Take a picture

[R. Thorne]

With the ubiquitous cell phone most of us have and the extraordinary quality of pictures they provide, there is really no reason not to take pictures of procedures, tools, etc., that work out well and, well, not so well.  It is convenient to look back at pictures and created albums rather than trying to remember everything (though I doubt I will forget this tape experiment).  The only catch is you may have to increase the memory capabilities of your device(s).

[NOBLNG]

Ouch! I bet that hurt more than ripping off a bandaid.? Yes, a picture is worth a thousand words.

[Dpate]

What was the point of the tape? To try and get no residue of the BMF on the body? That's very easy to clean off if you were to get residue on the body, and also why not tamiya tape? Doubt that would of happened with tamiya tape.

[StevenGuthmiller]

14 minutes ago, Dpate said:

What was the point of the tape? To try and get no residue of the BMF on the body? That's very easy to clean off if you were to get residue on the body, and also why not tamiya tape? Doubt that would of happened with tamiya tape.

Utilizing tape for applying foil is a terrific technique, but you have to be careful of the type of tape that you're using depending on your painting regimen.

I use thin strips of blue painters tape to get a perfectly straight foil edge, but I apply the foil first, and then lay the tape along the edge of the trim to be foiled.

This guards against the type of issues exhibited by Ron's above photos because the tape is contacting the foil, and not the paint.

 

The blue tape not only gives a color contrast between the foil and the blade to make it easier to see what you're doing, but the tape gives you an edge for the blade to ride up against as you cut, making it much easier to get a perfectly straight and clean edge on the trim.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Steve

 

Edited October 29, 2022 by StevenGuthmiller

[StevenGuthmiller]

20 hours ago, R. Thorne said:

With the ubiquitous cell phone most of us have and the extraordinary quality of pictures they provide, there is really no reason not to take pictures of procedures, tools, etc., that work out well and, well, not so well.  It is convenient to look back at pictures and created albums rather than trying to remember everything (though I doubt I will forget this tape experiment).  The only catch is you may have to increase the memory capabilities of your device(s).

I have to ask what you used for a base, (primer) and the type of paint you used for the color coats Ron.

I had this sort of problem often, years ago when I used to use enamel paints, and often used Testors metallic silver as a base.

 

 

Steve

[Dpate]

5 minutes ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

Utilizing tape for applying foil is a terrific technique, but you have to be careful of the type of tape that you're using depending on your painting regimen.

I use thin strips of blue painters tape to get a perfectly straight foil edge, but I apply the foil first, and then lay the tape along the edge of the trim to be foiled.

This guards against the type of issues exhibited by Ron's above photos because the tape is contacting the foil, and not the paint.

 

The blue tape not only gives a color contrast between the foil and the blade to make it easier to see what you're doing, but the tape gives you an edge for the blade to ride up against as you cut, making it much easier to get a perfectly straight and clean edge on the trim.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Steve

 

I know this method from you because I've seen your post before and it's a great technique.  But i simply said what i said because I've seen other folks use the method he did to avoid getting residue on the body from the BMF but with tamiya not sure what kind of tape he used lol.

[Plowboy]

This also proves that paint doesn't bond to a smooth surface. I also don't see the point of using tape. It may be of benefit if there's no visible edge to go by. But, that's a rare instance.

There's an easy way to keep foil residue off of unwanted surfaces. Don't burnish past the trim and use a strip of foil only double the width of the trim. I can do most trim with a strip of foil 3mms wide.   

[R. Thorne]

Well, gentlemen, thanks for the replies.  This was an experiment to cut out the bmf adhesive mess that didn’t work, so I don’t feel too bad, but was a mysterious outcome, nonetheless.  The white tape was Tamiya tape for curves and ,perhaps, I may have stretched it too much and, hence, put too much pressure on it.  I don’t know. I had put foil alone (cut real thin) on other trim and I was taking it off today it pulled the red paint off, also. The paint was Tamiya silverleaf (ts30) over a non sanded out of the box body, cleaned with alcohol wipes.  The top coat was Ts74 clear red.  For some reason, the red did not adhere well to the silver base, but the silver bonded quite well to the bare smooth body (I tried to pull the silver base coat with some aggressive tape to no avail).  Oh, btw, this was new bmf just received a month ago direct from the manufacturer.  

[StevenGuthmiller]

59 minutes ago, Plowboy said:

I also don't see the point of using tape.

As I said, It just makes it easier to see what you're doing, and has the added benefit of giving the blade a straight edge to ride against, helping to prevent slips or wandering.

Nothing more than another tool to help with issues that I see people having with applying foil all of the time.

 

I can tell you that it has made applying foil to trim, especially fine trim, a lot easier and much more enjoyable for me.

I foiled trim without using this method for decades, and I won't go back.

 

By the way, I don't worry about adhesive residue on the paint either.

Whether burnished down or not, it will still often leave residue behind, but a little WD-40 on a Q-tip will take it off instantly.

 

 

 

Steve

Edited October 29, 2022 by StevenGuthmiller

[Bills72sj]

I have never had paint let go like that, ever. I am surprised that a lacquer paint with its solvent base, would have difficulty bonding over another lacquer.

Regarding foiling, I free hand cut my trim with fairly good results for years. I have added Steve's suggested edging with tape for long lines with ill defined edges. Makes for laser straight lines. Since I mostly paint with enamels, any residue comes off with dry Q-tips on isopropyl dipped ones. While Steve has success with WD-40, I would be hesitant due to the non-evaporative nature of the oil/lubricant components in the mixture. My fear is that is would fisheye any clear coat applied over the finished foil or decals.

[StevenGuthmiller]

14 minutes ago, Bills72sj said:

While Steve has success with WD-40, I would be hesitant due to the non-evaporative nature of the oil/lubricant components in the mixture. My fear is that is would fisheye any clear coat applied over the finished foil or decals.

Oh, I agree.

While a good cleaning with warm water and dish detergent will remove any remaining WD left on the surface, I would also suggest not using it if you are still planning on adding any more paint.

I apply the lions share of my foil after all of the paint work is finished, so I don't worry about using WD-40.

 

In the same vein, care must be taken when using IPA as well.

Alcohol doesn't play very well with some paints.

 

 

 

Steve

Edited October 29, 2022 by StevenGuthmiller

[TransAmMike]

Well Ron, that sure is a shame.  As stated, when the moulded in edge is not well defined, the tape method definately works. So far, I haven't layed the foil down first as you recommended Steve, gonna have to try it that way.

[R. Thorne]

During my forensic examination and racking my brain for what might have went wrong with the color coat not adhering properly, I can only come up with 1 possible explanation:  I may have used alcohol wipes to clean the body before painting the color coat and that softened the paint (only in spots where there was a thicker coat of paint such as builds up around the trim and high points).  This kept the color coat from adhering properly in certain spots.

Anyway, it is soaking in 91% alcohol and I will try again, but this time using detergent to clean with.  

[StevenGuthmiller]

42 minutes ago, R. Thorne said:

During my forensic examination and racking my brain for what might have went wrong with the color coat not adhering properly, I can only come up with 1 possible explanation:  I may have used alcohol wipes to clean the body before painting the color coat and that softened the paint (only in spots where there was a thicker coat of paint such as builds up around the trim and high points).  This kept the color coat from adhering properly in certain spots.

Anyway, it is soaking in 91% alcohol and I will try again, but this time using detergent to clean with.  

Maybe give the base coat a light sanding before applying the color might help.

I’m not very familiar with Tamiya lacquers, but if they’re anything like Testors lacquers, they’re not a particularly aggressive lacquer, meaning that it might not etch into previous coats as a hotter lacquer would.

But, on second thought, sanding the base coat might not work all that well with a transparent color.

 

 

 

Steve

Edited October 29, 2022 by StevenGuthmiller

[Plowboy]

4 hours ago, R. Thorne said:

Well, gentlemen, thanks for the replies.  This was an experiment to cut out the bmf adhesive mess that didn’t work, so I don’t feel too bad, but was a mysterious outcome, nonetheless.  The white tape was Tamiya tape for curves and ,perhaps, I may have stretched it too much and, hence, put too much pressure on it.  I don’t know. I had put foil alone (cut real thin) on other trim and I was taking it off today it pulled the red paint off, also. The paint was Tamiya silverleaf (ts30) over a non sanded out of the box body, cleaned with alcohol wipes.  The top coat was Ts74 clear red.  For some reason, the red did not adhere well to the silver base, but the silver bonded quite well to the bare smooth body (I tried to pull the silver base coat with some aggressive tape to no avail).  Oh, btw, this was new bmf just received a month ago direct from the manufacturer.  

Next time, either sand the silver lightly with 1000 grit before the clear read or apply the clear red over the silver a few minutes afterwards. I would only shoot one coat of the clear red over the silver, allow those two coats to dry, sand with 2000 and then shoot additional coats of clear red. 

Something else to consider is you may using too much pressure when you're trimming your foil. That can cause the paint to lift sometimes. It takes very little pressure to cut foil if you use a new blade.I found a long time ago that the lighter the pressure, the straighter the cut.

[R. Thorne]

Much obliged, gentlemen.  Rest assured I will try all suggestions you have made.  

[Bills72sj]

4 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

Oh, I agree.

While a good cleaning with warm water and dish detergent will remove any remaining WD left on the surface, I would also suggest not using it if you are still planning on adding any more paint.

I apply the lions share of my foil after all of the paint work is finished, so I don't worry about using WD-40.

 

In the same vein, care must be taken when using IPA as well.

Alcohol doesn't play very well with some paints.

Steve

True, like lacquers.

[kymdlr]

Tamiya tape is great, I’ve only had one failure with it. I sprayed duplicolor 1k clear over testors one coat metallic. After it dried for a few days I put the tamiya tape over it to mask a line I wanted to paint. I left the tamiya tape on too long I assume and it ripped the duplicicolor 1k right off. Luckily it was an easy fix by brushing some future over the area where the clear was stripped off. I also had a failure with blue painters tape over the same brand clear coat.