Ace-Garageguy Posted February 15 Share Posted February 15 ...due to rushing to production, and an effort to shortcut the cost of certification of an aircraft that's substantially different from the earlier 737. Notice the contradiction in BOEING'S OWN OPERATING INSTRUCTIONS Mr. Browne addresses starting around 6:20 in the video. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim N Posted February 16 Share Posted February 16 Boeing wrote the book on how NOT to build an airplane. How they come back from this is beyond me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stitchdup Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 10 hours ago, Jim N said: Boeing wrote the book on how NOT to build an airplane. How they come back from this is beyond me. start building submarines, at least then when they sink they can say it half worked Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 They'd probably put screen doors on a sub... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobss396 Posted February 17 Share Posted February 17 That is quite a crutch for a critical issue. Boeing has had other work-arounds for serious flaws in the past. Which were correctly resolved. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Most Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 I love how the "If it ain't Boeing I ain't going" types are eating crow. It's weird to me how people who will never own their own jet liner have brand loyalty in the first place but apparently it's a thing. I've noticed that car people are certainly weird but aircraft people are on a whole 'nother level. Anyway ... it's not like Boeing doing shady stuff is anything new. Right around the time Boeing merged with Douglas they just became Douglas, but somehow worse. Or maybe I'm wrong... Before that happened there was a problem with the PCU in the 737. The PCU being an actuator that controls the rudder. In certain situations the PCU could jam in such a way that a left input on the stick would actually cause the plane to turn right. Obviously a problem, and could make any number of high pressure situations worse for the flight crew. Boeing did not build the PCU, a supplier did, and apparently they were aware of the problem. Boeing was aware too, but they conveniently forgot about it until it had caused two fatal crashes and one that came very close. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stitchdup Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 7 hours ago, Chuck Most said: Boeing was aware too, but they conveniently forgot about it until it had caused two fatal crashes and one that came very close. boeing, our thoughts and prayers hold the plane together 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Most Posted February 27 Share Posted February 27 4 hours ago, stitchdup said: boeing, our thoughts and prayers hold the plane together Like I said, the Douglas way. 🤣 They knew the DC-10 cargo door didn't like to latch but nothing really came from that until that defect actually killed people. Boeing seems to be copying from their playbook. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Most Posted March 29 Share Posted March 29 Saw this today and it reminded me of this thread ... 😂 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobss396 Posted March 31 Share Posted March 31 Then there was the de Havilland Comet... https://admiralcloudberg.medium.com/neither-money-nor-manpower-the-story-of-the-de-havilland-comet-and-the-crash-of-boac-flight-781-36db2a3435ce Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted April 1 Author Share Posted April 1 And the Lockheed Electra... https://medium.com/propliners/lockheed-electra-part-3-dfb2c21a007c 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brutalform Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 https://www.cbsnews.com/news/engine-cowling-falls-off-boeing-plane-southwest-airlines-flight-denver-houston/ These occurrences are becoming too frequent. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobss396 Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 7 hours ago, Brutalform said: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/engine-cowling-falls-off-boeing-plane-southwest-airlines-flight-denver-houston/ These occurrences are becoming too frequent. Either by design of the news is grabbing any occurrence that comes along. Likely this has been going on for a long time and suddenly has become "news-worthy". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt Bacon Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 This one sounds like someone forgot to latch the cowling shut properly. What I’d like to know is what are SouthWest’s procedures for pre-flight walkarounds? I’ve watch the Jet2 Captain or Co-pilot check their 737s from the lounge window at Leeds often enough, and they check all the opening hatches they can reach by giving them a good shake, including the cowling panels… as well as checking all the air data probes, sticking their heads in the wheel bays, and taking a good look up the jet pipes… beat, M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted April 8 Author Share Posted April 8 (edited) 3 hours ago, bobss396 said: Either by design of the news is grabbing any occurrence that comes along. Likely this has been going on for a long time and suddenly has become "news-worthy". Rest assured, an airliner losing an engine cowling in flight would have been "news-worthy" any time in the past. HOWEVER...what the idiot, ignorant media IS doing is beating the "Boeing bad !!!" drum. Poor maintenance procedures on the part of distracted or incompetent ground personnel have zero to do with the aircraft manufacturer. Aviation incidents are indeed becoming more common. Another airliner missed an ILS landing approach just a few days back, and almost hit the control tower at the airport where it was attempting to land. Investigations are ongoing as to whether it was equipment failure (the ILS...instrument landing system) or human error. Edited April 8 by Ace-Garageguy CLARITY 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted April 8 Author Share Posted April 8 (edited) 1 hour ago, Matt Bacon said: This one sounds like someone forgot to latch the cowling shut properly. What I’d like to know is what are SouthWest’s procedures for pre-flight walkarounds? Same as any other carrier. And I've flown Southwest for decades without a minute's hesitation. But you simply can't reach all the engine cowling panels from the ground without a ladder, and climbing around airliners on ladders isn't part of a pilot's pre-flight. Nor can you always tell by looking if quarter-turn latching fasteners or retainer screws are properly engaged. A pilot has to be able to trust the ground crew to be putting panels back on correctly (or noting any panel-fastener defects), just like he has to be able to trust the workers who build the things to put all the bolts in. Just for some perspective, the rear body panel on Mark Donohue's Porsche 917 opened up at 180MPH here at Road Atlanta in a testing session back in 1972, rendering it uncontrollable. It subsequently left the ground, flipped over on its back, and was destroyed in the resulting crash...all because a body mount fastener wasn't properly secured. (Donohue, by the way, walked away from that one because the car was engineered so well.) EDIT: The point is that even though Donohue was an engineer himself and the ultimate professional development driver, and Roger Penske's car prep was probably the most meticulous on the planet, somebody didn't catch a loose panel latch before the car went on the course. But in that case, Donohue was the only one whose life was at risk. Airliners flying at over 500 MPH with hundreds of souls on board are orders of magnitude more critical as far as mechanical double-checks go. Edited April 8 by Ace-Garageguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stavanzer Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 3 hours ago, bobss396 said: Likely this has been going on for a long time and suddenly has become "news-worthy". I think this explains some of it. But, not all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobss396 Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 1 hour ago, stavanzer said: I think this explains some of it. But, not all. All I know is that i missed buying tanked Boeing stock when it was in the toilet . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stavanzer Posted April 8 Share Posted April 8 Don't Worry Bob, it will tank again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
89AKurt Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 It was just yesterday that I flew back from Bellingham WA, on Southwest no less, got my Will done before flying up. I hate flying, the only part I like is looking out the window. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ace-Garageguy Posted April 9 Author Share Posted April 9 (edited) 20 minutes ago, 89AKurt said: ...I hate flying, the only part I like is looking out the window... Edited April 9 by Ace-Garageguy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobss396 Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 7 hours ago, Ace-Garageguy said: Best TZ ever... there is something on the wing.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Most Posted April 9 Share Posted April 9 All I'm going to say is... Hey ... Lockheed? Might be an opportunity to get back into the airliner business. Jeez, tap into the retro zeitgeist and make a new L-1011. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peteski Posted April 11 Share Posted April 11 On 4/9/2024 at 8:17 AM, Chuck Most said: All I'm going to say is... Hey ... Lockheed? Might be an opportunity to get back into the airliner business. Jeez, tap into the retro zeitgeist and make a new L-1011. I think this idea will never fly. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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