What it's like to be an engineer dealing with "normal" people...

[Ace-Garageguy]

...especially if they're "management" or "marketing".

 

Edited September 1, 2017 by Ace-Garageguy

[Jantrix]

As a technician I have a different perspective when dealing with engineers.

It's hard to deal sometimes with folks who were never taught the term tech-friendly in their fancy college and with whom five pounds in a three pound sack is seen as a design challenge.

[Ace-Garageguy]

As a technician I have a different perspective when dealing with engineers.

It's hard to deal sometimes with folks who were never taught the term tech-friendly in their fancy college and with whom five pounds in a three pound sack is seen as a design challenge.

See Rob, the real problem is dealing with people who lack simple common sense, a usefully-wide knowledge-base, and any kind of logical approach to life....whether they were taught engineering in a "fancy college", got an MBA from a 3rd rate liberal arts school (or a Harvard equivalent), or somehow manage to pass as "technicians" when they're skill-free slackers.

Any "engineer" who sees putting 5 pounds of crapp in a 3-pound sack as a "design challenge" is lacking common sense (and I encounter the results frequently). Any manager or marketer who insists it's possible is equally foolish. And usually when the techs take something like that apart and put it back together, they make such a hash of it you end up just replacing the entire unit (because it never works again after it's been "repaired").

Every day, day in and day out, I often spend the majority of my time correcting "work" done by idiot techs, idiot engineers, all driven by idiot managers and marketing people.

My avatar reflects my usual mental state brought on by the current state of affairs in my particular sphere of influence, and why I'm quitting working for others upon completion of the three projects I'm running now. I've been told one-too-many times (by people who can't design, make or repair ANYTHING) that, because I'm the "expert", I need to figure a way to get 200 hours of work completed in 50, and on-budget, with no overtime or additional help.

I've decided to walk away and let THEM do it.   

 

 

Edited September 1, 2017 by Ace-Garageguy

[Impalow]

hahaha.. as an industrial designer working with marketing departments this hits home big time...   

Client-"We need the product to appeal to men and women equally"  

Me- "So it needs to appeal to everyone?"

Client- "no not everyone, just men and women"

Me- (slams face into desk)

 

In my 14 years.. this or something similar happens at least once a month.

[modelercarl]

Another post complaining about the capabilities of engineers from a pseudo engineer.  I spent 35 years in the engineering field (high production transfer machines for gas and diesel engine, drivetrain component production), staring as an apprentice "board rat" in a job shop in 1964.  I worked through all levels of engineering in many environments retiring as a Director of Engineering for the largest special machine builder in the world.

I have worked with engineering groups with 12 to 75 engineers, at all levels of education and experience, all of the major automotive manufacturers (world wide) and the 4 major diesel engine manufacturers.  Granted there are/were some who did not perform at the desired level, just as in any other work environment, but I can guarantee that these individuals were an insignificant minority and were either terminated or moved to work functions that did not have responsibility of any sort.

The video posted here is something dreamed up by COMEDY WRITERS (and not to go at it either), and has no relationship to the real world we live in.  Anyone who sees any relationship between this video and the real world is, in my opinion, suffering from low self esteem and grasping at anything to rationalize their own shortcomings.

[Dodge Driver]

The video certainly reflects the frustration I have felt in dealing with managers and engineers.

 Is it not possible for multiple opinions on this subject to be accurate? Everyone's experience is different.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Another post complaining about the capabilities of engineers from a pseudo engineer... Anyone who sees any relationship between this video and the real world is, in my opinion, suffering from low self esteem and grasping at anything to rationalize their own shortcomings.

"Pseudo engineer...low self-esteem...grasping at things to rationalize their own shortcomings"? Really? Here we go again with the personal insults and name calling. Gotta love it. Never fails. 

When you see fiascoes like GM's little ignition switch disaster (initially 800,000 recalls, possibly as many as 30 MILLION ultimately; $35 MILLION fine paid to the NHTSA; untold MILLIONS of $ in legal fees and judgments; $900 MILLION paid to the DOJ...wouldn't it have been cheaper to get the damm switch design right IN THE FIRST PLACE?) you just have to wonder about the "group competence" of some engineering / management.staffs. (source:   https://www.consumersafety.org/products/gm-ignition-switches/)

AND PLEASE NOTE: I said SOME. Many engineers are wizards and have my undying respect and admiration. Many are CYA fools.

And since your comprehension as to what the video is about seems to miss the mark somewhat, here's some free help to understand. It's about the frustration that engineers feel when having to deal with unreasonable, logic-free non-engineers and others lacking any technical knowledge or skill...and people who THINK they have it and don't.

Edited September 1, 2017 by Ace-Garageguy

[10thumbs]

My take on engineers is that I have absolute respect for their academic achievements.  I'm a master technician in Germany.  The most respected profession in this country is that of an engineer.  second is the master tech/craftsman.  Fact.

I know several, and have had numerous opportunities to deal with them job and privately.

A cool group my opinion.  Humble, knowledgeable and quite open, and always ready for ideas and talk.

Maybe that's the difference between here and US?

[Ace-Garageguy]

My take on engineers is that I have absolute respect for their academic achievements.  I'm a master technician in Germany.  The most respected profession in this country is that of an engineer.  second is the master tech/craftsman.  Fact.

I know several, and have had numerous opportunities to deal with them job and privately.

A cool group my opinion.  Humble, knowledgeable and quite open, and always ready for ideas and talk.

Maybe that's the difference between here and US?

I'm an engineer myself. Many of my friends are engineers and "master technicians". Nothing I've EVER said was intended to denigrate either profession as a whole. Engineers and skilled technical people ARE widely respected in the US as well.

At the same time, and unfortunately, over here, many professions that require rigorous study, in-depth-knowledge-and-skill, and unvarying commitment to doing quality work are viewed by much of the populace as the province of nerds and geeks with their noses in books (or in the air), and lacking all social skills.

AND...when engineers don't stand up for what they know is RIGHT, in the face of bean-counters and marketers and management lacking a technical background, and when technicians do sloppy, uncaring work...and there's a LOT of both in this country...both professions suffer great damage as to how they're perceived.

 

[Agent G]

See Rob, the real problem is dealing with people who lack simple common sense, a usefully-wide knowledge-base, and any kind of logical approach to life....whether they were taught engineering in a "fancy college", got an MBA from a 3rd rate liberal arts school (or a Harvard equivalent), or somehow manage to pass as "technicians" when they're skill-free slackers.

Any "engineer" who sees putting 5 pounds of crapp in a 3-pound sack as a "design challenge" is lacking common sense (and I encounter the results frequently). Any manager or marketer who insists it's possible is equally foolish. And usually when the techs take something like that apart and put it back together, they make such a hash of it you end up just replacing the entire unit (because it never works again after it's been "repaired").

Every day, day in and day out, I often spend the majority of my time correcting "work" done by idiot techs, idiot engineers, all driven by idiot managers and marketing people.

My avatar reflects my usual mental state brought on by the current state of affairs in my particular sphere of influence, and why I'm quitting working for others upon completion of the three projects I'm running now. I've been told one-too-many times (by people who can't design, make or repair ANYTHING) that, because I'm the "expert", I need to figure a way to get 200 hours of work completed in 50, and on-budget, with no overtime or additional help.

I've decided to walk away and let THEM do it.   

 

 

It's scary really, if you substitute "police manager" for "engineer" in the above, you have a close approximation to my world.

G

[Foxer]

I am a Structural Engineer and owned a 50 person consulting firm for 30 years. I consider myself a "practical engineer". The contractors all came to me with problems because I talked to everyone and choose the best idea or mixture thereof.

The people most of you mention just have no Common Sense ... it has nothing to do with their profession or degree of education.

[High octane]

I truly believe that some engineers got their degrees from LIONEL University.

[Foxer]

I truly believe that some engineers got their degrees from LIONEL University.

Yeah, some can't relate what they know to the real world, or Lionel either

[Snake45]

That video reminded me of an old saying: "Nothing is impossible to the man who doesn't have to actually do it."

[Rob Hall]

As a software engineer, it is often difficult dealing with normals.  Non-technical people on the management, marketing etc sides of clients I've worked at often have unrealistic and vague demands on product requirements, delivery schedules, costs, etc...many of the challenges of the profession aren't on the technical side but in managing expectations and communicating clearly with non-technical resources. 

 

Edited September 2, 2017 by Rob Hall

[MrObsessive]

LOL! That video was actually pretty good!

You'd be surprised though how confused people get where I work when I try to explain the difference between "parallel" and "perpendicular"!

[Xingu]

I had to explain parallel and perpendicular to a guy once. I used cars as an analogy. "You are parallel when driving side by side down the highway. You are perpendicular when that son of a gun ran a stop sign and T-boned you."

I agree, lack of common sense causes a lot of problems. I know a lot of book smart folks that don't understand some of the simple, everyday, things that happen in life. Funny and sad at the same time.

[Modeltruckbuilder]

-

Edited December 27, 2017 by Modeltruckbuilder

[mikemodeler]

As a software engineer, it is often difficult dealing with normals.  Non-technical people on the management, marketing etc sides of clients I've worked at often have unrealistic and vague demands on product requirements, delivery schedules, costs, etc...many of the challenges of the profession aren't on the technical side but in managing expectations and communicating clearly with non-technical resources. 

 

Sounds like your life imitates the cartoon strip character Dilbert! 

[Rob Hall]

Sounds like your life imitates the cartoon strip character Dilbert! 

Many times over the years I've had the feeling Dilbert was written about my workplaces.  Too close to real sometimes.  

[espo]

I remember an old saying, "Book smart - Street dumb"  Just because someone has a "Higher Education" doesn't always mean they know what they're talking about.  

[High octane]

I remember an old saying, "Book smart - Street dumb"  Just because someone has a "Higher Education" doesn't always mean they know what they're talking about.  

You are SO right about that.

[mikemodeler]

I remember an old saying, "Book smart - Street dumb"  Just because someone has a "Higher Education" doesn't always mean they know what they're talking about.  

One of my Mom's favorite quote! I know many people who fall into this category, some of them are relatives! 

[Tom Geiger]

I'm a consultant.

I am brought into a project once the deadline has passed and the budget is overspent.  I'm expected to complete the one year project in three months, with zero funding, while the idiot who screwed it up in the first place fights me all the way.  And once I make it successful, the idiot gets the credit for his year end goals.

 

[Snake45]

I'm a consultant.

I am brought into a project once the deadline has passed and the budget is overspent.  I'm expected to complete the one year project in three months, with zero funding, while the idiot who screwed it up in the first place fights me all the way.  And once I make it successful, the idiot gets the credit for his year end goals.

 

Ah, but are you paid well--very, VERY well, I hope--for this?