Dumb median design - anyone else see this?

[89AKurt]

This is AZ69 going to Prescott, AZ.  They have a section getting a new median installed.  I never saw where asphalt (tarmac, bitumen, paving, whatever) is used as the foundation for concrete work.   For some reason Arizona can't lay roadways that don't fall apart when it rains/snows.   I'm just using some not-so Common Sense, would the freeze-thaw cycle push that concrete up and break it?  Drilling into the road, what could go wrong?

This is a continuous curb.

Much of this stretch has these cross drainage things, with nice sharp corners to blow out tires and wreck suspensions if you scrape the curb.  They cut the asphalt for those, but the curbs are on top of the road surface.

The last picture location, I could have been killed by someone who had a heart attack and crossed the yellow line (decades ago), 3 people died behind me.   I know the purpose of this median is to stop that, but I see new problems.

Anyone else see this in other locations?

[stitchdup]

Leith walk in edinburgh is laid out awfully. It has a pavement (sidewalk to you guys) with a cycle lane in the middle of the footpath, then the bus stops on the gap between the cycle lane and the road/tramway which you have to cross to catch a bus, then to catch a tram you have to stand in the middle of the road, and the same on the other side. There is no signage to say who has right of way, every junction now crosses over the stupidly designed pavement and the cycle lane has no speed limit so just eats and those guys are doing 40 and 50mph through an area full of tourists that are used to common sense streets, not this mess that seems to have been designed by a drunken toddler with anger issues. At some points of the street you have to cross 4 different roads just to cross one road because its so badly laid out. 

[Xingu]

How else can you continually receive government money for road repairs, if you don’t design the need for road repairs into your road repairs.

[1972coronet]

Perhaps the dumbest traffic-flow "improvement" I encountered while travelling through Arizona was those asinine traffic circles on US 60 ! 

[89AKurt]

On 8/22/2025 at 12:04 AM, stitchdup said:

Leith walk in edinburgh is laid out awfully. It has a pavement (sidewalk to you guys) with a cycle lane in the middle of the footpath, then the bus stops on the gap between the cycle lane and the road/tramway which you have to cross to catch a bus, then to catch a tram you have to stand in the middle of the road, and the same on the other side. There is no signage to say who has right of way, every junction now crosses over the stupidly designed pavement and the cycle lane has no speed limit so just eats and those guys are doing 40 and 50mph through an area full of tourists that are used to common sense streets, not this mess that seems to have been designed by a drunken toddler with anger issues. At some points of the street you have to cross 4 different roads just to cross one road because its so badly laid out. 

John's comment above about roundabouts in Arizona, I think you guys invented those yes? 😉  I've seen an aerial photo of one in England that looks like a Cusinart blade.  I think Arizona Dept. Of Transportation sent some Engineers to a seminar over there, to implant the idea here.  I was vocal about the first one installed in Prescott, on AZ89, that must have been two decades ago.  I just heard a radio PSA about how to drive through them, some people refuse to adapt.  I love them, when there aren't other vehicles near me.  Sedona the tourist trap near me, has tiny ones, some two lanes, came close to a wreck one time.

[stitchdup]

8 minutes ago, 89AKurt said:

John's comment above about roundabouts in Arizona, I think you guys invented those yes? 😉  I've seen an aerial photo of one in England that looks like a Cusinart blade.  I think Arizona Dept. Of Transportation sent some Engineers to a seminar over there, to implant the idea here.  I was vocal about the first one installed in Prescott, on AZ89, that must have been two decades ago.  I just heard a radio PSA about how to drive through them, some people refuse to adapt.  I love them, when there aren't other vehicles near me.  Sedona the tourist trap near me, has tiny ones, some two lanes, came close to a wreck one time.

i'm guessing you mean the magic roundabout in swindon

but theres also a few of thse

[89AKurt]

3 minutes ago, stitchdup said:

i'm guessing you mean the magic roundabout in swindon

but theres also a few of thse

🤣 YES!!!! 😂  Rountabouts within a roundabout, and the arrows are going the wrong way. 🤭  This is a pair in Sedona, which shows the traffic back-up which is normal during the day.  When Fall colors are in Oak Creek (off to the right), it's stupid to drive here.

Should I revise my OT title to include Roundabouts too?

[stitchdup]

2 minutes ago, 89AKurt said:

🤣 YES!!!! 😂  Rountabouts within a roundabout, and the arrows are going the wrong way. 🤭  This is a pair in Sedona, which shows the traffic back-up which is normal during the day.  When Fall colors are in Oak Creek (off to the right), it's stupid to drive here.

Should I revise my OT title to include Roundabouts too?

well the first problem is they are all driving on the wrong side of the road, but the markings on the road dont help. the centre makings should follow the roundabout which makes it easier for drivers.

[1972coronet]

8 hours ago, 89AKurt said:

John's comment above about roundabouts in Arizona

I wasn't aware of the other roundabouts you've mentioned ; only the one in the middle of nowhere , on an ages-old stretch of US 60 ( I-10 replaced US 60 ( 60-70-99 in California ) by c.1972 ) . That is what made me laugh : applying those Blimey rascals to a highway which dates to the 1920's , 1930's , as to just test 'em. 

Personally, I've no issue with 'em. I just find them funny. 

[espo]

The "Roundabouts" and now "Diverging Diamonds" are becoming very common here as well. The problem was getting drivers to learn how they are expected to move thru these traffic designs without running into each other and not driving straight across a roundabout as so many did early on. There still are too many drivers in this area that blow through stop signs and even red lights at times. Now there are groups trying to sue the cities that are bringing back the "Red Light Camaras". The driver problem had gotten so bad a few years ago that some cities had to use the camaras for both enforcement issues as well as having proof just which driver did what that caused an accident. A group sued saying the camaras violated their rights, but the number of intersection accidents had dropped significantly during the time they were in use. They won in court and the traffic camaras went away for a few years. The problem is that there are far too many drivers that just flat ignore the basic rules of the road and operate a motor vehicle as if they are the only ones on the road and heaven help anyone else on the road. They seem to forget that it is their bad driving that has caused the camaras return.      

[Rob Hall]

I encountered a Diverging Diamond intersection for the first time recently on a visit to Colorado Springs...an intersection I drove through countless times when I lived there 25 years ago, was rebuilt a few years ago as a DD.   Diverging diamonds are a curious thing, end up driving on the opposite side of the road for a bit..

We are starting to get a lot of roundabouts built here in NE Ohio.  I remember all the ones around Sedona in AZ last time I went up there about 10 years ago. 

 

I-25 and Fillmore DD:

Edited October 3 by Rob Hall

[stitchdup]

were those diverging diamomds designed by scalectrix?

[peteski]

On 10/3/2025 at 12:25 PM, espo said:

The driver problem had gotten so bad a few years ago that some cities had to use the camaras for both enforcement issues as well as having proof just which driver did what that caused an accident. A group sued saying the camaras violated their rights, but the number of intersection accidents had dropped significantly during the time they were in use. They won in court and the traffic camaras went away for a few years. The problem is that there are far too many drivers that just flat ignore the basic rules of the road and operate a motor vehicle as if they are the only ones on the road and heaven help anyone else on the road. They seem to forget that it is their bad driving that has caused the camaras return.   

It is pretty laughable that these are considered as rights violation when more and more of those pesky flock cameras are popping around my area (and everywhere else in the U.S., and nobody seems to be upset that those are basically tracking us, aggregate all sorts of info about use, and sell that to for-profit-companies and to law enforcement.  I should start another thread about those.

EDIT:I actually did start new topic about those Flock Cameras last night but that topic seems to have !poof!  vanished. I didn't think there was anything political or forbidden in it.

Edited October 6 by peteski

[espo]

16 hours ago, peteski said:

It is pretty laughable that these are considered as rights violation when more and more of those pesky flock cameras are popping around my area (and everywhere else in the U.S., and nobody seems to be upset that those are basically tracking us, aggregate all sorts of info about use, and sell that to for-profit-companies and to law enforcement.  I should start another thread about those.

I agree with you on the aspect of the loss of privacy and the selling of information about my movements while on the road. The problem as I mentioned goes back to drivers that fail to pay attention to what they are doing while drive a motor vehicle and their propensity to ignore traffic signs and the right-of-way of other drivers when that applies. 

[peteski]

4 hours ago, espo said:

I agree with you on the aspect of the loss of privacy and the selling of information about my movements while on the road. The problem as I mentioned goes back to drivers that fail to pay attention to what they are doing while drive a motor vehicle and their propensity to ignore traffic signs and the right-of-way of other drivers when that applies. 

I'm for red light cameras which are used just by police for enforcing traffic laws. It is those new flock cameras that get my knickers in the twist.  They are totally different animal and they seem to be sprouting everywhere (not specifically at traffic locations) like mushrooms after it rains.

[kermn8r]

I went to Phoenix last week and ran into more roundabouts on Hwy 93 heading into Wickenburg that there used to be.  I lost count, but there are 5 or 6 now.  It looks like even more cold be built.  Last month I was in Pennington, New Jersey.  There has been a roundabout there for years, but since my trip last year. stop lights have been added about a1/4 mile before the roundabout to regulate the traffic flow into the roundabout.  Doesn't that defeat the purpose of a roundabout?

[ranma]

Used to be a blinking red/yellow light U.S.127 & 224 Then came the roundabout to stop accidents at that area, Funny there's actually been more now! Now they want to add another at U.S.224 and old 30. A really bad idea! if stop signs or blinking light didnt work? Then to top things off there limiting access to US 30 in our area as well and will ne adding another not a great Idea that actually increases chances of accidents! Indiana idea that they did on US30 and Indiana 101

[89AKurt]

Enjoying the input from other parts of the planet.  There are people who already had their license revoked if they even had one, driving drunk and/or high, or not citizens, who really don't care. 

That last graphic 30/101 is exactly what I have to do, after the highest median I've ever seen was built where I turn at the highway, every time a U-turn is required.  One week two separate fatal accidents happened at each end of the island.

"Flock cameras" are something new here too, to keep track of smuggling drugs/people.  I can see them being abused to jail drivers like me on long trips.

[ranma]

This dumb Idea is another one taken from Fort Wayne Indiana. They did this to Market street between Main and central st for one block. What could go wrong with this? Wet leaves make slick streets worse, Tree roots are known to upheave sidewalks, and tap into water lines!

Edited Thursday at 09:41 PM by ranma

[89AKurt]

On 10/9/2025 at 2:39 PM, ranma said:

This dumb Idea is another one taken from Fort Wayne Indiana. They did this to Market street between Main and central st for one block. What could go wrong with this? Wet leaves make slick streets worse, Tree roots are known to upheave sidewalks, and tap into water lines!

The newest parts of Prescott Valley has such a median, with identical trees exactly 50 feet (guessing) apart.  But the dirt is level, not sloped like that, which is like a golf course community that has no curb and washes gravel onto the lane.  They at least have the water main along the edge of the streets.