Just updated with JoHan/Lindberg/Moebius B-Body Comparo Pix - detailed review of second round test shots of the new Moebius '65 Belvedere Sedan kit...

[tim boyd]

You'll be joining me as I take a first look at the parts trees of this second version of the Moebius '65 Plynouth B-Body tool.....if you click on the link below.

Seriously, earlier this evening, I set up my camera and photo'ed each parts tree just as soon as it came out of the bag shown below the first time. I found there's a few surprises, too.

You saw the images of the black test shot build on the Moebius table from everyone's NNL Nats Photo Coverage...now see the details behind that model.

And make sure to use the "Roll" feature so you can view the captions with the photos. (Stated another way, if you just look at the thumbnails, you're going to miss a great deal of the story here).

I'll do my best to answer any questions you may have. And join me in saying "Thanks" to Moebius Design Engineer/Product Manager Dave Metzner for providing this sample and allowing me to share these images and info with you. Thanks for looking...!

TIM

Detailed review of second round test shots...

 

Edited October 25, 2015 by tim boyd

[Muncie]

wow!

Learned to drive on the family '65 Belvedere wagon...  A little different, slant six , three on the tree...  but this one hits close to the soul.  Good to see that Moebius did a great job.

Thanks for the review

 

[Craig Irwin]

Very nice! Kind of like the Revell '68 Hemi Dart kit, "almost" everything we need to do an accurate factory race car.  My spares box has the rest.

[1930fordpickup]

Man more money leaving the wallet to them. LOL 

After my purchases on saturday at the NNL I hope that this is a 2016 release. 

 

[gtx6970]

Hope its just a picture angle but it looks like the front edge of the roof / top of the windshield opening .....curls upward?

 

If that's the case PLEASE fix it before release

[Jon Cole]

Moebius just keeps the smiles comin'! Really dig the deep rear steelies! 

[drodg]

Tim thanks for the review.  It is so cool what Moebius is doing for the hobby.  

[Chuck Kourouklis]

Great overview as always, Tim.  Just fine with the choices Moebius made on this one - I'll dogpile with everyone else on the parts box angle (or mix 'n match with current and future Satellites for that matter).

[FordRodnKustom]

Looks like a must have even for this Blue Oval guy. Thanks for the 1st look.

[charlie8575]

Looks good overall; windshield top might be a bit askew as Bill mentioned, but overall, the appearance is excellent.

Suggestions for the extra parts.

1. Front bench seat with a column shifter; add the automatic pedals back in as an option, or if someone wants to do a 3-speed, that becomes possible.

2. Want to light a few fires? We really need a good, easily-sourced LA block. With optional 2/4-barrel carbs, a 273 (regular or HyperPak) or a '67-up 318 would be very easily replicated. I would seriously welcome a poly-head 318, as well, as would a very large number of rep-stock builders, who could conceivably buy this kit for either or those alone. The engine should be molded with the option of a manual or automatic.

Charlie Larkin

[horsepower]

Why don't they leave the deleted Satellite parts on the trees? I can't see where it's going to save that much plastic by blocking them off, they kept the front windshield and rear window from the Satellite and we can't use those to build a different type of Street build, some people might want to build an automatic version.

[tim boyd]

Why don't they leave the deleted Satellite parts on the trees? I can't see where it's going to save that much plastic by blocking them off, they kept the front windshield and rear window from the Satellite and we can't use those to build a different type of Street build, some people might want to build an automatic version.

If you study the parts trees closely (compare them to the photos of the Satellite kit I did a few months back), AND if I am remembering correctly, you will see that they switched tool inserts  in the case of the engine/transmissions - e.g. the engine block/tranny halves appear in the same place in the parts tree of both kits, but with an automatic trans in the Satellite kit and the manual version in the Belvedere.  So they couldn't have included engine block tranny assemblies both in a single kit run.  

In other cases, like the tailamps, you can see that the Belvedere tailamps and the Satellite tailamps are in different spots on the same tree, so in that case, they could have run both versions in a single kit, but even these days, the cost of extra styrene adds up and with the relatively low sales volume and profit margins, every dollar saved now can go to develop additional versions of this and other Moebius kits down the road.  

As I mentioned in the text, they are planning to include the stock four barrel manifold and air clearer in the Belvedere kit, and as you point out, the extra windows, so in some cases they are doing what you want, just not maybe with the exact parts you want.  And in some other cases, such as the "Custom" version of Revell's '50 Olds, almost all of the stock version parts are still in the Custom version kit so with that one, you get plenty of extra parts that allow a lot of kitbashing as well.  

I understand that this probably sounds like corporate you know what, but sometimes it is easy to forget that these kits must still turn a profit in order for the kitmakers to have a successful enterprise, and that means a number of carefully managed tradeoffs along the way.....TB  

[SteveG]

Looks good overall; windshield top might be a bit askew as Bill mentioned, but overall, the appearance is excellent.

Suggestions for the extra parts.

1. Front bench seat with a column shifter; add the automatic pedals back in as an option, or if someone wants to do a 3-speed, that becomes possible.

2. Want to light a few fires? We really need a good, easily-sourced LA block. With optional 2/4-barrel carbs, a 273 (regular or HyperPak) or a '67-up 318 would be very easily replicated. I would seriously welcome a poly-head 318, as well, as would a very large number of rep-stock builders, who could conceivably buy this kit for either or those alone. The engine should be molded with the option of a manual or automatic.

Charlie Larkin

To the best of my knowledge the 65 B-bodies Plymouth and Dodges still used the Push button Automatic shifter on the Right side of the dash unless ordered with a floor shifter.   That detail is included on both the Satellite and the Belvedere kits as Moebius is carrying over that part with no changes. 

Although nobody has mentioned it yet,  the Moebius Belvedere Sedan kit will be about 95% correct to build a Factory Police package 2 Dr. sedan once the single 4bbl parts are added.  Those buckets seat were available on both the 2 and 4 door Police cars in 1965 as well as the manual transmission option.  Only the modern tires and the cut out exhaust would be wrong.

Steve

 

 

[Danno]

I might as well set up a direct deposit to Moebius from my bank account, on a recurring, monthly basis.  They just keep rolling out the hits!!

[Harry P.]

I understand that this probably sounds like corporate you know what...

Actually Tim, it sounds a lot less like corporate you-know-what when you break it down clearly and logically, as you have done. I think your quick explanation probably enlightened a lot of our members here who may not have the detailed knowledge of model kit manufacturing that you have... so good on ya!

Folks, the questions of what parts are offered with what kit, what parts go where on the trees, what parts are blocked off for a particular issue or run of kits, what versions of a given kit will ultimately be offered, etc. are all questions that are carefully considered and decided on long before you see the kit on the shelves. The people manufacturing these kits aren't amateurs... they know their business, their customers, and what it takes to turn a profit. Believe me... which parts are included on the tree, etc., doesn't happen by accident.

That being said... way to go, Moebius! You guys are truly the driving force these days behind new releases in the world of model cars that are aimed at adult modelers.

[tim boyd]

To the best of my knowledge the 65 B-bodies Plymouth and Dodges still used the Push button Automatic shifter on the Right side of the dash unless ordered with a floor shifter.   That detail is included on both the Satellite and the Belvedere kits as Moebius is carrying over that part with no changes. 

Although nobody has mentioned it yet,  the Moebius Belvedere Sedan kit will be about 95% correct to build a Factory Police package 2 Dr. sedan once the single 4bbl parts are added.  Those buckets seat were available on both the 2 and 4 door Police cars in 1965 as well as the manual transmission option.  Only the modern tires and the cut out exhaust would be wrong.

Steve

 

 

Steve....1965 was the model year that Ma Mopar switched from pushbuttons to a conventional steering column shifter.

I remember the magazines making a big deal about it, and how strange is seemed when my Dad took delivery of his factory-ordered '65 Dodge Custom 880 wagon to replace his '58 Dodge Custom Sierra D500 wagon.

 As far as I know, that change took place across all Mopar products that year.  Having said that, adding a pin shifter to the steering column is a lot easier than scratchbuilding a pushbutton pod, making the Police conversion you describe all the easier.  Best...TIM 

[tim boyd]

Actually Tim, it sounds a lot less like corporate you-know-what when you break it down clearly and logically, as you have done. I think your quick explanation probably enlightened a lot of our members here who may not have the detailed knowledge of model kit manufacturing that you have... so good on ya!

Folks, the questions of what parts are offered with what kit, what parts go where on the trees, what parts are blocked off for a particular issue or run of kits, what versions of a given kit will ultimately be offered, etc. are all questions that are carefully considered and decided on long before you see the kit on the shelves. The people manufacturing these kits aren't amateurs... they know their business, their customers, and what it takes to turn a profit. Believe me... which parts are included on the tree, etc., doesn't happen by accident.

That being said... way to go, Moebius! You guys are truly the driving force these days behind new releases in the world of model cars that are aimed at adult modelers.

Thanks Harry....TIM 

[charlie8575]

To the best of my knowledge the 65 B-bodies Plymouth and Dodges still used the Push button Automatic shifter on the Right side of the dash unless ordered with a floor shifter.   That detail is included on both the Satellite and the Belvedere kits as Moebius is carrying over that part with no changes. 

Although nobody has mentioned it yet,  the Moebius Belvedere Sedan kit will be about 95% correct to build a Factory Police package 2 Dr. sedan once the single 4bbl parts are added.  Those buckets seat were available on both the 2 and 4 door Police cars in 1965 as well as the manual transmission option.  Only the modern tires and the cut out exhaust would be wrong.

Steve

 

 

1964 was the last year for the pushbuttons, which were on the left side of the steering wheel. That was to keep them out of the reach of overly-curious children.

Interesting point about the police package; I didn't know you could get buckets. 

Charlie Larkin

[W-409]

Oh well, another kit I need. And it looks like only one of these won't do, so I'll have to pick up at least three to be able to build different versions. Moebius is definitely my favorite model kit company nowadays!

[sfhess]

Steve....1965 was the model year that Ma Mopar switched from pushbuttons to a conventional steering column shifter.

I remember the magazines making a big deal about it, and how strange is seemed when my Dad took delivery of his factory-ordered '65 Dodge Custom 880 wagon to replace his '58 Dodge Custom Sierra D500 wagon.

 As far as I know, that change took place across all Mopar products that year.  Having said that, adding a pin shifter to the steering column is a lot easier than scratchbuilding a pushbutton pod, making the Police conversion you describe all the easier.  Best...TIM 

Also around that time automatic shift patterns for all manufacturers were standardized to "PRNDL".  Not sure if this was a government mandate or something the makers all decided to do.

[Atmobil]

To the best of my knowledge the 65 B-bodies Plymouth and Dodges still used the Push button Automatic shifter on the Right side of the dash unless ordered with a floor shifter.   That detail is included on both the Satellite and the Belvedere kits as Moebius is carrying over that part with no changes. 

Although nobody has mentioned it yet,  the Moebius Belvedere Sedan kit will be about 95% correct to build a Factory Police package 2 Dr. sedan once the single 4bbl parts are added.  Those buckets seat were available on both the 2 and 4 door Police cars in 1965 as well as the manual transmission option.  Only the modern tires and the cut out exhaust would be wrong.

Steve

 

 

That police car possibilty sounds very interesting. I think I will try and keep that idea in mind for the future

Thanks to Tim for the pictures, this one will go on my list of kits to get

 

I will also have to get some anti-aging pills because I have recently calculated that at my current buildingrate I would have to get past a 150 years to build all of the models I have and that does not include the ones that I want to buy in the future

[mikemopar70]

moebius is taking care of filling missing links in automotive subjects, and i'm very pleased with this..

I'm on my way to build their Satellite next..

Thank you Moebius, i'll buy this Belvedere for sure!!!   

[jeffbrad]

To the best of my knowledge the 65 B-bodies Plymouth and Dodges still used the Push button Automatic shifter on the Right side of the dash unless ordered with a floor shifter.   That detail is included on both the Satellite and the Belvedere kits as Moebius is carrying over that part with no changes. 

Although nobody has mentioned it yet,  the Moebius Belvedere Sedan kit will be about 95% correct to build a Factory Police package 2 Dr. sedan once the single 4bbl parts are added.  Those buckets seat were available on both the 2 and 4 door Police cars in 1965 as well as the manual transmission option.  Only the modern tires and the cut out exhaust would be wrong.

Steve

 

 

[jeffbrad]

64 was the last year for push buttons. 65's had column shifters.

[horsepower]

TheIf you study the parts trees closely (compare them to the photos of the Satellite kit I did a few months back), AND if I am remembering correctly, you will see that they switched tool inserts  in the case of the engine/transmissions - e.g. the engine block/tranny halves appear in the same place in the parts tree of both kits, but with an automatic trans in the Satellite kit and the manual version in the Belvedere.  So they couldn't have included engine block tranny assemblies both in a single kit run.  

In other cases, like the tailamps, you can see that the Belvedere tailamps and the Satellite tailamps are in different spots on the same tree, so in that case, they could have run both versions in a single kit, but even these days, the cost of extra styrene adds up and with the relatively low sales volume and profit margins, every dollar saved now can go to develop additional versions of this and other Moebius kits down the road.  

As I mentioned in the text, they are planning to include the stock four barrel manifold and air clearer in the Belvedere kit, and as you point out, the extra windows, so in some cases they are doing what you want, just not maybe with the exact parts you want.  And in some other cases, such as the "Custom" version of Revell's '50 Olds, almost all of the stock version parts are still in the Custom version kit so with that one, you get plenty of extra parts that allow a lot of kitbashing as well.  

I understand that this probably sounds like corporate you know what, but sometimes it is easy to forget that these kits must still turn a profit in order for the kitmakers to have a successful enterprise, and that means a number of carefully managed tradeoffs along the way.....TB  

The parts I was thinking of are the automatic power brake pedal assembly, and the console, it looked to me as though those parts were simply blocked off on the Belvedere trees, and there just might be someone who would put a Hemi with a torqueflite into the kit and want to make it with a console instead of a column shift, or aftermarket shifter, you know how those young street guys are.