way out of scale (large) for the build.

[Darin Bastedo]

some of the biggest mistakes can be fixed 3 ways; 1. test fit, 2. test fit, 3. test fit. No models are pefect by a long shot and some aren't even close. But you can correct fit, stance, and assembly issues if you know wverything involved in the assembly befor you put on the shiny stuff and get out the glue. Below is an OOb Revell (perviously monogram) 1978 Firebird trans am. I spent weeks getting the front and rear bumpers to fit the body and to block sand the waves and ridges from the body as well as cleaning up the mold lines and ejector pin marks. the whole model was primered and inspected for sanding marks including the engine and any other su assembly that needed the seams filled and sanded. I then dry fitted nearly 90% of the model together to address any fit problems and aquaint myself with and assembly processes that would possibly mess up the painted model later. At this stage I also was able to address the stance which was way too high in the front, (by nearly 2mm) all the assmbly below is dry fit and now I know how the end result will end up.

One of the biggest paint issues I see partly comes about due to not doing the block sanding, and partly because many of us use spray cans to paint rather than an airbrush. Now I realise that an airbrush is a bit costly but so are spray cans at 5-6 dollars each.

The problem is the paint pulling away at the door lines and body lines. you can see this most in metallics and candies. The problem is that the plastic is still warm when the body is ejected from the mold. This causes ridges around door lines and seams and if they aren't block sanded the paint will pull way from them. sanding though won't totally fix the problem, but by using an airbrush you can pay special attention to the areas that are trouble spots and start with thin light coats that will help the paint adhere to those ares.

After you are done and all the tricky areas are covered you can paint the rest of the car as usual.

[Ben]

Whew, I'm glad I'm not guilty of any of these things so far! LOL

When I build a model, I look at each piece as being it's own little model. First all mold seams and edges are cleaned up, then, if there are reliefs for holes,(like in brackets, vents, etc.) those are opened so the part looks more realistic.

To me, kit parts are just a "suggestion". It's up to the builder to make that part look accurate. The more accurate the parts are, the better the completed model will look.

Also, whenever you have two parts that are meant to be glued together and one side has the locating pins and the other has the holes, cut the pins off and place the part on a sanding block and sand the mating surface flat, do this with the opposite side as well and then glue the pieces together using the outside edge as your guide. This will give you a much better fit and much less of a seam needing to be filled.

[Alyn]

How about shiny black painted chassis and engine compartments. Even worse in my mind is the excessive use of silver on chassis components. Silver leaf springs, silver axle housings, silver steering links and sway bars. Even silver frame rails.

All this is great info for a "Do's and Don'ts" FAQ, or "The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly"

[deanzinaz]

  On 6/30/2011 at 12:31 PM, plowboy said:

Oversized parts in the engine bay. Especially ignition wires. They should not be the same size as coolant lines. Followed closely by the mold line running across the radiator of an otherwise well detailed engine compartment. Another one is hoods that are lighter or darker than the body or a pickup that has a darker or lighter bed.

I agree mostly with this, except I have owned 2 different Ford trucks that had slight mismatch in the paint between cab and bed. The factory paints them in 2 different places and joins them on the line. But you wouldn't/couldn't/shouldn't see it in 1/25.