Flocking questions

[iamsuperdan]

5 hours ago, Plowboy said:

This is the most recent that I have photos of. The rest are in Photobucket.  I've only done 3 or four with future. What I like about the future is I get more consistent results. With the glue method, I would get thick and thin spots. What I like about the baking soda is virtually no buildup which is nice when doing the bottom of door panels.

*blue interior pic*

Okay, that's not bad at all. A little more scale appropriate.

2 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

One thing to keep in mind is that while using a spray paint or spray adhesive may work well with today's modern kit "platform style" interior floors, it doesn't work quite so well with a tub interior.

It may require a lot more masking than most guys are going to want to attempt.

Even if you're carpeting other parts like door panels, seat backs, console sides, etc, spray adhesives and spray paint can be far more trouble than it's worth.

 

Just an observation to keep in mind what kind of configuration you're dealing with.

 

 

Steve

Yeah, I don't think I'll be doing any spray adhesives, but I am going to experiment with some of these techniques.

 

Went to Michael's earlier. All the embossing powder was glittery. Sparkly black just won't cut it.

 

 

[StevenGuthmiller]

1 hour ago, iamsuperdan said:

Went to Michael's earlier. All the embossing powder was glittery. Sparkly black just won't cut it.

I tried to do some checking around to see if I could find one of the "Hampton Art" embossing powder sets that I bought several years ago, but didn't have much luck.

Try "hamptonart.com".

They show the set that I have, and a "basics" set on their website, but it appears that you cannot order directly from them.

The website has one of those stupid "store finder" functions.

 

Walmart appears to have lots of individual jars of embossing powders on-line, as does ebay, but I'm having a difficult time locating any of these sets.

 

I paid around $15.00 for this set several years ago, and there is enough powder to do a lot of builds if you conserve.

 

See if you can dig them up somewhere.

 

 

Steve

 

[stitchdup]

I get my flocking from a 1/1 rally car place. Its shorter (1/2 mm for the longest strands) than the modelling stuff and comes in half kilo bags for the same price as one model brand tube. I also use suede effect nail art stuff as there are literally 100s of colour shades to choose from but those packs are small so sometimes it needs 2 for a carpet. I also dont use glue or future for sticking it. I use humbrol gloss enamels brushed on slightly thick, seive the flock over it heavy then pat it down a little after a couple of hours and add more over the top, then the next day I knock the excess off and it seems to work for me. The other benefit with the rally stuff is it mixes easily for custom colours

[StevenGuthmiller]

8 hours ago, stitchdup said:

 I use humbrol gloss enamels brushed on slightly thick

This is another point that needs repeating for those who wish to try paint for an adhesive.

Be certain to use a very slow drying paint such as a gloss enamel.

A faster drying paint such as a flat enamel or some acrylics and lacquers may not leave enough working time to allow for the flocking process.

If the paint begins to flash over in areas before the flocking or embossing powder can be applied, you will wind up with a god awful splotchy mess!

 

Also remember that if you happen upon a problem and you are using a paint such as gloss enamel for your adhesive, it may not be particularly easy to start over again depending on the situation.

This is why I like the Elmer's glue method.

If you are applying powder or flocking to a part that is already painted and/or detailed, and you encounter a problem, it's easy to remove the glue with a little water so you won't mess up your prior work.

 

 

 

Steve

Edited August 28, 2019 by StevenGuthmiller

[CabDriver]

I’m with Steve on the Elmer’s - our local Walgreens had a back to school special on all the varieties a couple of weeks ago so I picked up the clear and purple (goes on purple, dries clear) varieties to see if any of the other varieties work any better than the white stuff (which admittedly works pretty well for me anyway)

[alan barton]

I too am a big fan of a thick coat of Humbrol gloss enamel before flocking.  I did have a problem with one manufacturer of flock, as discussed in my 32 Phaeton thread, and a bath in caustic soda overnight fixed that and let me start again.

One thing I seem to do differently to everyone else is that I put my tub in a small takeaway food container, dump the flock onto the painted tub or parts, put the lid on the container and do some shake and bake.   This method has always, like for forty years or more, given me a smooth even finish. I have no problems with waste because all the excess is in the takeaway container waiting to be used next time.

I have only just started using embossing powder and I like it also.   My "shake and bake" technique works just as well with the powder.

Great to see so many interesting and positive responses to Dan's enquiry - that's why i like this place so much!

Cheers

Alan

[Tom Geiger]

A few thoughts as I read through all the posts:

1.  Be careful of baking soda. It has a sodium / salt content that will absorb moisture from humidity.  Early on I was instructed to use it for grit in my rust. I later noticed some of those rust spots getting a damp appearance when humidity was high.  Better off using something inert.

2. Either flocking or embossing powders... Do not do this in your regular work area where you do fine finishing!  This stuff can get into everything.  I do mine far away from my normal area.

3. With flocking, I have found that once it's complete, static electricity can attract individual loose fibers and I've found them on the seats and worse, on the inside of my kit glass.  I found that once it's dry, I've given it a spray of hair spray to hold it in place.

I have a concern with embossing powders although I don't know of anyone who has had this issue.  Their main purpose is to be used with embossing / laminating machines to create a raised image. So they are designed to melt with heat.  I just don't know how much heat!

Here's an example of something created with embossing powders. It sticks to ink or toner and  melts into place with heat.

 

[StevenGuthmiller]

31 minutes ago, Tom Geiger said:

2. Either flocking or embossing powders... Do not do this in your regular work area where you do fine finishing!  This stuff can get into everything.  I do mine far away from my normal area.

I do my carpet, (with embossing powder) right at my normal work space, (but then again, I'm a slob) and I really don't have a problem with it getting into everything.

Embossing powder is made up of very small granules that are relatively heavy and unlike flocking, it doesn't become airborne.

The remnants just fall onto your work surface, and as long as you're working over a piece of paper or the like to save the leftovers, once you have poured the remainder back into the receptacle, you shouldn't have any issue with anything left floating around.

 

48 minutes ago, Tom Geiger said:

I have a concern with embossing powders although I don't know of anyone who has had this issue.  Their main purpose is to be used with embossing / laminating machines to create a raised image. So they are designed to melt with heat.  I just don't know how much heat!

I have done a minimal amount of research on this subject and according to information that I have found on a couple of different sites, embossing powder melts at somewhere between 200 and 300 degrees Fahrenheit.

If any of your finished models are exposed to these kinds of temperatures, there are going to be more problems than just the embossing powder melting.

 

53 minutes ago, Tom Geiger said:

1.  Be careful of baking soda. It has a sodium / salt content that will absorb moisture from humidity.  Early on I was instructed to use it for grit in my rust. I later noticed some of those rust spots getting a damp appearance when humidity was high.  Better off using something inert.

I have also heard of and seen the consequences of using baking soda for modeling applications.

Moisture will indeed affect it.

It will basically swell up and explode if the humidity becomes too high.

 

 

 

 

Steve

[Bucky]

This has turned out to be a very informative thread! I appreciate all the tips and techniques that have been shared, here. Even though I have been building since 1963, I still learn new things nearly on a daily basis!!

 

Thanks to all!

[Plowboy]

Baking soda can't absorb anything once it's been sealed with primer and paint. All of my models are in display cases in my garage where they're exposed to temperature changes from as low as 40 to as high as 96 along with humidity. If anything were going to happen, it would have by now.

[StevenGuthmiller]

1 hour ago, Plowboy said:

Baking soda can't absorb anything once it's been sealed with primer and paint. All of my models are in display cases in my garage where they're exposed to temperature changes from as low as 40 to as high as 96 along with humidity. If anything were going to happen, it would have by now.

You might be right, but here is evidence of what can happen when you use the "Baking Soda and Super Glue" trick for body filler.

I'm not sure that I would want to chance using baking soda for anything on my builds after seeing this.

 

But I suppose if it's working for you, party on!

 

 

Steve

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Bucky]

Hmmmmm.....I have used baking soda and super glue for filler before. I'll check on it, and see if any problems have popped up......if I can remember which build I used it on.

I saw the mention of baby powder, but wouldn't most any powder tend to soak up moisture?

[Plowboy]

2 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

You might be right, but here is evidence of what can happen when you use the "Baking Soda and Super Glue" trick for body filler.

 

Well, I don't use baking soda and super glue. So, I don't think I'll have that problem.  

Besides, there's no way of knowing exactly what caused that issue. Could've been the primer, paint, who knows? Builders have been using that concoction for decades. If it happened frequently, it would be common knowledge. That's the first time I've seen that happen. 

[randyc]

I will second the cautions about using flocking and perhaps the powders in the same area as finishing.   And NEVER use either of these BEFORE airbrushing something you want nice.   They will find a way into your pristine paint.   With either product, the thing is to get a variation in texture, so even if hte flocking does appear a bit out of scale, from a distance, it will work.  

I use old chip dip containers to recover extra.   I paint, apply over the container so excess falls back into the container.   I usually just leave the part in the container till dry, shake it off again, then can squeeze the plastic tub to make a spout to pour back into the original container.   Works for me but I do like the leftove carry out container idea as well.  

I save all resealable food containers.   I generally use one per kit to hold the small parts in one place as I go through paint and assembly.   

[iamsuperdan]

I do everything on my bench. Flocking, fine finishing, whatever. Just never at the same time. And I always clean up; wipe things down, put things away. It's a very neat workspace, I'm borderline OCD about that stuff. 

i did some practice last night on some sheet styrene. Tried white glue, watered down white glue, paint, and some spray adhesive. Is used my normal flocking method, and some three times sifted flocking to make sure it was as powdery as could be. 

Again, in all cases, the black turned out perfect. They grey and tan were blotchy. All from the same brand, all done at the same time. 

What the flock.

 

I'll be ramping up my search for embossing powder over the weekend. Definitely need a solution. The Boxster on my bench needs grey carpet!

 

 

[StevenGuthmiller]

7 hours ago, iamsuperdan said:

I'll be ramping up my search for embossing powder over the weekend. Definitely need a solution. The Boxster on my bench needs grey carpet!

Give it a try.

I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

 

I even use the embossing powder for hood insulation, although this might be one case where flocking might look better.

 

 

Steve

 

[ChrisBcritter]

On 8/28/2019 at 2:55 AM, stitchdup said:

I get my flocking from a 1/1 rally car place. Its shorter (1/2 mm for the longest strands) than the modelling stuff and comes in half kilo bags for the same price as one model brand tube... The other benefit with the rally stuff is it mixes easily for custom colours

Interesting. What brand is it? Is it available in the USA?

[stitchdup]

On 8/31/2019 at 6:24 AM, ChrisBcritter said:

Interesting. What brand is it? Is it available in the USA?

I'm not sure if its available in the states but this is where i get it      https://www.theflockingshop.co.uk/index.asp?gclid=Cj0KCQjw2K3rBRDiARIsAOFSW_54ep4QdvXWhHXYlmYi3EDSrERvgIjiYLkMDTYiWa3MhLrjEUv8BNsaAh9REALw_wcB