Rustoleum paints are terrible.

[James Maynard]

You guys are right about Krylon too. It's just as bad if not worse than Rustoleum. It say at the top of every can. No drips, no runs, no errors. But that's all lies from them. I've got one can of Krylon that is the worst can of paint I've ever seen. It runs like water and if it does bond to anything in some miracle it's a very thin coat. And if I spray back over it with the SAME can of paint, it wrinkles up every time. 

[BlackSheep214]

39 minutes ago, ranma said:

The last couple of cans of Rust-Olium took a long long time to dry! it was still tacky well over a week& 1/2! Some on here say that Krylon is garbage, But I've never had an issue with their Short cuts craft & hobby paints. Now the only issue with getting the short cuts is it's been hard to get due to some supply chain issues that hasn't seemed to have affected Rust-Oliums BLAH_BLAH_BLAH_BLAH paint's. There is one thing I agree with though is that the primer/paint mixed paints are bad. Be it from either Krylon of rust olium, and I'm sure it's not just me but it seems that it dulls their normally glossy paints.

Well... if sprayed on heavily yeah, it's gonna take a long time to dry. I've always follow the several thin coats rule when using Rustoleum paints or not.

I've been using Rustoleum All in One for a few years now and never had an issue with them. Maybe those who used them had a bad batch. I never buy the regular Rustoleum rattle cans. But hey... each to his own.

I guess it's because of my decades of knowing how to tame the animal of Rustoleum rattlecans. 

[ranma]

1 hour ago, BlackSheep214 said:

Well... if sprayed on heavily yeah

Well I learned how to lay paint by a man who did so to provide for his family. My late father was a paint expert who worked for IH/Navistar for 30 years in which 28 years in the paint department. So with that being said I dont lay paint on thick when painting any models. I'm fairly sure I am not the only one that has had the tacky rust-o;ium paint issues.  IH's Metallic emerald green paint was a pita according to him as it always had issues in one way or another. This '63 Nova wagon was painted with all Krylon short cuts paints. Rose gold, gloss white, Clear coat, Flat black chassis 

Edited January 20, 2023 by ranma

[KWT]

I've used it for a couple cars here and there, because of the variety of colors.... but only a one and done type deal.

They are either entirely too thin... or I can get one session out of it and the can never sprays again.

Anymore the only success I have is with the Ultra Matte stuff and it's limited.

I agree with @ranma it takes forever for the glossy stuff to get past the tacky phase.

Edited January 21, 2023 by KWT

[Mark]

16 hours ago, ranma said:

Well I learned how to lay paint by a man who did so to provide for his family. My late father was a paint expert who worked for IH/Navistar for 30 years in which 28 years in the paint department. So with that being said I dont lay paint on thick when painting any models. I'm fairly sure I am not the only one that has had the tacky rust-o;ium paint issues.  IH's Metallic emerald green paint was a pita according to him as it always had issues in one way or another. This '63 Nova wagon was painted with all Krylon short cuts paints. Rose gold, gloss white, Clear coat, Flat black chassis 

Looks great!  The Short Cuts sprays aren't like typical "big can" Krylon sprays, they are more like Testors and Pactra used to be, straight hobby enamels.

[junkyardjeff]

I have been having the paint check after giving it a second coat even after letting it dry.

[peteski]

20 hours ago, junkyardjeff said:

I have been having the paint check after giving it a second coat even after letting it dry.

What does that mean?

[junkyardjeff]

55 minutes ago, peteski said:

What does that mean?

The paint started cracking like it was reacting to a different type of paint even though it was another coat of the same paint.

[peteski]

Ah, check/crack.  Makes sense now.  Thanks.

[Mark]

The  solvent in the top coat is starting to dissolve, and break into, the coats previously applied.

[Rodent]

I used some 2X yesterday on a piece of styrofoam board and it dissolved it.

On the other hand, their aluminum is one of my favorites. Who knows?

[StevenGuthmiller]

1 hour ago, Mark said:

The  solvent in the top coat is starting to dissolve, and break into, the coats previously applied.

That’s what a “good” paint should do.

That’s why I use lacquer. ?

 

 

Steve

Edited January 24, 2023 by StevenGuthmiller

[Chariots of Fire]

Rustoleum paints are the worst you can use in model painting.  It's too thick, doesn't spray finely and takes forever to adequately dry.  Try Duplicolor or some of the new Tamiya model paints. Real good success with both.  

[RickRollerLT1]

Funny enough, I've had mostly good results with Rustoluem. I have had bad batches in the past, but those were ether really old cans never used until then or came from places like Home Depot and K-Marts. Depending on temperatures, one needs to let the cans heat up in near-boiling water in a bucket for about 15 mins and shake each can for about 20-50 secs.

One needs to be very careful with versions out there, there as they're not the same formulas. The cans with "universal" "metallic" "color shift" and standard "stops rust" formulas I use all the time. They work very well with the True Value grey primer and cheap Home Depot sprays underneath, and Tamiya pearls go over them real nicely. They have "very hot" solvents and will craze direct unprimed plastic without a good primer. Rustoluem's primers OTOH, are all horrendous! They ripple, crack, bubble like mad as well as craze styrene! I once stripped a body that someone else painted with a Rustoluem white primer coat. I thought the stuff was super tough and the Purple Pond wasn't taking it off, until I realized I the pond was lighter in color and I was hitting the bare plastic that took a real beating from the hot Rustoluem primer.

The Rustoleum Painter's Touch and 2x Ultra Cover cans are usable, but DO NOT PUT THEM OVER ANY PRIMER COAT as they'll attack the solvents and ripple/crack the surface. This makes using the gloss colors nearly impossible as depending on the thickness of plastic, the solvents from the combined formula will wreck havoc and sometimes even dissolve the weakest spots of the styrene! Best to use the PC/2x flat/satin colors on interiors and non-glossy parts as those work really well and most of the time the crazing is non-existent or minimal.

Edited January 24, 2023 by RickRollerLT1

[RickRollerLT1]

In fact, heres my most recent finished build, using True Value brand Grey primer underneath, Home Depot brand Flat and Gloss Black, followed by a coat of Rustoleum Color Shift Pink Champagne cleared with Pledge. The interior used Rustoluem Painters Touch Flat Pimento Red over the bare plastic.

Using budget rattle cans and mixing brands underneath can be done, as long as the primer coat is good enough and doesn't craze the plastic. Thats what matters in the end.

 

BTW, Rustoluem's clears are all abysmal too! Fogging, running, bubbling, you name it! 

Edited January 24, 2023 by RickRollerLT1

[peteski]

18 hours ago, RickRollerLT1 said:

Using budget rattle cans and mixing brands underneath can be done, as long as the primer coat is good enough and doesn't craze the plastic. Thats what matters in the end.

Not just the primer Richard.  Some different paint brands or types (like the old lacquer over enamel thing) are just not compatible, and can wrinkle or crack when used together.

[StevenGuthmiller]

1 hour ago, peteski said:

Not just the primer Richard.  Some different paint brands or types (like the old lacquer over enamel thing) are just not compatible, and can wrinkle or crack when used together.

There’s a lot of really scary stuff that can happen when you start mixing all kinds of weird primers, paints and clears, yet for some reason that I still can’t quite comprehend, people continue to do it over and over again.

It gets pretty old seeing countless post after post on varying forums and social media of paint jobs that have gone south because someone insists upon using the same......you know what, paint.

I’m still trying to figure out if there are really that many novice painters, or just a lot of slow learners! ?

 

 

 

 

Steve

[bobthehobbyguy]

Manufacturers have paint systems. The primer , color, and clear coats are designed to be compatible. With one manufacturer you are given recoat times for when to respray.

You may get away occasionally with mixing paints but eventually it's going to go south.

Also model paints are designed to be friendly with the kit plastics. Paint formulas change and plastic formulas change and there is no guarantee that the paints will play nice.

[RickRollerLT1]

3 hours ago, peteski said:

Not just the primer Richard.  Some different paint brands or types (like the old lacquer over enamel thing) are just not compatible, and can wrinkle or crack when used together.

2 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

There’s a lot of really scary stuff that can happen when you start mixing all kinds of weird primers, paints and clears, yet for some reason that I still can’t quite comprehend, people continue to do it over and over again.

It gets pretty old seeing countless post after post on varying forums and social media of paint jobs that have gone south because someone insists upon using the same......you know what, paint.

I’m still trying to figure out if there are really that many novice painters, or just a lot of slow learners! ?

 

 

 

 

Steve

2 hours ago, bobthehobbyguy said:

Manufacturers have paint systems. The primer , color, and clear coats are designed to be compatible. With one manufacturer you are given recoat times for when to respray.

You may get away occasionally with mixing paints but eventually it's going to go south.

Also model paints are designed to be friendly with the kit plastics. Paint formulas change and plastic formulas change and there is no guarantee that the paints will play nice.

That is true, but if one experiments with a method like I have, it can be done safely. I have tried using the same brands paint method before and they ether were very rough or crazed like mad and that was with sanding in-between and all that!

The reason why there's stories of paint job mixing "going south" is because ppl ether tend to use pure super hot lacquers or auto grade stuff directly on styrene without primer, or they mix and match softer stuff like Testors/hobby grade paints as base coats/primers and lastly hit it with heavier lacquer/acyclic stuff which spells big trouble. Rustoluem paints and primers are 100% Enamel, but if the primer is Rustoluem and you put say Krylon or Duplicolor on top of it you will get problems. The Enamel-Lacquers for primers I use take any top coats well enough and certain ones I found don't react to the plastic (and that depends on the molding and how opaque it is in itself).

I found an unused can of Tamiya Grey primer and tried it on an experiment hood. Had an extremely rough finish and it also attacked some parts of the hood. After a week of it curing I had sanded it and sprayed another round, it wrinkled and cracked like mad! This one I get at True Value is def Enamel-Lacquer, though it doesn't exactly say it. Works well, goes on smooth, no crazing on most plastics, almost no sanding required. Better than the Rustoluem and Krylon primers which were junk, and a Duplicolor primer which badly reacted with the styrene.

I use other store brand Flat and Gloss colors for the base coats, most of them work well with no reactions. This line for example

Then I hit the final color coat choice with an arrangement of Rustoluem, Testors One-Coat (which is also Enamel-Lacquer), Tamiya, and occasionally Krylon.

Some Krylons are Enamel-Lacquers, others are pure Acrylic. The Krylon Acrylics can occasionally cause cracking/wrinkling if the Enamel-Lacquer base coats aren't dry enough. Tamiya is supposedly Acrylic-Lacquer, but I've used it over Rustoluem base coats all the time and very rarely had issues, unless I rushed it and never let the bases thoroughly dry enough.

As mentioned, the Rustoleum Painter's Touch and 2x Ultra Cover cans have primer built-in and can wreck havoc with the base primer coats even if they're Duplicolor or Tamiya. This makes using the 2x gloss colors nearly impossible as depending on the thickness of plastic, the solvents from the combined formula will wreck havoc and sometimes even dissolve the weakest spots of the styrene! Best to use those flat/satin colors on interiors and non-glossy parts as they work really well and most of the time the crazing is non-existent or minimal.

Keep in mind I do all my coats at one go with 10-15 min intervals between painting other parts. I don't wait long days and sand in-between as 13-yr old me used to do that when using Testors rattle cans exclusively and had countless issues. I only pre-sand bodies and parts meant to be glossy, and there's rarely any pre-washing done (unless there's thick grease coatings as on some recent kits). I also use Pledge/Future/whatever it's called as I had bad experiences with rattle can clears.

In the event something goes wrong for me, the Purple Pond works wonders taking the Enamel-Lacquers and Tamiya top coats off. Sometimes I use 91% rubbing Alcohol and 8% Testors Paint Thinner to get paints that the PP won't budge or tight spots it can't take odd. 

I litterally just finished painting two AMT Piranhas. The Spy Car version using CD Grey primer, Rustoluem Flat and Gloss White base coats, then Rustoluem Orange, followed by a mist coat of Tamiya Pearl Yellow over the Orange to create a Pearl Tangerine. The Drag Car used CD Grey primer, Quick Color Flat Black base, Rustoluem Metallic Gold base coat, followed by Tamiya Candy Lime Green over it. Both look Immaculate and super smooth with no crazing/OP/wrinkling.

Call me strange, but this what I find works and get nearly flawless results each time.

[Dpate]

28 minutes ago, RickRollerLT1 said:

Tamiya Grey primer and tried it on an experiment hood. Had an extremely rough finish and it also attacked some parts of the hood. After a week of it curing I had sanded it and sprayed another round, it wrinkled and cracked like mad!

I'm gonna go on a limb and say you sprayed it completely wrong or bad can. Tamiya likes to go on wet cause it self levels, but you build up too that.  Light coats and than the last coat wet coat. Should self level and dry super smooth and than hit with 3K grit paper for even smoother finish. 

[RickRollerLT1]

1 hour ago, Dpate said:

I'm gonna go on a limb and say you sprayed it completely wrong or bad can. Tamiya likes to go on wet cause it self levels, but you build up too that.  Light coats and than the last coat wet coat. Should self level and dry super smooth and than hit with 3K grit paper for even smoother finish. 

This was on a Round 2 issue Knight Rider hood. As I said, the surface was not only extremely rough but crazing clearly happened. Even with respraying and sanding it was still there with the wrinkling and all. The can I bought in November 2021 at the LHS and was new sealed. I have 15 year old cans of various brands and those work fine to this day. I've heard people using the TS grey and white fine primers in the past and and getting phenomenal results. Ether I had a batch that was made under "COVID regulations", the versions sold here had the formula silently changed to "comply with Callifailna ARB emissions", or the hood was a really lousy mold and anything reacts to it. Reguardless, was very disappointed since that was a premium product costing 16.99 USD!

With my spraying setup I always with do mist sprays at a distance for the color/paint to "bite in" and self level. After about 1 min I do a heavier coat to ensure basic coverage in all gaps/creases, then after 2 mins I hit it off with one heavy wet coat. I get excellent results this way and even with the cheaper paints they stay super smooth even dried. I do all my coats in one go and don't sand in-between. From my past experiences, sanding in-between coats regardless of using the same brand, how long it dried, caused major headaches and throwing fits. Sometimes there will be rough/flatter surfaces and those get taken care of with toothpaste and Pledge.

[Dpate]

8 minutes ago, RickRollerLT1 said:

This was on a Round 2 issue Knight Rider hood. As I said, the surface was not only extremely rough but crazing clearly happened. Even with respraying and sanding it was still there with the wrinkling and all. The can I bought in November 2021 at the LHS and was new sealed. I have 15 year old cans of various brands and those work fine to this day. I've heard people using the TS grey and white fine primers in the past and and getting phenomenal results. Ether I had a batch that was made under "COVID regulations", the versions sold here had the formula silently changed to "comply with Callifailna ARB emissions", or the hood was a really lousy mold and anything reacts to it. Reguardless, was very disappointed since that was a premium product costing 16.99 USD!

With my spraying setup I always with do mist sprays at a distance for the color/paint to "bite in" and self level. After about 1 min I do a heavier coat to ensure basic coverage in all gaps/creases, then after 2 mins I hit it off with one heavy wet coat. I get excellent results this way and even with the cheaper paints they stay super smooth even dried. I do all my coats in one go and don't sand in-between. From my past experiences, sanding in-between coats regardless of using the same brand, how long it dried, caused major headaches and throwing fits. Sometimes there will be rough/flatter surfaces and those get taken care of with toothpaste and Pledge.

Could of been the plastic.  I have heard of tamiya changing up there formula, but i never had any trouble the times I've used it.  My #1 go to primer though is Mr.Surfacer 1200 & 1500 & Mr leveling thinner that's the ultimate combo no reason to use any other primer least for me.  I'm more a airbrush guy though, always decant the cans if i get tamiya etc. 

[slusher]

I have use Krylon short cuts flat black for years on chassis and interiors never a problem.  I like that it dries to a almost satin finish.  If I use Rustoleum  it’s a satin and not the primer and paint all in one. The Rustoleum I have is in short cans called American Accents not made any more. I rarely use my old Rustoliun.  I use Tamiya paint and primer mostly.

Edited January 25, 2023 by slusher
Spelling

[BlackSheep214]

On 1/23/2023 at 9:31 PM, RickRollerLT1 said:

The Rustoleum Painter's Touch and 2x Ultra Cover cans are usable, but DO NOT PUT THEM OVER ANY PRIMER COAT as they'll attack the solvents and ripple/crack the surface. 

This....

 

[doorsovdoon]

I've found Rustoleum to be very fussy paints these days. Rustoleum used to be great back in the day, though the name has always been regarded as a heavy duty outdoor paint here in the UK. It was a universal name when saying you were going to paint something, 'Chuck some Rustoleum on it' ...like saying I'm going to 'Hoover' the carpet.