1977 Dodge 4x4 warlock

[GLMFAA1]

1 hour ago, Tabbysdaddy said:

Post a link to your unboxing videos so we know how to do it right.

Sorry, I don't get models sent to me free to review☹️ and I don't want that. I just build. Sorry, did'nt mean to hijack this thread

greg

Edited December 12, 2023 by GLMFAA1
extra thought

[Tabbysdaddy]

Nobody called anybody unreasonable. I'm sure if you left him a comment on his video telling him how wrong he's doing it he would appreciate it.

[Can-Con]

18 hours ago, Tabbysdaddy said:

Nobody called anybody unreasonable. I'm sure if you left him a comment on his video telling him how wrong he's doing it he would appreciate it.

Sean, we weren't calling him wrong, just that it could be better if he was more prepared. This presenter has done tons of videos in the past and has been very good at it, obviously, or Round 2 wouldn't have sent him the kit to review. It happens some sometimes. 

[niteowl7710]

I think a little grace might be granted to anyone reviewing this kit if they didn't build models as a kid. I think some of you are forgetting that none of the D-100/150 kits were available after the early 80s other than the Little Red Express and the last LRE reissue was over 16 years ago. If someone didn't buy the prior '78 D-100 reissue, how would they know what all the parts are (to compare the multiples of 2WD/4WD parts)?

Given that the 4x4 parts haven't been seen in a kit since 1982 and in stepside form since 1979. 

The instructions are only going to vaguely show what parts are kinda sorta used to build the Warlock. They're not going to mention all the extra parts, nor what size the engine is vs. what it should be. By the way Steve if happen to skim this, can we please stop with the "nostalgia" direction sheets? The box art and all of that are way cool, but it's about to be 2024, can we just get nice, BIG, modern technical drawings of things? Nobody has their eye sight from childhood nowadays and the old instructions with their mount this blob of thing over there *arrow points vaguely at the front of the vehicle* weren't adequate when the kits were new.

[Jordan White]

6 minutes ago, niteowl7710 said:

By the way Steve if happen to skim this, can we please stop with the "nostalgia" direction sheets? The box art and all of that are way cool, but it's about to be 2024, can we just get nice, BIG, modern technical drawings of things? Nobody has their eye sight from childhood nowadays and the old instructions with their mount this blob of thing over there *arrow points vaguely at the front of the vehicle* weren't adequate when the kits were new.

Agreed! It seems like that would be relatively easy to do nowadays!

[mikemodeler]

1 hour ago, niteowl7710 said:

 

The instructions are only going to vaguely show what parts are kinda sorta used to build the Warlock. They're not going to mention all the extra parts, nor what size the engine is vs. what it should be. By the way Steve if happen to skim this, can we please stop with the "nostalgia" direction sheets? The box art and all of that are way cool, but it's about to be 2024, can we just get nice, BIG, modern technical drawings of things? Nobody has their eye sight from childhood nowadays and the old instructions with their mount this blob of thing over there *arrow points vaguely at the front of the vehicle* weren't adequate when the kits were new.

I would be willing to bet that the budgets for these reissues are based on the amount of work needed to get them back on the shelves and the ones with the least amount of work and higher selling potential win out over those that require more. While new instruction sheets would be nice, I am sure the cost and time involved may factor into whether or not a kit gets approved.

[niteowl7710]

4 minutes ago, mikemodeler said:

I would be willing to bet that the budgets for these reissues are based on the amount of work needed to get them back on the shelves and the ones with the least amount of work and higher selling potential win out over those that require more. While new instruction sheets would be nice, I am sure the cost and time involved may factor into whether or not a kit gets approved.

Sure, but is the new one a recreation of the old one with the newer safety instructions added? Like they scanned a 1978 instruction sheet and modified it. Or is it an entirely new creation that mimics the original? If it's rhe latter than making new art work can't be substantially more expensive than re-drawing the old one all over again.

That's a legit question BTW to anyone that has an original as I was a whole 1 years old when the Warlock was released the first time.

[GLMFAA1]

Interestingly doing a little internet search for box art information most of the releases say 'big Dodge engine' but the 74 say 400 ci and the little red wagon says 360 ci.

So whatever you want to call it you got it. No Hemi?

Another thing that's been corrected is the front valance between grille and bumper has the turn signals filled in as opposed to the original that had the earlier turn signals in it. The goof is the old interior tub has gas pedal and brake pedal molded in the floor and then the dash board has clutch and brake pedal hanging down.

enjoy your build, Now wouldn't the side stacks from the red wagon look good in gold to match the wheels and pin stripe.

greg

[mikemodeler]

10 hours ago, niteowl7710 said:

Sure, but is the new one a recreation of the old one with the newer safety instructions added? Like they scanned a 1978 instruction sheet and modified it. Or is it an entirely new creation that mimics the original? If it's rhe latter than making new art work can't be substantially more expensive than re-drawing the old one all over again.

That's a legit question BTW to anyone that has an original as I was a whole 1 years old when the Warlock was released the first time.

That is a question for someone at Round2 to answer, I highly doubt any of us here know the exact costs involved. It likely depends on whether that updating can be done in house or has to be sent to an outside entity to do the work. What may seem like a simple task  (and it possibly is) may cost thousands as it has to be reviewed, proofread and approved by many eyes, likely including a legal team.

This kit was created in a time where we had fewer warning labels and people understood that sharp knives and glue were to be handled with caution.

[GLMFAA1]

"This kit was created in a time where we had fewer warning labels and people understood that sharp knives and glue were to be handled with caution."

And even the paint might contain lead! ?

greg

[maxwell48098]

I retired from Chrysler 18 years ago, and two of my areas or responsibility were owners manuals and service manuals. "Cautions" and "Warnings accounted for 40% of the content in the owners manuals, and 56% in the service manuals.  Trial lawyers hated it, but our product liability attorneys required it.

[SteveG]

19 hours ago, niteowl7710 said:

I think a little grace might be granted to anyone reviewing this kit if they didn't build models as a kid. I think some of you are forgetting that none of the D-100/150 kits were available after the early 80s other than the Little Red Express and the last LRE reissue was over 16 years ago. If someone didn't buy the prior '78 D-100 reissue, how would they know what all the parts are (to compare the multiples of 2WD/4WD parts)?

Given that the 4x4 parts haven't been seen in a kit since 1982 and in stepside form since 1979. 

The instructions are only going to vaguely show what parts are kinda sorta used to build the Warlock. They're not going to mention all the extra parts, nor what size the engine is vs. what it should be. By the way Steve if happen to skim this, can we please stop with the "nostalgia" direction sheets? The box art and all of that are way cool, but it's about to be 2024, can we just get nice, BIG, modern technical drawings of things? Nobody has their eye sight from childhood nowadays and the old instructions with their mount this blob of thing over there *arrow points vaguely at the front of the vehicle* weren't adequate when the kits were new.

My friend James who did the video, only got the opportunity to review the Warlock kit a few hours before hand.  It was not planned, we just happen to be at the same social event earlier in the day, and I had my review sample with me which I lent to him as I was leaving. In hindsight I probably should have taken the time to fill him in better on all the extra parts that were leftover in the kit from the earlier versions.  Regardless, I'm still glad he did it so the full contents could be seen.   

As for improving the vintage instruction sheets, I'm with you but it really comes down to time and manpower.  Each member of creative team has about two weeks per kit to create all the digital flies for the print items, Box lid and tray, instruction sheets, decals sheet front and back and labels.  On a vintage kit like the Warlock which we haven't run before, it's no easy task to scan all the original items in and turn them into something usable again to today's standards. It's very rare they get a mint perfect kit to start with and there's almost always some content that has changed. On top of that they have to build a test shot too.  They don't get enough credit for how much work that goes into each new kit release. 

In a perfect world we would create a brand-new sheet for each kit, it's just not practical. I really wish we could.  On an all-new kit like the new Dodge Charger kits, it took about a month to turn the 3D files into a new 2D drawn instruction sheet.   On the old kits, there's no existing 3D files or 2D technical drawings to work from other than existing instruction sheets.  Whatever they used for the original drawings is long gone. 

-Steve

Edited December 13, 2023 by SteveG

[mikemodeler]

2 hours ago, SteveG said:

My friend James who did the video, only got the opportunity to review the Warlock kit a few hours before hand.  It was not planned, we just happen to be at the same social event earlier in the day, and I had my review sample with me which I lent to him as I was leaving. In hindsight I probably should have taken the time to fill him in better on all the extra parts that were leftover in the kit from the earlier versions.  Regardless, I'm still glad he did it so the full contents could be seen.   

As for improving the vintage instruction sheets, I'm with you but it really comes down to time and manpower.  Each member of creative team has about two weeks per kit to create all the digital flies for the print items, Box lid and tray, instruction sheets, decals sheet front and back and labels.  On a vintage kit like the Warlock which we haven't run before, it's no easy task to scan all the original items in and turn them into something usable again to today's standards. It's very rare they get a mint perfect kit to start with and there's almost always some content that has changed. On top of that they have to build a test shot too.  They don't get enough credit for how much work that goes into each new kit release. 

In a prefect world we would create a brand-new sheet for each kit, it's just not practical. I really wish we could.  On an all-new kit like the new Dodge Charger kits, it took about a month to turn the 3D files into a new 2D drawn instruction sheet.   On the old kits, there's no existing 3D files or 2D technical drawings to work from other than existing instruction sheets.  Whatever they used for the original drawings is long gone. 

-Steve

Steve, thanks for the explanation, this should be pinned at the top of the section so whenever the topic comes up, it can be seen and you don't have to respond each time. A big thank you to you and the team for bringing this old kit back, looking forward to having it again and whatever else you have up your sleeve!

[66c10]

I have the old one built it I'm glad to the kit is back enjoyed building it I will enjoy building the new one 

[stavanzer]

On 12/13/2023 at 8:31 AM, SteveG said:

My friend James who did the video, only got the opportunity to review the Warlock kit a few hours before hand.  It was not planned, we just happen to be at the same social event earlier in the day, and I had my review sample with me which I lent to him as I was leaving. In hindsight I probably should have taken the time to fill him in better on all the extra parts that were leftover in the kit from the earlier versions.  Regardless, I'm still glad he did it so the full contents could be seen.   

As for improving the vintage instruction sheets, I'm with you but it really comes down to time and manpower.  Each member of creative team has about two weeks per kit to create all the digital flies for the print items, Box lid and tray, instruction sheets, decals sheet front and back and labels.  On a vintage kit like the Warlock which we haven't run before, it's no easy task to scan all the original items in and turn them into something usable again to today's standards. It's very rare they get a mint perfect kit to start with and there's almost always some content that has changed. On top of that they have to build a test shot too.  They don't get enough credit for how much work that goes into each new kit release. 

In a perfect world we would create a brand-new sheet for each kit, it's just not practical. I really wish we could.  On an all-new kit like the new Dodge Charger kits, it took about a month to turn the 3D files into a new 2D drawn instruction sheet.   On the old kits, there's no existing 3D files or 2D technical drawings to work from other than existing instruction sheets.  Whatever they used for the original drawings is long gone. 

-Steve

It was a good video. Since it was on "On-the-Fly" deal, it is even better.

I was stoked to see the original Long Bed kits, complete Roll Bar assembly, and Complete Off Road Gas Tank in the parts trees. I just wish those parts had made it into the Long Bed kit 3 years ago. But, I am very happy to see them come up now. Nice to get the Baby Brush Guard too.

I do not know what is planned for the tool moving forward, and we can speculate all day long, but I hope there is a Long Bed 4x4 and a Little Red Wagon in the future. It would be great if you could find some of the Monster Truck parts too. The Roll Bars, Heavy Duty Bumpers, and the Raised Hood would be great even if they were not really part of a kit, just extras.

But, you sold me at least three of the long bed kits, and I'll eventually wind up with three Warlocks, just for kit bashing purposes. I'll be off to Fireball Models to get some Stock-ish 4x4 wheels and tires for a Long Bed 4x4 build, and some new street tires for a Short Bed Two Wheel drive shop truck.

I have to say "Great Job" on these Dodge Trucks.

[1930fordpickup]

The new Warlock will be a have to have a few for me. Former neighbor had one of these when he moved in. He bought it new. It was pretty rusty a short 5 years later in Michigan. 

[stavanzer]

Got mine on order!

I can't wait to get it in my hands.

My '73 Dodge 3/4 Ton, Longbed, Camper Special, had a 400 Engine. Pics online show that the 360 and 400 look very similar in outward appearance. Other than the Odd, Chrome Air Cleaner in the kit, the engine is generic enough to pass for just about any MOPAR Non-Hemi V-8 of the Early to Late 1970's.

[Can-Con]

54 minutes ago, stavanzer said:

Pics online show that the 360 and 400 look very similar in outward appearance. Other than the Odd, Chrome Air Cleaner in the kit, the engine is generic enough to pass for just about any MOPAR Non-Hemi V-8 of the Early to Late 1970's.

I disagree. 

The layout of the engine in the kit and the shape of the valve covers could only be a "B" or "RB" engine with it's distributor on the front. [383, 400, 440, etc.]

 A small block Mopar like a 318, 340 and 360 are "LA" engines with the distributor on the back and look quite a bit different then the kit engine. In fact, they look a lot like a small block Chevy on a quick glance.

[stavanzer]

1 hour ago, Can-Con said:

I disagree. 

The layout of the engine in the kit and the shape of the valve covers could only be a "B" or "RB" engine with it's distributor on the front. [383, 400, 440, etc.]

 A small block Mopar like a 318, 340 and 360 are "LA" engines with the distributor on the back and look quite a bit different then the kit engine. In fact, they look a lot like a small block Chevy on a quick glance.

You are quite correct. I was wrong.

My quik look at the pics I saw, totally overlooked the Distributor placement!

Happy to be proven wrong in this case.

It does mean that the kit engine is not accurate for a "Li'l Red Wagon" but that has not stopped anybody before.

Thanks for correcting me.

[slusher]

Another correct feature in Steve’s picture the exhaust manifolds came painted the same color as the engine on Chrysler engines..

[stavanzer]

10 hours ago, slusher said:

Another correct feature in Steve’s picture the exhaust manifolds came painted the same color as the engine on Chrysler engines..

The Exhaust Manifolds on all of my MOPARs were a dark, rusty brown.

[maxwell48098]

The Exhaust Manifolds on all of my MOPARs were a dark, rusty brown.  That is true once the engine paint burned off.  Just running them on "the rolls" dynos in the assembly plant, the top 2-3 inches of paint would be burnt off.  Once it got to the dealership and prepped for delivery, in about 20 minutes the last of the paint was gone.  Park the vehicle in humid air overnight, ato life. nd that rusty patina came.  Every engine that I saw leave Mound Road Engine, or Trenton Engine in the suburbs of Detroit had the manifolds installed before paint.

 

A.J.

[tim boyd]

Many of the most respected Mopar restorers have said (in print) that the engines were painted ata the factory with the exhaust manifolds attached, but the manifolds were not intended to wear paint.  The net result was varying degrees of engine paint overspray on the manifolds resulting from the paint applications to the engine block/valve covers/manifolds etc.  When combined with the rust overlay that quickly developed as noted in the posts above, the net appearance was something like this....

[Scott Eriksen]

51 minutes ago, tim boyd said:

Many of the most respected Mopar restorers have said (in print) that the engines were painted ata the factory with the exhaust manifolds attached, but the manifolds were not intended to wear paint.  The net result was varying degrees of engine paint overspray on the manifolds resulting from the paint applications to the engine block/valve covers/manifolds etc.  When combined with the rust overlay that quickly developed as noted in the posts above, the net appearance was something like this....

.............unless you use this stuff ,,,lol !

[restoman]

On 2/26/2024 at 7:23 PM, tim boyd said:

Many of the most respected Mopar restorers have said (in print) that the engines were painted ata the factory with the exhaust manifolds attached, but the manifolds were not intended to wear paint.  The net result was varying degrees of engine paint overspray on the manifolds resulting from the paint applications to the engine block/valve covers/manifolds etc.  When combined with the rust overlay that quickly developed as noted in the posts above, the net appearance was something like this....

... And the small block's by-pass hose from the manifold to the water pump was always painted from the factory.