Well it’s finally announced.😦

[Rob Hall]

2 minutes ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

 

You could truthfully say I know considerably more about the subject than most of the opinion-posters.

 

Yeah, riiiighht..if you are such a self-important know it all, then why don't you get a job with one of the automakers rather than hanging out here?

[Ace-Garageguy]

1 minute ago, Rob Hall said:

Yeah, riiiighht..if you are such a self-important know it all, then why don't you get a job with one of the automakers rather than hanging out here?

Why do you inevitably default to this exact kind of personal attack?

Make a reasoned argument, drawing on something other than whatever it is that fuels your hate.

[Rob Hall]

2 minutes ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

Why do you inevitably default to this exact kind of personal attack?

Make a reasoned argument, drawing on something other than whatever it is that fuels your hate.

No attack, just stating the obvious.

[Ace-Garageguy]

Sometimes, you just have to laugh.   

[Plowboy]

28 minutes ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

This is a hoot. Really. I've been involved in alt-fuel projects and organizations off and on since 1974 (when it became pretty obvious to anyone who was awake that fossil fuels as we knew them were on the way out), and have stayed current on the tech and the legislation, have actually done early EV and propane and CNG conversions, and have had the opportunity to drive many of the current offerings because one shop I'm associated with repairs them.

You could truthfully say I know considerably more about the subject than most of the opinion-posters.

But as I'm all too aware, actual knowledge and experience mean nothing to a certain mindset.

EDIT: As shown by the continuous ha-ha emoticons. Never a valid or at least thought-out argument.

 

How many current EV's have you worked on? Not one's from 1974. Current. I'm guessing none as current EV's are still under warranty. 

[Ace-Garageguy]

3 minutes ago, Plowboy said:

How many current EV's have you worked on? Not one's from 1974. Current. I'm guessing none as current EV's are still under warranty. 

Never said I "worked" on them. That's what you read into what I wrote.

I actually said I'd driven many of the current offerings because I have access to them after repairs...but it's a BODY SHOP.

Body repairs aren't under warranty, nor are they dealer-mandated...but shops must be OEM certified.

There. All better now?

[Plowboy]

8 minutes ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

Never said I "worked" on them. That's what you read into what I wrote.

I actually said I'd driven many of the current offerings because I have access to them after repairs...but it's a BODY SHOP.

Body repairs aren't under warranty, nor are they dealer-mandated...but shops must be OEM certified.

There. All better now?

I guess I read too much into "involved". Driving an EV after a body shop you're associated with after repairs only gives you the experience of driving one. Unless one owns or has worked on an EV, they don't have much knowledge about them.  

[Ace-Garageguy]

13 minutes ago, Plowboy said:

...Unless one owns or has worked on an EV, they don't have much knowledge about them.  

By your logic, that would disqualify anyone posting here, including you presumably.

But you're also mistaken in your assumption, again.

Ever heard of the Society of Automotive Engineers? I get all their publications, read the relevant papers, and keep abreast of the tech.

Who else here has that level of information at hand?

EDIT: One more time, I'M NOT ANTI-EV. They have a place in a rational vehicle mix. But they're not the savior of the planet, like we're being sold.

Edited August 18, 2022 by Ace-Garageguy

[StevenGuthmiller]

 

1 hour ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

More prudent to just ignore the endless rebleatings of this same tired line.

We get it. You're the hip-happening-know-everything-future-looking kinda guy all us old fossils are jealous of, and anybody who criticizes any current trend, no matter how hopelessly misguided, is too old and past it to take seriously.

Stay awesome.

And as is the usual case, rather than join in on the conversation and offer your opinions, better just to denigrate those that are partaking in the discussion.

You know, the "usual crowd" who just want to throw a grenade into the the middle of a topic that THEY don't want to talk about.

If you don't want to engage in the discussion,  then don't!

 

 

 

Steve

[Ace-Garageguy]

3 minutes ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

 

And as is the usual case, rather than join in on the conversation and offer your opinions, better just to denigrate those that are partaking in the discussion.

You know, the "usual crowd" who just want to throw a grenade into the the middle of a topic that THEY don't want to talk about.

If you don't want to engage in the discussion,  then don't!

Steve

Is this directed at me?

[StevenGuthmiller]

1 hour ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

Sometimes, you just have to laugh.   

Sure do......if it's funny.

 

 

 

Steve

[StevenGuthmiller]

1 minute ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

Is this directed at me?

Absolutely not.

It's directed at the inevitable bomb throwers who have no interest in the topic, but just want to disrupt the conversation by calling anyone who does a "self important know it all".

 

 

 

Steve

[Tabbysdaddy]

3 hours ago, Claude Thibodeau said:

HI!

I remember the inventor of the first micro-wave oven saying something to the effect that "any invention spreads like wildfire as soon as the guy next door clearly grasps what the damn thing will do to enhance his daily life". Nowaday, do you know many people who avoid having a micro-wave oven in the kitchen?

I also remember historians and civilizations experts wondering why remnants of huge cities buried under the canopy in tropical jungles seemed to indicate that the residents somehow seemed to have "vanished overnight". What happened? UFO's taking them away? Pademic? Ethnic cleansing?

Then, someone posited there may have been a major event, out of control, that forced them to move away?  Major drought, maybe? You tell me...

Let's see: can you imagine, say, major southwest urban mega-cities  staying populated once they "run out of water", or the Colorado runs dry? Far fetched? Maybe. 

My point is not gloom... Just that to go back to the micro-wave guy, once a thing impact you so much, positively or negatively, you tend to reconsider the way you deal with it. 

Also consider that the fossil fuel industries, faced with possible "reduction in demand" for their core product, will wisely try to: A- fight back, and B- develop alternative products. In their case, it already exists: PLASTICS (amongst which is our cherished styrene!!!) . On this front, the green lobby is also vere agressive. 

Interesting times ahead, wouldn't you say?

Just my two cents...

CT 

I don't allow microwaves in my house. They make my tin foil hat vibrate.

[iamsuperdan]

1 hour ago, espo said:

Based on looks alone I would consider trading my Charger for this, just needs a Hemi. Now if we could just get one of the model builders to offer this in 1/25th form, I have a few Hemis in the stash that I would use to build a model of this. Just can't beat these guys for body styling in my mind. 

 

Willing to bet we see it available in an .stl file for the 3D printers very soon. Would not surprise me to learn that several people were working on it now.

[tbill]

Well, here is my two pennies, I have a couple hundred hours worth of training for EV platforms, have driven them and work on them. As previously noted, they have a place in the world, are they the perfect solution, no. My concern is the voltage levels involved, and the potential for injury/death to people who will want to poke around under the hood with no idea of what’s what ( hold my beer while I cut this orange cable), not to mention the possibility of all manner of things that can go wrong with a loss of high voltage isolation, yes, there are plenty of systems in place to negate/mitigate these situations, but if you’ve worked on cars for any length of time, you will see things that have happened that are seemingly impossible .

 

[von Zipper]

120 years ago there were alot of people in the petroleum industry that were dead set against gasoline/internal combustion engines because they were afraid it would effect their kerosene sales.

[Plowboy]

53 minutes ago, Ace-Garageguy said:

By your logic, that would disqualify anyone posting here, including you presumably.

But you're also mistaken in your assumption, again.

Ever heard of the Society of Automotive Engineers? I get all their publications, read the relevant papers, and keep abreast of the tech.

Who else here has that level of information at hand?

EDIT: One more time, I'M NOT ANTI-EV. They have a place in a rational vehicle mix. But they're not the savior of the planet, like we're being sold.

Exactly to your first statement. What I know about EV's would fit in a gnat's rearend sideways. Right now, they're the great unknown to pretty much everyone. It's no different than the people that just knew a microwave wouldn't work. 

As to your next statement, that still doesn't give you experience. Experience is what counts no matter the field. My dad always said, "You can read a book about driving a nail with a hammer. But, until you grab a hammer and a nail, you don't know much about it". But, he was one that knew a microwave couldn't possibly work. Until my brother bought one for him.

I agree that EV's aren't the magic bullet that everyone's hoping for. But, we have to start somewhere. We'll never know if we never try. There's no greater ignorance than doing nothing. This is the only planet we have. For too long people haven't cared and have left it to the next generation. As long as it doesn't happen in their lifetime, they don't care. That old way of thinking is why we are where we are. Personally, I want better for my children and grandchildren. 

Edited August 18, 2022 by Plowboy

[vintagerpm]

3 hours ago, stitchdup said:

except it wasn't done naturally. the oil industry pushed for internal combustion over ev. in the earliest days electric cars were just as popular as ic. and most power stations then were coal, and close to population centres so there was a lot of illness produced by the smog. internal combustion was sold as the cleaner power for cars because there was less visable smog initially, and by the time we realised there was jst as much smog the choice was made and it was too late. If you look back at early photos of cities with cars, more than half are electric

I was refering to car vs horse, not gas vs electric vs steam.

[Ace-Garageguy]

11 minutes ago, Plowboy said:

...This is the only planet we have. For too long people haven't cared and have left it to the next generation. As long as it doesn't happen in their lifetime, they don't care. That old way of thinking is why we are where we are. Personally, I want better for my children and grandchildren. 

Then why don't you educate yourself about the existing technology that's capable of removing, capturing, and recycling carbon dioxide from natural-gas and coal-burning plants' exhaust plumes, and get vocal about mandating THAT? Because for the foreseeable future, "renewables" simply are not going to be able to keep up with ever increasing loads on the grid from electric vehicles.

We have 200 or more years-worth of coal right here in the good old USA, we don't need to buy it from anybody outside, and it CAN be 100% carbon-neutral.

Many localities are already experiencing the false promise of relying on renewables at our CURRENT demand level, both here and abroad, they're looking back at coal and nuclear, and a little open-minded research into FACTS concerning global energy usage might give you a better perspective on what needs to be done.

Edited August 18, 2022 by Ace-Garageguy
CLARITY

[vintagerpm]

2 hours ago, Plowboy said:

I keep seeing the phrase "forced on". NO ONE is forcing anyone to buy an EV! You don't want one? It's simple, DON'T BUY ONE!!! We're a long long way from going totally to EV's. So, get over it. The sky isn't falling!

I find it very amusing that there's so many EV "experts" on this forum. Somehow, they know all about them. But, don't own one, probably haven't seen one in person and have never driven one. 

Have you not been paying attention? California (2035), the US (2035), and the UK (2030) have set dates after which it will be illegal to sell new gasoline or diesel powered cars.

[mikemodeler]

I stayed in a Holiday Inn Express last night, does that make me qualified to comment?

[Plowboy]

3 minutes ago, vintagerpm said:

Have you not been paying attention? California (2035), the US (2035), and the UK (2030) have set dates after which it will be illegal to sell new gasoline or diesel powered cars.

So, the billions of current ICE vehicles in the world will magically disappear in 2035? 

[Ace-Garageguy]

2 minutes ago, Plowboy said:

So, the billions of current ICE vehicles in the world will magically disappear in 2035? 

The average lifespan of a car is figured to be 10-12 years before they're junked.

That means that by 2045-2047, the vast majority will be gone.

[iBorg]

6 minutes ago, Plowboy said:

So, the billions of current ICE vehicles in the world will magically disappear in 2035? 

My concern is they won't disappear but the cost of gas will be prohibitive. What this means is those who can only afford a used petro car will be forced to feed it expensive fuel. This could lead to a cycle of only being able to afford expensive transportation.

 

[Richard Bartrop]

3 hours ago, iamsuperdan said:

Although fake engine noise is dumb, it does sound cool. And apparently Dodge make it just as loud as a Hellcat can be. 126db.

 

Looks pretty good too.  I'm guessing for production, the mirrors will grow and the wheels will change.

 

 

Visually, it's a big improvement on the current Charger.  I like it.