Greg Myers Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Wow, lots of rampant speculation in this thread, but hey, isn't that what this place is all about?!?! First off, I said that I heard (and this was from someone not directly connected with Revell) that they were waiting to hear back on some licensing deals from the companies that issue the licenses, meaning that they had applied for the licensing, but had not gotten the word back from the license holders, not that they had forgotten to apply for the licensing. Second, Revell NEVER gave a date when they would make the announcement, so who says they're running anything but right on time? My neighbors cousins friend next door said he heard a guy on the bus say his kid worked with a guy that knew what the new kits were going to be but his mom told him his dad said he couldn't tell till he got his room cleaned up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnbuzzed Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Failed, forgotten, whatever; someone didn't get his or her assignment done in an expeditious manner; but if they never really did offer a date for the announcement, I guess it don't really matter. I miss the good old days of going into a store and seeing a new kit, without knowing of that kit in advance through any means or media. Pleasant surprises such as that are needed in this world. But if you really gotta plan your builds... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) I think we've all experienced that feeling, however with the shrinking existence of the local hobby shop and the ever present big box i.e. Michaels, Hobby Lobby type stores whose inventory rarely changes, this feeling of euphoria is long gone. Now we depend on the hobby media with little or no investigative reporting or the never ending "insider" info from our "If I tell you, but I'll have to kill you" or the more prevalent, " I know, but I can't (wont) tell you" friends. Edited October 21, 2013 by Greg Myers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Geiger Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Wow, lots of rampant speculation in this thread, but hey, isn't that what this place is all about?!?! First off, I said that I heard (and this was from someone not directly connected with Revell) that they were waiting to hear back on some licensing deals from the companies that issue the licenses, meaning that they had applied for the licensing, but had not gotten the word back from the license holders, not that they had forgotten to apply for the licensing. Second, Revell NEVER gave a date when they would make the announcement, so who says they're running anything but right on time? I'll go with Brett. Who said they will make announcements? They never promised anything. And I can only imagine what it's like to try to get a new kit to market. Dealing with a bunch of outsourced functions, from design, to tooling to production. I been there in my own career, and sometimes it's difficult to get them on the same page as you... even though you are paying them. And then add in the licensing wrinkle, that could take any unknown length of time, since every company has their own way of doing it, and they aren't working for you so you are at their mercy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niteowl7710 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I'll go with Brett. Who said they will make announcements? They never promised anything. And I can only imagine what it's like to try to get a new kit to market. Dealing with a bunch of outsourced functions, from design, to tooling to production. I been there in my own career, and sometimes it's difficult to get them on the same page as you... even though you are paying them. And then add in the licensing wrinkle, that could take any unknown length of time, since every company has their own way of doing it, and they aren't working for you so you are at their mercy. I guess the "difficulty" is that when you do something the same way for say 25 years or so, then you decide you're going to chart your own media relations course, without actually having any...well media relations, people start to get antsy. iHobby (which incidentally annoys me as a name the "i" is for International, but we gotta be cutsy about it cause Apple products use the lower case "i", and they're cool right?) existed before the name change as the RCHTA Show. Religiously for over the two decades plus I've been in the hobby they announced with everyone else (with the exception of the two NNL years when they announced BEFORE anyone else - usually iHobby is the weekend after the NNL), but now their sooooooo special they're not accountable to anyone's expectations? At this point in my never to be humble opinion they should at least toss out a communication "We're waiting on a license/tool/test shot et al, we're so excited to show you what's coming in '14, hang in there, news soon!!", but then that's never been Revell's style of "Radio Silence to the Public". In regards to your other point, well then maybe it's time to re-shore some operations then. Plenty of talented people out there still need jobs in the never ending flat recovery of the economy. Perhaps not as dead cheap as China, but at the same time one thinks perhaps having the tooling/production around Chicago would stop these silly problems (Mustang LX, Reversed Nova gas tank, '57 Chevy X brace) that it would offset the costs of having to go BACK and fix things that could be caught in "real" time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Art Anderson Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 I'll go with Brett. Who said they will make announcements? They never promised anything. And I can only imagine what it's like to try to get a new kit to market. Dealing with a bunch of outsourced functions, from design, to tooling to production. I been there in my own career, and sometimes it's difficult to get them on the same page as you... even though you are paying them. And then add in the licensing wrinkle, that could take any unknown length of time, since every company has their own way of doing it, and they aren't working for you so you are at their mercy. Tom's got it pretty right (and I trust Brett Barrow's thoughts on this as wel!). Being somewhat peripherally involved in new model kit development, I can only reiterate what Tom Geiger says here--in times past when all product development was done in-house, it had to have been lots easier (and faster as well) to not only do all the upfront work, but also monitoring and reviewing the work being done by those old-time pattern-makers (just walk down the hallway and get updates immediately--or at least in a very timely fashion). Today, as opposed to yesteryear, additional complications do come from both language and cultural barriers--both of which, even with the most complete reference information and instructional text does tax the communication skills of all involved. But somehow, it all does come together--but it does take time, lots of time, not to mention patience and perseverance (hmmm, aren't those skills and traits part of what we model builders need to have as well?). Just because the very latest in computer-connected technology does the "grunt work" of creating the drawings, rapid-prototyping the tooling mockups, and CAM the final steel dies, NONE of this is worth much without the serious input of humans (GIGO, as my computer science professor put it back 44 years ago in my college classroom!). So, hang in there folks. When Revell has finalized something (or several somethings!) to present for our (and the retail industry as well) anticipation, they will make their announcements. Art Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Maybe I missed something... but why do some of you seem to think that any manufacturer has an obligation to announce upcoming kits before they're actually available? It seems to me that if manufacturers stopped touting "coming" kits and just announced new kits when they are actually available, all of this nonsense would go away. Or does that make too much sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Barrow Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) [redacted] Edited October 21, 2013 by Brett Barrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt T. Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Maybe I missed something... but why do some of you seem to think that any manufacturer has an obligation to announce upcoming kits before they're actually available? niteowl said it well - I guess the "difficulty" is that when you do something the same way for say 25 years or so, then you decide you're going to chart your own media relations course, without actually having any...well media relations, people start to get antsy. iHobby...existed before the name change as the RCHTA Show. Religiously for over the two decades plus I've been in the hobby they announced with everyone else... Managing expectations. Brand Management. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 niteowl said it well - Managing expectations. Brand Management. Managing expectations? By making announcements of kits that are still many months away from reality, a company is creating expectations that they then have to manage... a self-inflicted problem. Stop making announcements until the kit is actually available. Problem solved. Every new announcement you make would then be not a "maybe this kit will see the light of day sometime," but rather "This new kit is actually HERE and you can buy it NOW!" It makes more sense to me to make an announcement that will please people than to make an announcement that just invariably ticks people off when the announced kit takes forever to actually show up (assuming that it actually does make it to production!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Myers Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Reputation,expectations,marketing,past practices, modern communications, it's all in there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casey Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Managing expectations. Brand Management. Some might say that Revell (or maybe Hobbico, since they were the ones to decide not to attend iHobby the last two years) IS taking control of its brand by deciding when and where it makes it's announcements and not just going along with the "everybody's been dong it this way for years" mentality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt T. Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Managing expectations? By making announcements of kits that are still many months away from reality, a company is creating expectations that they then have to manage... a self-inflicted problem. Stop making announcements until the kit is actually available. Problem solved. Every new announcement you make would then be not a "maybe this kit will see the light of day sometime," but rather "This new kit is actually HERE and you can buy it NOW!" It makes more sense to me to make an announcement that will please people than to make an announcement that just invariably ticks people off when the announced kit takes forever to actually show up (assuming that it actually does make it to production!). I meant the expectation that they announce their kits like they have for 20+ years. Sorry, should have been clearer there. Others have said it better than I. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Barrow Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) Revell (and other companies) make announcements of their upcoming products months in advance not so much for the benefit of the end users of their products (us), but for the benefit of toy and hobby buyers, distributors and hobby retailers so they can plan their inventories and orders accordingly. To that end, it's helpful to remember that iHobby (and its predecessor, the RCTHA show), where new-kit announcements have traditionally been made in the past, is an industry trade show which is intended to allow manufacturers to showcase their new products to an audience comprised largely of toy and hobby buyers, distributors and hobby retailers. Exactly. And now, thanks to the internet, the general public gets to know about it instantly. There's a difference between announcing a new release and advertising a new release - like Carl said, the announcements are made primarily for the benefit of wholesalers, distributors, and retailers, while advertising is aimed towards consumers. Revell doesn't advertise new releases until they're just about to hit the shelves, for instance they've just started advertising the new 70 Cuda in November and December issues of magazines (I heard from someone that saw an ad in the current issue of Car Craft, and the new issue (Dec) of Scale Auto has an ad as well). Edited October 21, 2013 by Brett Barrow Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) Maybe I missed something... but why do some of you seem to think that any manufacturer has an obligation to announce upcoming kits before they're actually available? It seems to me that if manufacturers stopped touting "coming" kits and just announced new kits when they are actually available, all of this nonsense would go away. Or does that make too much sense?Let's not forget that Revell is not the only game in town. and there are also competitive considerations about things that may be in the future. While some early announcements may fend off competitors, they could possibly have learned that they might be pre-empted by others with similar products coming out. But I'm with the others who think that all this conjecture is kind of silly if you don't know the facts, ma'am. Edited October 21, 2013 by sjordan2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 ...it's helpful to remember that iHobby (and its predecessor, the RCTHA show), where new-kit announcements have traditionally been made in the past, is an industry trade show... that's open to the public. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Revell (and other companies) make announcements of their upcoming products months in advance not so much for the benefit of the end users of their products (us), but for the benefit of toy and hobby buyers, distributors and hobby retailers so they can plan their inventories and orders accordingly. Why keep shooting yourself in the foot and looking foolish, and keep getting kit buyers PO'd, when the announcements turn out to be overly optimistic (or not true at all)? Just my 2¢... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niteowl7710 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Managing expectations? By making announcements of kits that are still many months away from reality, a company is creating expectations that they then have to manage... a self-inflicted problem. Stop making announcements until the kit is actually available. Problem solved. Every new announcement you make would then be not a "maybe this kit will see the light of day sometime," but rather "This new kit is actually HERE and you can buy it NOW!" It makes more sense to me to make an announcement that will please people than to make an announcement that just invariably ticks people off when the announced kit takes forever to actually show up (assuming that it actually does make it to production!). Well since this is all just replication of real automobiles, maybe we should have the 1:1 manufacturers kill off the major auto shows. I don't mean the Regional one that's held in the local convention center by your local chapter of the NADA, but the BIG ones like Detroit, L.A., Geneva, etc where the new cars are shown for the first time. Some of those vehicles are debuted months, or even a year before the general public can buy one. So heck with it! Why should anyone know about the '14 Corvette, or '15 Mustang, or '14 Camaro Z-28 until one second before they roll off the car transporter in the lot? You want a new car, just go to the dealer and see what they have lying around. Want a new model? Just go to the LHS repeatedly eventually new stuff will arrive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbowser Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Big picture, who is paying attention to any of this other than us? If Revell's current way of doing things is working for them re: wholesalers and distributers then that's what they'll continue to do. The minute it stops working they will try something else, capitalism at work. Obviously the old way of making announcements wasn't working anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Well since this is all just replication of real automobiles, maybe we should have the 1:1 manufacturers kill off the major auto shows. I don't mean the Regional one that's held in the local convention center by your local chapter of the NADA, but the BIG ones like Detroit, L.A., Geneva, etc where the new cars are shown for the first time. Some of those vehicles are debuted months, or even a year before the general public can buy one. So heck with it! Why should anyone know about the '14 Corvette, or '15 Mustang, or '14 Camaro Z-28 until one second before they roll off the car transporter in the lot? You want a new car, just go to the dealer and see what they have lying around. Want a new model? Just go to the LHS repeatedly eventually new stuff will arrive! But you're comparing apples and oranges here. Auto manufacturers often show early versions of new cars to gauge public reaction and gather feedback that the manufacturer will then use to tweak the car's design. Those show cars have a purpose. But model kit manufacturers don't float "what if" kits to gauge public reaction, they just keep announcing new kits way too early, with overly optimistic debut dates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) Harry, is it painful being so obtuse? Kit manufacturers do exactly that, except they do it to gauage reaction of hobby buyers, distributors and retailers. If a kit encounters an extremely negative reaction from those constituents, it doesn't get produced. Have you not seen the rather lengthy thread on this very forum about "ghost" kits? Seems to me that most of the "ghost" kits mentioned in that thread were either before or in the earliest days of the Internet, and it would be very hard for them to have measured customer response. Edited October 21, 2013 by sjordan2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brett Barrow Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Seems to me that most of the "ghost" kits mentioned in that thread were either before or in the earliest days of the Internet, and it would be very hard for them to have measured customer response. They were measuring customer response, not consumer response. Wholesalers, distributors, and retailers are their actual customers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sjordan2 Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 (edited) If you'd bothered to read the thread closely, you would have seen there was one specific instance mentioned in it of a kit being canceled due to negative reaction from customers, i.e., toy and hobby buyers, distributors and retailers. That would be the AMT Ford/Gar Wood refuse truck.[/quoteOne? Well, there's a groundswell of opinion.And yes, I have bothered to read this thread. Nice attitude, guy. Edited October 21, 2013 by sjordan2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry P. Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 Harry, is it painful being so obtuse? Kit manufacturers do exactly that, except they do it to gauage reaction of hobby buyers, distributors and retailers. If a kit encounters an extremely negative reaction from those constituents, it doesn't get produced. Have you not seen the rather lengthy thread on this very forum about "ghost" kits? Isn't this thread talking about Revell's announcements to consumers of upcoming kits? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daddyfink Posted October 21, 2013 Share Posted October 21, 2013 This thread needs to die. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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