Unbilt kits

[alangarber]

Just a note to builders on old unbilt kits. Here are some problems that can occur when buying them. I recently got an older kit (not from any members here) and I found that this can happen.

#1 Parts can be warped

#2 Parts can also be brittle and break very easy

#3 Decals are useless

There can be other issues but these can be common. Just a note to beware of when buying older kits for assembly. If you just collect them for the sake of having them then it doesn't matter. So beware when buying or selling as these are some problems that can occur with old kits.

Just thought I'd throw this out there.

[Force]

Missing parts are not that uncommon either.

[chevyfever2009]

I haven't had the problem of them breaking but I'd say that it would have to do with how they were stored for period of time

[Erik Smith]

Tire melt

Broken A pillars

Scratched "glass"

[slusher]

I have only had a couple older kits I bought that was warped. One of the two the bod and chassis was both warped. I agree with Brad it has lots to do with how they are stored. I think keeping kits in attics and exposed to high heat has a lot to do with it...

[Deano]

When buying older kits I just take it for granted that the decals will need special attention and even then may be worthless.

[CJ1971]

Really? Would've thought this was common sense. If you're buying a kit/s produced 20-30-40 yrs ago you've got to know that the technology used back then would pretty much guarantee they won't be perfect & that flash/warping etc would be expected in some way/shape/form.

[pharoah]

That's just the chances you take. It's happened to me too.

[Mark]

With mid-Seventies kits (particularly AMT) watch out for the plastic itself...poor quality, milky looking. "Extenders" (whatever those might be) were used, and more recycled plastic was used than is usual. Some of what is called "regrind" (recycled already-molded plastic, like sprues and short shots) are used, and that is even desirable...up to a point. In that period, though, they went beyond that point. And don't get me started on those two-piece tires they were using, or the kits with the separate red lenses eliminated and replaced with lens detail on the bezels or bumpers.

Early Revell kits have chrome plating that somehow disappears, leaving exposed bare plastic. The plating in those kits often rubs off under even minimal handling anyway. The early vinyl tires include a lot of "plasticizer", which causes softening damage to the plastic parts the tires come into contact with. To top that off, when the kit in question included red lenses, they were usually bagged with the tires. If you want, say, an Ed Roth car or one of the Model A Ford kits, the recent issues are the way to go instead of the first issues. Though the Model A kits never did get any clutch, brake, or gas pedals!

Jo-Han plastic is noticeably brittle compared to that of other manufacturers. You get a warped Jo-Han part, you'd best be careful trying to bend it back into shape.

A lot of Seventies MPC kits had decals that dried out and cracked within a year or two. And, when the lettering was supposed to be gold or gold leaf, it usually came out a washed-out brown (probably cheaper to print that way). Those early Eighties BF Goodrich T/A Radial tires probably caused as much plastic damage as the early Revell kit tires. Kill them all with fire!

[ToyLvr]

That's just the chances you take. It's happened to me too.

Yeah, should be common sense to ask all of these questions before buying, and most especially ask for photos!

I love collecting the old "annual" kits, and have acquired quite a few over the years. I cannot believe how many I've seen over the years where folks pay big bucks for such kits, then dump them on a shelf without prepping them for storage. My suggestions for what to do for preservation:

1) if it's a "new" enough kit to be sealed in plastic, consider opening it and checking for the aforementioned problems, especially if you really intend to build it some day;

2) look under the box "flaps" for loose parts, then bag them. I keep different sizes of zip-lock bags for that purpose. I also bag the glass and chrome in their own bags to help prevent scratches;

3) always bag the tires separately! This has been discussed in other threads re: "tire melt" from vinyl tires;

4) place the decals in a separate bag, if they are still looking good and usable. There are special "sleeves" made for old film negatives that are great for this purpose (certain other plastic materials emit chemical fumes that can "eat" the decals"). Consider storing them separately from the kit box in a climate-controlled place. Some folks make a digital scan of the decal sheets, too;

5) store the kit in a cool, dry place. Heat & humidity are not your friend.

If you're considering buying or trading for an old kit, ask questions based on my list.

Finally, those of you with a bunch of kits - new or old- should consider carefully cataloging your collection and talk to your home insurance agent about coverage for your collection,

Sorry to hijack your thread, Alan, but this stuff is one of my pet peeves...

[Sixties Sam]

I've bought some older kits off eBay, and I learned to assume the decals were junk. They just fall apart when you try to apply them.

Sam

[DodgeAddict]

I bought a complete "HideOut" truck about 8 months ago without the box Everything perfect in bags the only loss to the kit were the box & these

My "PapaTruck" basically the same way only with a box

Both complete though I've started building the HideOut & it seems to have no problems with being brittle or warped & the tires are perfect

I have seen some of what you guys are talking about though

[jbwelda]

spread decal preservative over them before using and many times that will save them. they have to soak for an incredible time sometimes though, before they release from the paper. since I learned about that stuff ive been able to use just about any decal. yellowing is another matter though and the old let it sit in the sun for a while trick didn't work...

jb

[Teddy J. Tannehill]

With all it potential for problems, Vintage plastic is fun...A lot of these troubles can be addressed...Warping of bodies and chassis can be corrected with 2 dish pans one with warm/hot water and one with cold water...Submerge the part in the hot water let the plastic warm, reform it back to original position, hold it that shape and submerge it in the cold water to set it. Clear plastic parts can be polished with a micro polish kit...I have had good results using buffing metalize paint "Stainless or Aluminum plate" duplicate Chrome pretty well. Remove plating and prime first. I am a Wheel/Tire swap guy...You end up with a lot of these Look for AMT 3 in one style kits...Normally they are good to give extras.

[Old Buckaroo]

I will build vintage kits any day . Most of my modeling has been vintage kits - Airfix, Aurora , Matchbox. Decals may be brittle, but dull coat or a coat of clear can save the day. Scratched glass ? I can only name a few kits I have bought that has the clear separate from the main bag of parts. Brittle plastic - guess I am just use to it . I would take it any day over the soft china plastic that reminds of my Rubbermaid trash can.

Chrome - never liked it, I have bought more easy off for using on models then the kitchen.

I am old school and love the older kits.

Nothing beats a sealed kit form the 70's - when you break that shrink wrap and let that air out , you have just traveled back in time when you inhaled have that vintage air.

Edited March 15, 2014 by Old Buckaroo

[High octane]

I like to buy and sometimes build vintage kits as many times it brings back good memories. Sure there can be potential hazards with and older kit of say 50 years, but by the same token, I've bought a recent sealed re-issued kit that was missing the body. With me being from the "old school" I really enjoy buying vintage kits from time to time.

[Aaronw]

Sometimes a different kit in the box, which is not always a bad thing. It is not uncommon for the seller to have no clue what they are selling, clearing out a storage locker or selling off an estate.

Also not uncommon for a modeler with a stash to condense the stash by putting multiple kits in one box. I bought 2 kits a few years ago, but what I received was 6 kits, each of the 2 kit boxes having 3 complete kits inside. Another time I bought a kit that had a second completely different kit along with the kit that was supposed to be there. The weirdest was an Airfix Douglas Dauntless kit, that turned out to be a Meikraft Vought Vindicator (an old short run kit from the 70s some guy in Texas used to produce in his garage).

[Old Buckaroo]

Meikraft Vought Vindicator (an old short run kit from the 70s some guy in Texas used to produce in his garage).

I still have one of those

[Greg Wann]

Convertible body kits in the mail spell DISASTER! I have paid large sums for a perfect Ebay kit only to get it in the mail and have the windshield frame broken. It is a great idea to create a square out of light cardboard and tape it over the frame to keep it from getting broken. I bought a mint sealed MPC 69 SunDancer Trans Am kit to do in resin. Upon opening this sealed kit I found the body riddled with tire burns on the passenger side. I was not very happy. I opened most of the kits I had to see what kind of shape they were in. Most sellers on the bay do not realize that a windshield frame can become broken in the mail. Some sellers are completely greedy and have no care at all about how the kit is packed once they are paid.

Edited March 15, 2014 by Greg Wann

[The Modeling Hermit]

On the issue of decals, I never use the original decals that come in a kit, even the modern ones. I scan them on the computer, set my original back in a dark climate controlled storage container, and print the decals on to a high quality decal film.

[slusher]

Is there a certain age or type tire that causes tire melt? is certain brand of kit worse then others?

[Mark]

Is there a certain age or type tire that causes tire melt? is certain brand of kit worse then others?

The Sixties Revell tires (the solid one-piece ones) seem to be the worst offenders when it comes to softening adjacent plastic parts. Apparently it comes down to the compounds used in making the tires. The thin Revell plating that seemingly wore away quickly (and the clear plastic under many of the plated parts) probably didn't help matters any. AMT tires of the same period aren't quite as soft, and don't cause damage on the scale of the Revell tires (though every once in a while you do see built kits with softening damage to the wheel halves). At the other end of the scale, you have the least flexible tires in Monogram and Jo-Han kits. I can't recall finding softening damage on wheels in a Monogram or Jo-Han kit, ever.

As for the MPC BFG radials, those seem to be a freak occurrence. Other MPC tires from the same era don't seem to cause the same damage as the BFGs. Maybe the mix of materials used in molding those tires had to be different to allow for removal from the tire tooling...that's all I could think of.

[Helix]

I'm currently building a few old kits I bought from a garage sale, the Johan 1970 tornado tyres are pretty much useless, but a set of AMT Round 2 white walls will fix that problem, the glass will be need to have the scratches taken care of, I use Meguires 'PlastX which is really good stuff.

I also started to prepare a MPC 69 Firebird Convertible, the decals are in pretty good shape considering the kit is from 82! However will see what happens when they hit the water!

My biggest challenge will be a Revell Custom Chevy Van from 76, the body is badly warped, decals are history and the classic old 'glue together tyres' are not very good, but its worth building!

Ray.

[slusher]

The Sixties Revell tires (the solid one-piece ones) seem to be the worst offenders when it comes to softening adjacent plastic parts. Apparently it comes down to the compounds used in making the tires. The thin Revell plating that seemingly wore away quickly (and the clear plastic under many of the plated parts) probably didn't help matters any. AMT tires of the same period aren't quite as soft, and don't cause damage on the scale of the Revell tires (though every once in a while you do see built kits with softening damage to the wheel halves). At the other end of the scale, you have the least flexible tires in Monogram and Jo-Han kits. I can't recall finding softening damage on wheels in a Monogram or Jo-Han kit, ever.

As for the MPC BFG radials, those seem to be a freak occurrence. Other MPC tires from the same era don't seem to cause the same damage as the BFGs. Maybe the mix of materials used in molding those tires had to be different to allow for removal from the tire tooling...that's all I could think of.

Thanks Mark for the info. I have been taking in all the info in this subject...

[lordairgtar]

Old Pyro motorcycle kit tires are known to melt the kit wheels. Some kits have the plastic tires which were molded in red. Use those instead of the rubber ones. Those make good diorama bits in a garage seen. If you open sealed vintage kits, or even new ones, the best thing to do is wrap the tires tightly in a paper towel and tape it shut with a bit of scotch tape. If you never open a collector sealed kit, that really don't matter. Also wrap the glass in tissue or paper towel too.