why have new cars gotten so expensive 1:1 scale

[youpey]

i hope this is ok to discuss on a modelling site, but it seems to me cars/trucks prices have gotten so high these days

in 2012 i bought a brand new gmc sierra 1500, 4x4 5.2L V8 and it cost around 28000. Like a dummy I traded it in for a car and that car didnt work out for me.  i am looking again to buy another GMC, however the same exact configuration i had in 2012, is now 37000.  That is 9000 dollars higher in just 6 years.

I looked at other cars and trucks, the Chevy Colorado V6 4x4 is about 31000, which is still higher than my sierra, but its a much smaller truck.  Its not just chevy/GMC either, the ford f150 for the V8 4x4 is over 37000 when it was about the 29000 or 30000 in 2012 with the same configuration. 

I am not adding a bunch of add-ons either with these configuration prices, just the V6 (or V8 if available) and 4x4 and power windows. I am not looking at getting the higher optioned trucks. 

So then i looked at cars, the average american car (not small cars, but regular sized cars) and they are all in the 26000 to 30000 dollar range too. 

I am sure it has been slowly building it up to the current prices, but it feels like new car prices are out of hand now. 

I suspect i will end up with a rear wheel drive truck instead of 4x4 because of the large price difference. I also feel the longer i wait to save up, the more it will cost.

the more i look at the prices, the more i wished i didnt get rid of my sierra. I was so stupid and i curse that day

[mikemodeler]

There has been a bunch more "stuff" added to new vehicles today that weren't on vehicles 5-8 years ago. Most cars have back up cameras, crash avoidance systems, improved fuel management systems, and other safety systems, some through government rules, that contribute to the cost. Add in good old marketing and the price gets pumped up only to give big discounts!

If you are serious about a GM truck, they are making deals on 2018 models as the new 2019's will be rolling in soon. Another option to consider is looking for a year or two old vehicle, with low mileage, that has already been depreciated by 25-30% while still having a lot of useful life left in it.With programs like Carfax, you can check a vehicle out a little better than in the past, taking the salesman's word that it was driven to church by a 90 year old great grandma!

 

[Snake45]

I've read (several times) that on a GM car (for example), $1500 or more of the purchase price goes to pay for health benefits for GM/UAW retirees.

[iamsuperdan]

Mike has it right!

 

Consumers demand more stuff in their vehicles, and the various governments and safety groups demand more features. So even today's base vehicles will come standard with AC, bluetooth, power windows/locks/mirrors, cruise, rear camera, traction assist, touch screen stereos, a dozen airbags, etc. Heck on a lot of cars, heated seats, remote starters, and LED lights are now standard. Just based on that alone the cost is going up. Combine that withthe increased demand for more fuel efficiency, more recyclable and renewable parts,  higher prices for steel and aluminum, plus the usually yearly inflation of 1-2% on a new vehicles, and it adds up to a vehicle $10k more expensive that it was less than 10 years ago.

 

As an FYI, the 2019 GMC/Chev trucks have been announced, but won't be arriving at dealers until August at the earliest. The order banks don't open until mid-April, and production is currently scheduled to start in June.  

[High octane]

Seems like everything has gone up in the past few years, except my income.

[SfanGoch]

21 minutes ago, mikemodeler said:

Most cars have back up cameras...

Humans have those as standard equipment mounted in a fully articulated, multi-directional housing. They're known as eyeballs. 

[Mark]

More regulations, more safety features, more convenience features, and everything is more complicated.  With more safety stuff, if you have a good driving record your insurance should be reasonable.  I switched out of a fourteen year old truck to a new car last fall...insurance went up less than $100 per year. 

Are you talking actual prices, or sticker prices?  Seems like GM in particular always has some sort of deal going where they're knocking about twenty percent off of the sticker.  Why they don't just price the thing at the actual selling price is beyond me.  "I got a $50,000 truck for a little under $42,000".  No you didn't, you got a $42,000 (if that) truck.  Thank Iacocca for those stupid rebates, they've been a noose around the neck of the domestic auto industry ever since. 

The second (and last) truck I bought was virtually identical to the first one...same truck, only sixteen years newer.  Short wheelbase, regular cab, two wheel drive, V6, stick.  Same color, even.  I paid right around $10,000 for the first one, in 1988.  The 2004 truck had power windows and air conditioning that the '88 lacked.  Sticker was just under $20,000.  Throw in two rebates that totaled $2,500, also the interest saved via zero percent financing, and a $1,000 or so discount on top of all that, and I figure I paid $15,000 or so in real money for that one.  Figure in sixteen years of inflation, and the A/C on the newer truck, and I'm thinking the newer one was actually a better deal. 

[youpey]

21 minutes ago, High octane said:

Seems like everything has gone up in the past few years, except my income.

i was going to say that as well. my wife and i were speaking about this, and i was in much better shape financially 10 years ago then i am today. the prices have increase exponentially more than my pay has. i made the mistake of not buying a house because i hate the state i live in and didnt want to stay, but here i am, still here with rent that goes up every year. my rent is 2x higher now vs my sister's mortgage. 

i guess i am just stupid when it comes to money

Edited March 29, 2018 by youpey

[Rob Hall]

Vehicles seem on average to have much more interior electronics and creature comforts, safety features, etc than 10-20 years ago.  My 1st Jeep was about $29k when I bought it in new 2000.  One the same trim level as my old one would be about $35k in 2018, but with way more equipment standard and more options available.  

The one I bought last year--the same model but one trim level higher---was about $45k new in 2014 (I bought it last year as a 3yr old CPO w/ 25k miles).    Way more equipment in the newer one.  And about 100 more horsepower, about the same gas mileage.  Larger, heavier, more goodies.  8spd vs. 4spd transmission. The old one had 2 airbags, the newer one 8 I think, etc. 

[High octane]

The newer vehicles have 40+ buttons and knobs on the dash while cars from the 60's have ten or less. And back in the 60's those cars got us around town and cross country just fine. Sure they were heavier and gas mileage was poorer, but if anything broke, it was mechanical. Today if something goes wrong it could be electronics or mechanical and always expensive to fix. They did away with massive chrome bumpers that gave us more protection than what the newer cars of today offer. I somehow don't see the logic of all the new technology and gadgets in the cars of today or the awful styling either if that's what you want to call these oversized jellybean lookin' cars.

[MeatMan]

28 minutes ago, Mark said:

More regulations, more safety features, more convenience features, and everything is more complicated.  With more safety stuff, if you have a good driving record your insurance should be reasonable.  I switched out of a fourteen year old truck to a new car last fall...insurance went up less than $100 per year. 

Are you talking actual prices, or sticker prices?  Seems like GM in particular always has some sort of deal going where they're knocking about twenty percent off of the sticker.  Why they don't just price the thing at the actual selling price is beyond me.  "I got a $50,000 truck for a little under $42,000".  No you didn't, you got a $42,000 (if that) truck.  Thank Iacocca for those stupid rebates, they've been a noose around the neck of the domestic auto industry ever since. 

The second (and last) truck I bought was virtually identical to the first one...same truck, only sixteen years newer.  Short wheelbase, regular cab, two wheel drive, V6, stick.  Same color, even.  I paid right around $10,000 for the first one, in 1988.  The 2004 truck had power windows and air conditioning that the '88 lacked.  Sticker was just under $20,000.  Throw in two rebates that totaled $2,500, also the interest saved via zero percent financing, and a $1,000 or so discount on top of all that, and I figure I paid $15,000 or so in real money for that one.  Figure in sixteen years of inflation, and the A/C on the newer truck, and I'm thinking the newer one was actually a better deal. 

According to the inflation calculator I went to, if you paid $10K in 1988, then inflation makes it about $16K in 2004, so yes you paid about a grand less minus inflation for more truck!

Also consider guys about the rebates, folks nowadays want to feel they got a deal. Remember when Penneys dropped the discounts and reduced prices and lost customers. It's become the norm.

Edited March 29, 2018 by MeatMan

[espo]

1 hour ago, youpey said:

i hope this is ok to discuss on a modelling site, but it seems to me cars/trucks prices have gotten so high these days

in 2012 i bought a brand new gmc sierra 1500, 4x4 5.2L V8 and it cost around 28000. Like a dummy I traded it in for a car and that car didnt work out for me.  i am looking again to buy another GMC, however the same exact configuration i had in 2012, is now 37000.  That is 9000 dollars higher in just 6 years.

I looked at other cars and trucks, the Chevy Colorado V6 4x4 is about 31000, which is still higher than my sierra, but its a much smaller truck.  Its not just chevy/GMC either, the ford f150 for the V8 4x4 is over 37000 when it was about the 29000 or 30000 in 2012 with the same configuration. 

I am not adding a bunch of add-ons either with these configuration prices, just the V6 (or V8 if available) and 4x4 and power windows. I am not looking at getting the higher optioned trucks. 

So then i looked at cars, the average american car (not small cars, but regular sized cars) and they are all in the 26000 to 30000 dollar range too. 

I am sure it has been slowly building it up to the current prices, but it feels like new car prices are out of hand now. 

I suspect i will end up with a rear wheel drive truck instead of 4x4 because of the large price difference. I also feel the longer i wait to save up, the more it will cost.

the more i look at the prices, the more i wished i didnt get rid of my sierra. I was so stupid and i curse that day

I'm fine with your questions and agree with your price statements. You may or may not find this post being moved to the Off Topic Section of the Forum. But I wouldn't let that discourage you.

 

21 minutes ago, SfanGoch said:

Humans have those as standard equipment mounted in a fully articulated, multi-directional housing. They're known as eyeballs. 

There seems to be a very real problem with operator error with these devises.

 

19 minutes ago, Mark said:

More regulations, more safety features, more convenience features, and everything is more complicated.  With more safety stuff, if you have a good driving record your insurance should be reasonable.  I switched out of a fourteen year old truck to a new car last fall...insurance went up less than $100 per year. 

Are you talking actual prices, or sticker prices?  Seems like GM in particular always has some sort of deal going where they're knocking about twenty percent off of the sticker.  Why they don't just price the thing at the actual selling price is beyond me.  "I got a $50,000 truck for a little under $42,000".  No you didn't, you got a $42,000 (if that) truck.  Thank Iacocca for those stupid rebates, they've been a noose around the neck of the domestic auto industry ever since. 

The second (and last) truck I bought was virtually identical to the first one...same truck, only sixteen years newer.  Short wheelbase, regular cab, two wheel drive, V6, stick.  Same color, even.  I paid right around $10,000 for the first one, in 1988.  The 2004 truck had power windows and air conditioning that the '88 lacked.  Sticker was just under $20,000.  Throw in two rebates that totaled $2,500, also the interest saved via zero percent financing, and a $1,000 or so discount on top of all that, and I figure I paid $15,000 or so in real money for that one.  Figure in sixteen years of inflation, and the A/C on the newer truck, and I'm thinking the newer one was actually a better deal. 

You make an interesting suggestion about GM and pricing.  I spent over 25 years in the retail auto business and most of it in GM stores. In the '80's GM stride the pricing strategy that you suggested in the California Market. They didn't change the dealer invoice they just lowered the MSRP on the window sticker and told dealers that they were doing them a favor so that they would no longer have to negotiate the selling price. GM ran TV ads telling everyone about the good news and they should hurry done to buy their new cars and trucks. The problem was that people still thought somehow dealers were still making thousands of dollars on this cars and still insisted in "Horse Trading" just like always. Dealers profits suffered and customer relations went in the toilet. GM stopped the sales campaign  but never returned the dealer markup to what it once was.  

[Pete J.]

Trucks have become a real sore subject for me of late. I have been interested in a small truck for a while for household hauling.  A sheet of plywood or two, some 2X4s, a bag of dirt etc.  I had two Toyotas back in the 70's and they were perfect.  Small, fuel efficient, inexpensive and these were my daily drivers.  Well to cut to the chase, I have been looking for one like that, but they just don't exist anymore!  My car was in the shop for a while and Toyota rents cars and trucks so I rented their Tacoma.  It is the smallest truck Toyota has and it is huge!  I needed a stepladder to get  in.  It was so long it wouldn't fit in my garage, and it sucked gas like a hog.  In short, I hated it.  On top of that it had a base price of well over $30,000. Heck, I can get a really nice car for that, not a cheap weekend hauler, and as I said the thing is huge!  Nobody seems to make a compact truck anymore.  Everything is glitzed out, jacked up, option loaded.  If you look around on the roads out here in SoCal there are a ton of the old size pickups running around as small contractor work trucks, so I know the market exists.  Why is everyone ignoring it.  I just want a small inexpensive hauler.  Oh, and the older trucks on the used market go for as much as they cost new!  

Ok, I'll step off the soap box now. 

[espo]

While the price of new cars and trucks has gone up partly for new devices to compensate for the lack of the operators basic inability to safely operate a motor vehicle. There has been an increased cost of the materials used to build them and pay and other compensations for the labor force. On a personal side we are at a point were we are considering replacing one or two of our cars. The first is an '09 Jeep Sahara at 98K miles with all of the suspension and wheel and tire upgrades that we have done thru the years. New the basic Jeep, with everything you could get at that time on a Sahara was about $30k. The new '18 JL Jeep Rubicon that we want is now closing in on $50k, not going to happen just now. The second car is a '10 Dodge Charger RT with AWD with 89K miles. This also was just over $30K in 2010.  This has a two fold problem for us in that the AWD feature that we would really like to have can now only be had with the 6 Cylinder engine and I'm just not going there as we want at least another RT that even with no AWD is looking like $45K. Also to compare my Wife's '14 Dodge Avenger RT with all the bells and whistles cost as much as the '10 Charger when it was new. It would seem that automobiles along with all other products that are needed for day to day life keep going up and all to often the quality seems to be lacking and our incomes ? Well I hope you all are doing better than most people I know, my self included.

[espo]

13 minutes ago, Pete J. said:

Trucks have become a real sore subject for me of late. I have been interested in a small truck for a while for household hauling.  A sheet of plywood or two, some 2X4s, a bag of dirt etc.  I had two Toyotas back in the 70's and they were perfect.  Small, fuel efficient, inexpensive and these were my daily drivers.  Well to cut to the chase, I have been looking for one like that, but they just don't exist anymore!  My car was in the shop for a while and Toyota rents cars and trucks so I rented their Tacoma.  It is the smallest truck Toyota has and it is huge!  I needed a stepladder to get  in.  It was so long it wouldn't fit in my garage, and it sucked gas like a hog.  In short, I hated it.  On top of that it had a base price of well over $30,000. Heck, I can get a really nice car for that, not a cheap weekend hauler, and as I said the thing is huge!  Nobody seems to make a compact truck anymore.  Everything is glitzed out, jacked up, option loaded.  If you look around on the roads out here in SoCal there are a ton of the old size pickups running around as small contractor work trucks, so I know the market exists.  Why is everyone ignoring it.  I just want a small inexpensive hauler.  Oh, and the older trucks on the used market go for as much as they cost new!  

Ok, I'll step off the soap box now. 

You might consider a utility trailer if your loads are going to be around 1,000 lbs. or less. You would need a vehicle that could tow it, but this could even be a mid size or larger car. I went this way a few years ago when I realized that my truck was just a car with a big trunk. I purchased a 4' x 8' trailer with 4' sides and a tailgate that can turn into a ramp for loading our riding mower. Most of the time it just sits, but when I need to haul stuff I just hook it up to our Jeep and do what ever needs to be done. Just a thought since it is a lot less expensive than a truck.  I guess I should get off my soap box also.

[OldTrucker]

Sales of Pickups are at a historic high and that encourages the manufacturer to jack up prices too!

Of course one has to look at the size just a regular pickup has grown to!

The average body and height has grown to the point they are about equal to what the old 2 ton truck cabs were! That alone drives up costs which are passed on!

Even  1 or 2 year old (or older) HIGH mileage pickups are bringing premium prices right now!

[Greg Myers]

Have you priced a regular plastic model car latelly ?  $30 +

[cobraman]

The high prices are why they now offer that long term financing. Sorry, not this guy.

[89AKurt]

Lawyers, primary blame.  Second is the union, foreign countries don't have them to speak of.   Third is our government, intent on protecting us from ourselves.  Forth, inflation.  Order not set in concrete.

[Snake45]

1 hour ago, Greg Myers said:

Have you priced a regular plastic model car latelly ?  $30 +

And that's for a kit whose whose R&D and tooling costs were amortized during the Johnson or Nixon administrations!

[Jim N]

Along with others have stated, government regulations add between $3K - $5K to the cost of each car or truck.  The auto makers don't complain about this because it affects all of them and they pass the cost along.

The other thing to consider is the market you are buying.  When we bought our new car in December, the salesman told us that they cannot keep trucks and SUV's on the lot.  These are the vehicles a lot of people want and are driving the market.  I read an article recently that because of the shift in preferences to the trucks and SUV's that the number of car models that may be discontinued was rather staggering.  Basically all of the full sized cars may be discontinued and a number of the mid sized cars as well.

In our case, we bought my wife's 09 Impala new for about $25K.  In December, we bought a new 17 Malibu for under $18K.  Granted the Malibu is under the Impala as far as the Chevrolet hierarchy, but the dealer was in the mood to move cars.  We bought the Impala (same dealer) in June of 09 and they were not as interested in moving cars.

[Rob Hall]

CUVs and SUVs have been a growth market for several years now, projected to continue growing.  I've had SUVs since 1994 as my daily drivers..

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-autoshow-new-york-suvs/lured-by-rising-suv-sales-automakers-flood-market-with-models-idUSKBN1H50KI

[webestang]

FYI..... The sticker price for my 99 V6 (w/auto) Mustang was $18,500......$27,649 in todays dollar. A new base V6 (w/auto) 2017 Mustang is $26,380. 

[OldTrucker]

4 hours ago, cobraman said:

The high prices are why they now offer that long term financing. Sorry, not this guy.

The Chevy Dealer here calls them a car mortgage!

[Ace-Garageguy]

Don't forget middle-management bloat and insane compensation for high-level executives.

Mary Barra's (GM CEO) compensation package for 2015 was $28.6 million...                       

...for spouting nebulous feel-good business-speak gobbledygook like this: "GM envisions a world with zero crashes, to save lives; zero emissions, so future generations can inherit a healthier planet; and zero congestion, so customers get back a precious commodity -- time. She’s focused on strengthening GM’s core business of great cars, trucks and crossovers, while also working to lead the transformation of personal mobility through advanced technologies like connectivity, electrification, autonomous driving and car sharing. Barra has also established a strategic direction based on putting the customer at the center of everything the company does."

That makes her cut at around $10 per vehicle sold in the US market by GM. In an industry that will shave 1/2 cent per vehicle in quality of materials or engineering to make a few more bucks, you'd kinda think they'd see that kind of executive compensation as a colossal waste.

But no. Ohhhhh...a female CEO. Whoopeeegeewhizz. Gotta take that PC stance, you know.

Oh yeah...they're looking at paying out $10 BILLION for that little switch problem. Gotta get it somewhere...

Edited March 30, 2018 by Ace-Garageguy