AMT kits suck!

[Can-Con]

32 minutes ago, 89AKurt said:

 Their Ferrari 250 SWB fits the topic, but I adapted.  I've built some other brand worse quality kits, takes skill and time to make a decent model, that's all.

That's actually an old reboxed Esci kit there Kurt.

[Force]

I have to add this to the discusion.
Just because one kit gives you trouble doesn't mean all kits from that manufacturer are bad, I have been doing models for close to 50 years now and we have all been there, of course some kits are trying to beat you down as some are bad and some are worse, but there aren't many kits I have given up on yet...and for sure no AMT kit and I have gone through a few.
Back when I started building car models the majority of what I bought and built was AMT and MPC kits, some Monogram and some Revell and Jo-Han and I think I have only given up on one kit so far due to poor fitment and maybe lack of skills back then, it was an old Revell modified kit based on the Orange Crate called Chopped Deuce, the original Orange Crate is not an easy kit and this was worse
So if I would have stopped buying kits from manufacturers because of one or two bad kits they have I would have left this hobby a long time ago as I wouldn't have had something to buy, you just have to percivere and overcome the problems, if it fights you, lay it aside and let it be for a while and come back to it later.
AMT for sure has some gems when it comes to kits, you just have to find them, even tho' all AMT tooling has some years on it and the newest was developed about 20 years ago, because very few new AMT kits has been done since the early 2000's, but the latest ones are really good.
I kitbash a lot and rarely build a kit like it was supposed to be built and I do the models as I want them, so I often change engines, wheels and other stuff and you have to make the parts fit the model you are working on because they are not supposed to be there from the beginning, so I'm used to fight to get it to work and some bad fitting parts in the kit and vague instructions doesn't bother me much nowadays, I just have to find ways to overcome the difficulties...and most important, you have to have patience and work slow.

When we talk about tires in kits, very few kits I have bought has rubber tires, most of the tires in the kits I have in my pile (wich are quite large by now) are vinyl of some sort and the only car kits I have built with rubber tires are kits from the far east likeTamiya, Fujimi, Hasegawa, Aoshima.
The later truck kits from Italeri has soft rubber like tires tho'.
Some of the early truck kits from Revell Germany also had rubber like tires but those tires has a problem of dry rot so they are going bad over time and are worthless.

Edited December 25, 2020 by Force

[Ace-Garageguy]

8 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

...I demand that the kit bends to my will, not the other way around.

Pretty much my philosophy concerning most, if not all, physical endeavors.

I also find it helpful to remember remind myself that, theoretically anyway, I'm smarter than whatever it is I'm working on.    

 

Edited December 24, 2020 by Ace-Garageguy

[vintagerpm]

Hated AMT kits back in the '60s & '70s. Sure not going to build a repop of those old kits today.

 

[DRIPTROIT 71]

10 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

I suppose I'm just getting too old, but it's always been my opinion that subject matter is the most important factor in choosing a model.

Model building has become more to me than just following the instructions and gluing part A to part B.

It's more of an exercise in creativity, and I really care little about pins or tabs or how well the parts fit.

Steve 

I agree! Even when I was a kid model building was about subject matter for me. That is why now a large part of my builds use aftermarket resin parts, cabs, hoods, etc.,  because many of the subjects I am interested in building are not available as a plastic kit. 

I recognize that some folks just want to build a kit from the box and they can make a beautiful model that way. There is nothing wrong with that.

As for myself, engineering something to reflect a real subject is what I enjoy. Again as this thread began about the KW kit I myself am speaking of bid rigs, so I have been thankful to see Round 2 re-release these old AMT kits.

[Classicgas]

11 hours ago, StevenGuthmiller said:

I suppose I'm just getting too old, but it's always been my opinion that subject matter is the most important factor in choosing a model.

Granted, my skills have improved as I've progressed in the hobby and I suppose that I might be in the minority in my view that if it's a subject that I want to build, I can deal with a kit's inadequacies.

The absolutely most rewarding work I do is to take a sub-par kit, (by today's standards) and re-engineer and re-build it to meet the standards of today.

 

Model building has become more to me than just following the instructions and gluing part A to part B.

It's more of an exercise in creativity, and I really care little about pins or tabs or how well the parts fit.

 

I take great pride in the fact that my models stand out on the show table because I know that the educated modeler knows what went into re-engineering a simple, "poorly fitting" vintage kit to make it as good, or better, than all of the "perfectly" engineered kits that share the table with it.

Personally, I have nothing but affection for all of my old AMT kits because, A; they offer many alternatives of subjects that nobody else offers, and B; because I'm not afraid of them.

I demand that the kit bends to my will, not the other way around.

 

 

 

Steve 

I completely agree. My builds are nowhere near Steve's quality, but I learn and try to improve with each. David,  No American kit manufacturer has "rubber" tires, they are all vinyl. Japanese kits offer something more like rubber. The tires in the Revell/Monogram big rig kits are worse than the AMT kits imo. I built this Revellogram Kenworth, a snap kit, and ended up removing most tabs, etc because they were a mismatch, and interfered with proper fit and the tires and rims fit very loosely together. I also built a Polar Light's Bobby Allison 69 Cyclone kit, for a review in Scale Auto that was never published,  a kit tooled in the early 2000s, probably the worst kit I have ever built. Nothing fit correctly but it turned out well enough. . Here is a pic of the kenworth. and the Cyclone

Edited December 24, 2020 by Classicgas

[peteski]

From my interactions with David my opinion of him is that he likes instant gratification, and wants everything to be super-easy, just falling in place without any effort.  Great idea in theory, but in practice that doesn't work out so well.  Plus many of us actually enjoy the challenges that kit building or any advanced techniques (like designing and printing decals) present us with.  That is how a mediocre modeler becomes an advanced modeler.  Plus those learned skills can come in handy in other aspects of our lives.

[Classicgas]

No kit, including Tamiya and Hasegawa is THAT simple.

[Tom Geiger]

8 minutes ago, peteski said:

he likes instant gratification, and wants everything to be super-easy, just falling in place without any effort.  

I believe that’s called a puzzle

[iamsuperdan]

If I wanted simple, I'd just go buy diecast. 

Personally, I like the challenges of building something. And even though I will curse up a storm and swear that I'll never buy another kit from a manufacturer, I even enjoy the "bad" kits. Yeah, they require a lot more work to get them presentable, but it does feel pretty good when I finish fighting some awful kit, and I look at it on the shelf and think to myself, "Well, that's not bad." Then I curse and swear and say never again and then go build something that fits a little better and requires less cleanup.

The only kit I've ever given up on because of the quality is the AMT Superstones Ford kit. Nothing fit right on that one. It's currently sitting, about 3/4 done. I'll probably finish it one day. Probably.

[JollySipper]

If you want a good AMT kit, the '60 Starliner couldn't be a better kit......

 

[BlackSheep214]

19 minutes ago, JollySipper said:

If you want a good AMT kit, the '60 Starliner couldn't be a better kit......

 

That is a very nice build. I’ve been wanting to get the Starliner kit for ages.

[Doug 1061]

To say this kit sucks is a bit of a stretch.   I picked up this W925 at a swap meet at my LHS.  It's an original from the early 70s.  That tool was pretty sloppy even back then.   I had to walk away from it several times,  I like to keep 2 or 3 builds going at a time so if one gets frustrating I can work on something else.    Build a Revell '59 Ford Skyliner then nothing will seem difficult.   The only reason that one didn't get kicked under the rear tire of my truck and peeled out on was cause it belonged to a late friend and I was building it for him.   That W925 comes up nice with a bit of patience and perseverance and a set of Moebius big rig tires.   I am happy with how mine came out.

[Dave Van]

Botcott ALL AMT kits and you cut the kits available by about 50%......

I enjoy all kits in one way or another. I like to MAKE them look good. And I have fun. 

box stock other than tires.

 

[Classicgas]

Wow!  I hope mine is half as nice.  Doug, what troubles did you have?  Mine is going quite well. 

Edited December 24, 2020 by Classicgas

[Doug 1061]

12 minutes ago, Classicgas said:

Wow!  I hope mine is half as nice.  Doug, what troubles did you have?  Mine is going quite well. 

Lee, there was the usual sloppy fit of some of the parts.  Biggest thing for me was the cab and hood sat too high.  To remedy this I cut through the rear cab mount with a razor saw so the cab would sit down on the frame rails,  dropped it roughly 1/8 in..  That required having to cut the front cab mounts down to match.   Then had to rework the hood hinges to match.  It kinda snowballs from there a bit since I had to grind a bit of the frame out where the radiator mounts and whittle some off the bottom of the radiator and sand some off the top of it to clear the hood.  Also have to alter the exhaust since the stacks are now a bit lower, and I believe the steering linkage.   Can't remember on the battery box, think it was OK.   Biggest pain was the hood hinges/radiator fitment.  Pretty much whatever I had to do to make it work.  Also the small vertical part of the air intake tube in front of the intake turbo..    It was a good bit of extra work but I feel it was worth it in the end.  Hope this helps.  

[JollySipper]

1 hour ago, BlackSheep214 said:

That is a very nice build. I’ve been wanting to get the Starliner kit for ages.

Thanks, Man.... That kit comes with two complete engines as well as a few custom goodies.....

[ZTony8]

I see the problem as evaluating an old tool through current standards. I, like many of us, thought those kits were fine back then. We had nothing else. But through the years of incremental improvements ( and experiencing Tamiya kits)we acclimated to a higher standard of quality. Now many of those old tools seem impossibly crude.

[ZTony8]

22 hours ago, Greg Myers said:

David, try one of these classic Revell kits. I think you will be immensely happy with your experience.

Tongue firmly planted in cheek, Greg? 

Edited December 24, 2020 by ZTony8

[El Roberto]

As a mostly aircraft and armor builder I'm a little jaded.

  Compared to modern kits by Airfix, Tamiya, Hasagawa, Dragon, Ming, etc.  most car kits suck.  The engineering is sad as well as the fit and details, The Autocar dump truck I'm working on is a perfect example, the part numbers on the instruction sheet don't match the part numbers on the sprue.    There are, of course, exceptions.  Some of the newest car kits are excellent and I've build some simply awful aircraft models.   

Yeah, I get the arguments that a skilled modeler can make anything look good, but that's a "skilled" modeler.  Why putz around with crappy fit and engineering before getting to the fun part...painting and finishing and weathering.  . 

Edited December 24, 2020 by El Roberto

[Classicgas]

1 hour ago, Doug 1061 said:

Lee, there was the usual sloppy fit of some of the parts.  Biggest thing for me was the cab and hood sat too high.  To remedy this I cut through the rear cab mount with a razor saw so the cab would sit down on the frame rails,  dropped it roughly 1/8 in..  That required having to cut the front cab mounts down to match.   Then had to rework the hood hinges to match.  It kinda snowballs from there a bit since I had to grind a bit of the frame out where the radiator mounts and whittle some off the bottom of the radiator and sand some off the top of it to clear the hood.  Also have to alter the exhaust since the stacks are now a bit lower, and I believe the steering linkage.   Can't remember on the battery box, think it was OK.   Biggest pain was the hood hinges/radiator fitment.  Pretty much whatever I had to do to make it work.  Also the small vertical part of the air intake tube in front of the intake turbo..    It was a good bit of extra work but I feel it was worth it in the end.  Hope this helps.  

Actually I was referring to your 59 ford

[Classicgas]

1 hour ago, JollySipper said:

Thanks, Man.... That kit comes with two complete engines as well as a few custom goodies.....

? I have the first issue.  One engine. 

[JollySipper]

26 minutes ago, Classicgas said:

? I have the first issue.  One engine. 

This issue has two FE engines with choices for induction

 

[Classicgas]

Didn't know that.  Cool. 

[Chuck Most]

Lofty expectations for a fifty year old kit, wouldn't you say?