Sorry, Not in my book

[OldTrucker]

  On 4/23/2018 at 2:41 PM, Ace-Garageguy said:

Sorry, I don't buy it.

I've been welding for more than 50 years, and that bubble-gum-looking mess was no more acceptable back then than it is now.

And cars and aircraft that are older than I am don't have anything like that nasty mess either...unless they've been worked on by ignorant hacker morons.

Even a correct stick-weld looks like this after the slag is broken off:

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I think you misunderstood what I was saying which was what they think they are replicating isn't what they were doing back then. Sure they were building hot rods with junkyard parts because they were cheap but the cars had to be safe. I have yet to hear anyone from that generation that didn't talk about how John Q Law wasn't on their cases regularly about the safety of the cars and meeting the laws on vehicles.

No, as the welds they have the wrong idea in thinking that the novice kid would be doing the welding. How many hot rodders had a welder available to them??? Not many would be my guess so they had to find someone with a welder and that could do the job for them! A local gas station owner I worked for when I was an early teen was one of the guys here that the hot rodders would go to get get thir welding work done. He would do the work cheap because it was cash in his pocket that his wife didn't know about!LOL

 

[Ben]

  On 4/21/2018 at 2:31 AM, SfanGoch said:

There isn't a word which currently exists to accurately describe that.

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Lomad?

[Ace-Garageguy]

  On 4/24/2018 at 3:37 PM, OldTrucker said:

I think you misunderstood what I was saying which was what they think they are replicating isn't what they were doing back then...

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OK, I'll buy that.

Unfortunately, there seems to be a widespread perception that people in the way-back were all incompetent, and the lack of modern "technology" and apps for everything somehow made all their work excrement...when in fact, the reverse is closer to the truth. I even see this on YouTube, where watchers of what WAS a beautifully-photographed crystal-clear black-and-white movie assume the muddy and pixelated appearance, and jerking, squirming backgrounds and scene changes is the fault of the original, and not the ACTUAL fault of excessive copying and incompetent uploading.

There have ALWAYS been hackers doing bubble-gum welds, but it has ALWAYS been from ignorance and apathy, not because in "the old days" we couldn't do any better.

[iamsuperdan]

I think it's funny how fired up people get over this stuff. 

Dude built a car the way he wanted. And much like every other automotive customization trend that has ever existed, people will like it and people will hate it. To see the amount of hatred directed at this though, I don't get it.

It's not my scene, but as with anyone that puts real time and effort into a build, I can respect the work that goes into it, even when it looks like it's supposed to be a junker. It takes a lot of attention to detail to make it driveable, yet look completely unroadworthy. The engineering and thought required to make somehting that looks like this actually driveable? it's there.

 

And I'd argue it's just as roadworthy and just as safe as something like this thing. Which I think is even more ugly and ridiculous.

 

 

And just as safe, and probably has more thought in it than something like this, which I love.

 

 

Different strokes for different folks. I'll always applaud effort.

[SfanGoch]

That Chebby is roadworthy as long as it's driven on a runway. It wouldn't last 30 minutes on the streets here in NYC. Our infamous potholes will have it for lunch.

[Ace-Garageguy]

  On 4/24/2018 at 4:08 PM, iamsuperdan said:

I think it's funny how fired up people get over this stuff. 

Dude built a car the way he wanted. And much like every other automotive customization trend that has ever existed, people will like it and people will hate it. To see the amount of hatred directed at this though, I don't get it.

It's not my scene, but as with anyone that puts real time and effort into a build, I can respect the work that goes into it, even when it looks like it's supposed to be a junker. 

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My issue with most of this trash is that there's NO engineering in it.

Applauding slipshod non-craftsmanship just spits in the faces of those of us who have spent a lifetime developing SKILLS.

And you simply have NO logical grounds to argue the road-worthiness or safety of any particular custom-built vehicle without having inspected it from the standpoint of someone well versed in vehicle dynamics, correct engineering practice, and every aspect of fabrication.

SOME of these things CAN be driven in the real world. The VAST MAJORITY CANNOT.

PS. I've seen "rat-rods" where every weld is something to be proud of, and the fabrication is clean and competent. Though they're not MY particular style, I have no problem with those. The ones that are just slapped together with zero regard for function and the "right" way of doing things (and there ARE objective right and wrong ways of doing things with cars) frankly, disgust me.

Edited April 24, 2018 by Ace-Garageguy

[Xingu]

  On 4/24/2018 at 5:12 PM, Ace-Garageguy said:

SOME of these things CAN be driven in the real world. The VAST MAJORITY CANNOT.

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I think it can be argued that a vast majority are not built to be driven on the roads at all. I feel most are built to be dropped off the trailer and parked in the show field/floor. I bet that many have never been over 30 mph. People have been building show only vehicles for decades.

[Ace-Garageguy]

  On 4/24/2018 at 5:20 PM, Xingu said:

I think it can be argued that a vast majority are not built to be driven on the roads at all. I feel most are built to be dropped off the trailer and parked in the show field/floor. I bet that many have never been over 30 mph. People have been building show only vehicles for decades.

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You're absolutely correct. Even Ed Roth's famous Mysterion (which I love visually) was fragile, and is reputed to have broken its frame once while being unloaded from its trailer (I'd love it a whole lot more if it could have put all the power those two FE engines could make to the ground in a tire-smoking burnout...but the engines themselves are said to have had no internals at some times the car was shown )

But...it takes a LOT more effort and knowledge to build something that is well-finished and functions than to build a big, rusty doorstop.

The harder something is to do, and the MORE effort it took to accomplish it, the more impressed I usually am.

No awards for slipshod everyone's-a-winner in my world.

Edited April 24, 2018 by Ace-Garageguy

[Pat Minarick]

  On 4/21/2018 at 2:16 PM, Ace-Garageguy said:

Well, whoever built it didn't seem to feel it was necessary to actually learn to weld before sticking stuff together. That's a pretty good indicator of "no effort".

'Course, the world's full of people who can't tell this   from this  

...or just don't care to do anything right if they can slap some (can't use the word here) together and get all attaboy-ed from it.

 

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So you are saying this weld is on this this car ? I would really like to see it actually on the car . I Googled the image and it went to a few different sites . But nothing to do with that actual car.

[Ace-Garageguy]

  On 4/24/2018 at 6:20 PM, Pat Minarick said:

So you are saying this weld is on this this car ? 

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That is not what I said.

I said: "the world's full of people who can't tell this   from this     "

I suggest you pause the video just about anywhere you please and look at the standard of craftsmanship. It would make a real fabricator vomit.

[Rob Hall]

Hot Rods aren't my thing, I much prefer 60s and newer cars, but Instead of the rusty rat junk, I find hot rods built by Steve Moal's company much more interesting...actual craftsmanship.

 

[Pat Minarick]

  On 4/24/2018 at 6:32 PM, Ace-Garageguy said:

That is not what I said.

I said: "the world's full of people who can't tell this   from this     "

I suggest you pause the video just about anywhere you please and look at the standard of craftsmanship. It would make a real fabricator vomit.

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I've seen the car , been in around it and under it . Chris Walker built it ,he owns In The Weeds Custom. If you are going to say that weld is on that car I think you should back it up .  It's not fair to him. This car was built as a challenge 30 days for less than 3000 dollars . It was a rusted out 4door wagon with no floor. I made 500+ drive right after it was built . I really don't care if someone likes it or not , that is their opinion.

Its just not right to put someones work  down if you don't like it.

[Ace-Garageguy]

  On 4/24/2018 at 7:33 PM, Pat Minarick said:

... If you are going to say that weld is on that car I think you should back it up .  It's not fair to him. This car was built as a challenge 30 days for less than 3000 dollars . It was a rusted out 4door wagon with no floor. I made 500+ drive right after it was built . I really don't care if someone likes it or not , that is their opinion.

Its just not right to put someones work  down if you don't like it.

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I NEVER said that weld was on that car. It's not my problem if that's what you read into it.

And I stand by my implication that the craftsmanship is on a par with it, as far as I can tell from the video of all the rough edges, sharp projections, no hump over the trans, tack welds that look like they were all done on rusty metal with flux-core wire and an el-cheapo mig welder, etc.

Deny any of that.

[Pat Minarick]

  On 4/24/2018 at 7:45 PM, Ace-Garageguy said:

I NEVER said that weld was on that car. It's not my problem if that's what you read into it.

And I stand by my implication that the craftsmanship is on a par with it, as far as I can tell from the video of all the rough edges, sharp projections, no hump over the trans, tack welds that look like they were all done on rusty metal with flux-core wire and an el-cheapo mig welder, etc.

Deny any of that.

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 I don't have to . Look him up and his shop. 

[bobthehobbyguy]

Given the build criteria of a short time frame and budget its not surprising that the car has rough edges. I think the car is cool. What I would really like to see is someone do one with shiny finish and lots of fine detail.

[Ace-Garageguy]

  On 4/24/2018 at 8:18 PM, Pat Minarick said:

 I don't have to . Look him up and his shop. 

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And I don't have to. I can see the quality of the work plainly right here. 

PS. I'll give you this...MAYBE, JUST MAYBE, in all fairness, MAYBE the parts of the work that NEED to be done correctly on the chassis and suspension and engine, the parts that DON'T show here, JUST MAYBE they're acceptable. 

If that's the case, I have no real gripe with the thing. One mans art is another man's vomit-on-a-plate.

That's all I got, and that's as far as I'll bend.

Edited April 24, 2018 by Ace-Garageguy

[Pat Minarick]

  On 4/24/2018 at 8:21 PM, bobthehobbyguy said:

Given the build criteria of a short time frame and budget its not surprising that the car has rough edges. I think the car is cool. What I would really like to see is someone do one with shiny finish and lots of fine detail.

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He was talking about it. He has been busy taking Hulkcamino all over the country .

[Pat Minarick]

I would take it in a minute.

[bobthehobbyguy]

Personally anyone complaining about the finish work should show us how its done by building a running car that was built in 30 days and $3000. You can have as many people working on it as long as you don't exceed the dollar limit.

[Greg Myers]

"build criteria of a short time frame and budget " sounds like something from one of those cheesy cable shows. 

" building a running car that was built in 30 days and $3000. " artificial criteria at best.

Save up your money, spend the time and do it right.

Nice model by the way, a contest winner for sure, in the right class.

Edited April 24, 2018 by Greg Myers

[Ace-Garageguy]

  On 4/24/2018 at 8:42 PM, bobthehobbyguy said:

Personally anyone complaining about the finish work should show us how its done by building a running car that was built in 30 days and $3000. You can have as many people working on it as long as you don't exceed the dollar limit.

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Skill-free people usually work pretty cheap. 

There's an old saying in the building-cars world that is always true. 

There's GOOD work. There's CHEAP work. There's work done FAST.  You can have any TWO.

[modelercarl]

  On 4/24/2018 at 8:51 PM, Ace-Garageguy said:

Skill-free people usually work pretty cheap. 

There's an old saying in the building-cars world that is always true. 

There's GOOD work. There's CHEAP work. There's work done FAST.  You can have any TWO.

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The obvious pick is GOOD and CHEAP, but how do you get good product if the people are "skill free"?

[cowboy rich]

Personally I don't like the car, not only is it not my style but even if it was, if I am building something or paying to have it done I want it done right and to look right, not done right now.

[Psychographic]

If you go the the site of the shop that built this and look through their galleries, it does appear the engineering and quality of what's underneath is hidden by the ratty outside. You will also notice that some of the "rat" was added after the fabrication as it looks  less unskilled work in the building stages.

 

Although I really dislike the idea of building something that looks poorly built ( sorry I don't and never will get it), I love the proportions he comes up with. I remember seeing the Camino a while back and thinking "that would be so cool if it was a finished ride". It did have the full fenders when I saw it and I liked it much better with them.

[Rob Hall]

  On 4/24/2018 at 8:42 PM, bobthehobbyguy said:

Personally anyone complaining about the finish work should show us how its done by building a running car that was built in 30 days and $3000. You can have as many people working on it as long as you don't exceed the dollar limit.

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30 days and $3000 is an inherently false scenario, though.   Unrealistic timeline and budget...where does the labor cost figure in?